Both the DriClime and the Vapour are really great for high energy activities in cool to cold weather conditions. Both are approx a 100wt fleece + windshirt in terms of warmth.

DriClime Advatages: The DriClime is a bit lighter than the Vapour Jacket even if you factor in the weight of the hood. The DriClime dries more quickly when it gets soaked, and the bipolar wicking makes it feel dry on the inside more quickly that the Rab in my experience.

Rab Vapour Advatages: Has a wire stiffened hood which is very nice. Sleeves are extra wide which makes it easy to push up over my elbows extending it's thermal comfort range. I find the Vapour to be more breathable than the DriClime... and also more water resistant. I find that the Vapour is a bit warmer than the DriClime.

More at Mark's thought on "softshells"

Thanks Mark, that was very helpful (and I've learned a lot from your excellent website). Can you share a little more specifics about activity level and temperature range in which you use the Rab Vapour-Rise, and how it functions under or over other garments? Also, have you tried the pants?

In addition, where did you get your jacket? Rab isn't widely available in the U.S.

Also Mark, how's the sizing? You wrote on your site that the Rab Vapour Rise Trail Jacket "runs narrow." I'm 6 ft tall, 185 lbs, slim fit build with a 42 in. chest and typically wear a men's size Large jacket. Would I need to size up?

*Temp Range*

As I have said earlier in this thread... different people need different levels of insulation. I find the warmth of the Vapour Rising to be approx the same as a good 100wt fleece and a unlined wind shirt.

I have been good down to around 25F snowshoeing wearing fleece hat, softshell gloves, a short sleeve tech-tee (or featherweight long sleeve shirt), and Schoeller Dryskin pants. I have been OK, but on the cool side when engaging in snow play or down hill skiing when the temp was around 30F.

I will be a bit warm but ok to around 50F wearing it unzipped, arms pushed up, with a tech-tee and nylon hiking pants. Modest walking speed on level ground it's ok to around 60F for me.

*Over/Under*

Works fine with a belay jacket over it. Typically don't put things under it. I have periodically warm my thermawrap vest under it which worked ok.

*Pants*

No experience. My legs typically don't need a lot of protection.

*Sizing*

You are approx my size and build. I would suggest L would work. I have an XL and it is a bit too big for my taste.

*Where Buy*

I ordered it from the UK. I think I got it was from a Jackson Sports' clearance sale a couple of years ago.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=220149255161&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=012

The R1 Hoody is listed on the Patagonia websites (US and Europe). The design is changed, the zipper is not offset, and the fabric is recycled. Is it as good as the old one? I never had the old one myself so time will tell.

BTW, I had to do a search for Hoody on the European site, couldn't find it browsing.

Zipper is offset in new model. See Patagonia site/details page.

I called Patagonia. They said that if their page says "out of stock", then they are not sure if it will be introduced again.

Has anyone found their new R1 to be itchy? It took about 6 washings for this to go away.

I haven't gotten mine yet, I ordered it yesterday. The description does say it's offset but the photo shows nothing of the sort. Oh, well.
http://www.patagonia.com/web/eu/search/esearch.jsp?OPTION=ESEARCH&N=0&Ntt=hoody&search.x=0&search.y=0

I got mine on Friday. It is offset, from the neck up. Hood has great head coverage. Can't wait to try it out when temps go down, curious to find out what the temp and wind limits are for this thing. The fit is slim but it leaves room for a base layer under if desired. I love Patagonia.

Hey there, any of you good folks still looking for an R1 Hoody?

My local gear shop just got a bunch in. I bought one over my lunch break today because of all the praise it had been getting here. (Yes, the zipper is still offset.)

If any of you are having trouble finding one, just let me know and I can pick one up and mail it to you. They're $117, but I get a 10% discount.

You guys were right: it's a pretty sweet piece of gear!

Dave

my local mtneering store has one on small and medium on hold in my size. I'm going in tomorrow night to try them on. I think a lot of stores just got their shipments in.

Picked one up tonight. Men's small fit better the medium but it was close. 10.41oz/295g.

Very nice piece. Should be wearing it starting tomorrow night for a hike of Culebra on Saturday. My wife is jealous of the ninja look.

Anyone ever use the R1 pants? What's their comfort range?

Base: Patagonia Capilene or GoLite C-Thru (silkweight, tops and bottoms)
Intermediate: Mountain Hardwear Power Stretch long sleeve zip tee
Insulation: Patagonia Micro Puff vest, Burton Heaters pullover, lightweight polyester fill in general (I want a BMW Cocoon someday)
Button down shirt: Ex Officio Airstrip Lite, Columbia Silver Ridge long sleeve
Windshirt: Montane Lite-Speed, Marmot Ion
Wind pants: Hind Microlite
Pants: REI Sahara zip-offs, Ex Officio Amphipants, discontinued REI heavy-ish nylon pants, Mountain Hardwear Pack Pants.
Shorts: Gramicci Quick Dry, Ex Officio, REI Sahara
Rain: Marmot Precip, SMD Gatewood Cape
Socks: Patagonia Capilene, Wigwam Merino wool, various Coolmax
Gloves: Mountain Hardwear Tempest, Pearl Izumi bicycle gloves, Petzl Cordex Light Belay (leather and synthetic hybrid)
Hats: Tilley T4, Outdoor Research Peruvian Windstopper, Sugoi fleece beanie, Outdoor Research Sun Runner, Orvis wide-brimmed nylon sun hat

Other favorites: Marmot Driclime Windshirt, generic Polarfleece 200 pullover/sweater, Columbia Falmouth shelled fleece.

Currently evaluating: REI One softshell

Edited by dwambaugh on 10/01/2007 20:51:29 MDT.

Ok, digging up this old but still fundamental post for a minor quibble.

On paper the chart suggests a hooded windshirt and a hoody is an ideal combo, because you can adjust both hood + sleeves.

In practice, I can only just push up the sleeves of the two windshirts (Montbell UL unhooded windshirt and Patagonia Houdini July 2007) I own with nothing underneath. It's not fantastically comfortable, and I don't think I've got unusually thick arms. Add even a thin long sleeved baselayer to the mix, and getting both up isn't really doable, let alone thicker sleeves like on the R1 which are extra long and almost too thick to get up even when worn alone. Plus then you've got several times the insulation sitting over your upper arms anyway, which I'm not sure is accounted for.

Partly for this reason I tend to settle on the R2 Vest under my windshirt, it's full front zip gives it good venting relative to it's area. But perhaps there are windshirts that are easier to push up the sleeves on that the two I mentioned?

...(there's always a but on this forum)

But I'd say the ever-present windshirt may be needed when there's no wind but a lot of radiation. After seeing two friends die agonizing deaths from melanoma it's long-sleeved shirts, side brimmed hats and SPF 50+ sunscreen for me.

However a windshirt may be way too hot so a light shirt like an REI Sahara or Mojave or Cabela's Guidewear fishing shirt should be in the hot weather/ high altitude clothing list.

Eric

First, a thank you for the work and critical thinking that is in this and similar BPL discussions. My one thought is about clo/oz. values. Down and synthetic lofting insulators have significantly higher clo/oz. than polartec, capilene or wool fabric insulators. But, a jacket or shirt can be made out polartec, capilene or wool fabric alone; down and polarguard require a nylon outer and inner layer of material to keep them in place. Do the clo/oz. values of down and other lofting insulators take into account the weight of the necessary 1.4 oz ripstop polyester layers (two -- inner and outer)? This seems to me to be the only way to accurately compare clo/oz. values in the real world.