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Daniel Gillespie
(danielg715) - MLife

Locale: Boston, USA
HMG Ultramid & MLD Duomid: Couple's use? on 02/23/2014 17:41:15 MST Print View

I'm contemplating getting a new shelter for trips with my girlfriend, primarily in very exposed alpine areas. I'm heavily leaning toward a cuben 'mid for weather-resistance. However, the girlfriend has requested ability to sleep side by side (also getting a twin quilt) and complete floor/netting for bugs. Given that I'm looking at the HMG Ultramid2 and the MLD Duomid, so had a couple questions.

1. On the duomid, any opinions on the Inverted V pitch with 4 trekking poles and an innernet? How does livibility for 2 feel in this shelter pitched that way? Any concerns about strength/weather-resistance with that pitch, particularly if using carbon fiber poles? In general the duomid seems small for 2, so wanted to better understand.

2. On the Ultramid the math on the Inverted V seems to stop working, unless using some pretty beefy poles. Given it is larger, is it possible to sleep 2 on one side of the center pole? Math would say there's about 41" which isn't really enough for 2 20" pads - is it possible to offset the pole a bit and make that work?

3. Anyone found an innernet they like for the Ultramid2? If the 2 person setup described above worked I'd be interested in a "half-size" net, but curious in general what people are looking at or using for the Ultramid?

Appreciate any thoughts, thanks!

Travis Higdon
(life-goes-on) - M

Locale: PNW
Ultamid 2 on 02/23/2014 21:03:44 MST Print View

I recently bought an Ultamid 2 for two person use. With one person on either side of a center pole, the Ultamid 2 is massive. Since we frequently have a lot of winter and/or climbing gear and it rains a lot in the PNW, we really like the extra space. I was concerned that the Duomid would be too small in this regard.

However, we do not share sleeping gear. Your situation is unique in that you may find more room in the Duomid pitched with V poles given that you'll have basically one 40" wide pad and a single large quilt. To do this in the Ultamid would take some massive poles, but it could be done. You can easily offset the center pole in the Ultamid to make one side larger, but not that much larger. I think you'd find more room in the center of a V configuration in a smaller mid like the Duomid than way off to the side of an Ultamid.

The Duomid has a net tent sized for it available from MLD. http://www.mountainlaureldesigns.com/shop/product_info.php?cPath=47&products_id=127

Currently there is no net tent made for the Ultamid line. I contacted HMG and they seemed very eager to work with me on making one though I haven't done that yet. Others have suggested a custom net tent from BPWD (you can get an idea here: http://bearpawwd.com/shelters_floors/pyraNet2.html). I'll probably have HMG build one for me before bug season.

Dan Durston
(dandydan) - M

Locale: Cascadia
Mids 4 Two on 02/23/2014 21:17:06 MST Print View

DuoMid for 2 is awfully small - especially with an inner net tent. I haven't tried it, but I have a DuoMid and I know my wife wouldn't be impressed if I brought it along for the two of us. Great solo shelter though with a solo inner in the back half.

When you go from 1 person to 2, you want a lot bigger mid because a two occupants can't both be centered under the high point.

Edited by dandydan on 02/23/2014 21:19:40 MST.

John Harper
(johnnyh88) - M

Locale: The SouthWest
Re: HMG Ultamid on 02/23/2014 21:28:25 MST Print View

See this post:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=81323

Anthony is using two poles in an inverted V on his Ultamid. The poles don't extend out to the edges of the tarp, but they don't have to. Maybe with some pole extenders, you could make an inverted V of suitable width?

If you are open to silnylon, look at the Black Diamond Megalight which only weighs 25 oz. A couple sharing a quilt could sleep on one side of the pole with this mid (especially if you angle the pole a bit) leaving the other half for a giant vestibule.

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: HMG Ultramid & MLD Duomid: Couple's use? on 02/23/2014 21:37:07 MST Print View

If you're only going to be using the inner for sleeping, then you could get away with a custom double bivy, half netting and a higher netting hang than normal netting, if that makes any sense. Then an inverted pole setup with an Ultamid could work, since you wouldn't need to separate the poles to the edges (per the previous post referring to another post from Anthony).

Travis Higdon
(life-goes-on) - M

Locale: PNW
The more I think about it... on 02/23/2014 22:04:08 MST Print View

Given your requirements, if I were going to push two 20" pads together and share a quilt I'd probably go with a Zpacks Duplex. It has what you need in terms of bug protection and floor, plus it has two doors. It may not provide the storm protection of a mid in certain circumstances, but pretty darn close.

Bradford Rogers
(Mocs123) - MLife

Locale: Southeast Tennessee
Re: HMG Ultramid & MLD Duomid: Couple's use? on 02/24/2014 17:15:20 MST Print View

For you to sleep two on one side of the pole have you considered the HMG Ultamid 4? (or lower cost a Golite Shangri-la 5, Oware Mid, or MLD Supermid?) The weight difference is minimal and you get a lot more room for sleeping and a separate vestibule/cooking area, not to mention tons of headroom. You also might consider a Oware Alphamid if you are looking for something smaller.

J P
(jpovs) - F - M

Locale: North Shore
Re: HMG Ultramid & MLD Duomid: Couple's use? on 02/24/2014 18:46:46 MST Print View

-

Edited by jpovs on 06/15/2014 13:57:37 MDT.

Daniel Gillespie
(danielg715) - MLife

Locale: Boston, USA
Re on 02/24/2014 18:58:19 MST Print View

Thanks for all the useful comments!

FYI, I'd been considering the Duplex. Looks like a very comfortable tent at amazing weight. My concern has been that marginal difference in wind-resistance would mean anxiety on longer off-trail trips in AK where some pretty extreme weather is possible, albeit not probable. For my own reassurance, I think I need to stick with shelters in the sort of "top tier" of weather-resistance.

I hadn't thought about the "inner inverted V" with the ultramid and an innernet/bivy smaller than the tarp. It feels like the math is still tough when using carbon poles as the added height puts ~10" more length requirement (~64" vs. ~72"). Seems like in a big wind (e.g., 50+mph) that would put them in danger of breaking? If not would be a lot more comfortable, though still trying to wrap my head around the massive footprint and cost relative to anything I've used before.

Bradford Rogers
(Mocs123) - MLife

Locale: Southeast Tennessee
Re: Re on 02/24/2014 19:59:17 MST Print View

I have used the Locus Gear C3's with the Golite Shangri-La 5 strapped together with cordage and it has always held fine, but I can see the concern. I recently got a deal on the HMG UltaMid 4, which I havent used yet. Yes, they are very similar shelters so I will sell one or the other, but I also got the pole straps that they sell and I will admit they are very very sturdy and keep the poles perfectly horizontal (which was one of the problems with my previous lashings). I think with the C3, Black Diamond, and some of the stronger carbon poles it would be solid (I used my C3's and lashing in Rocky Mtn NP this summer with no issues). I don't know if I would try it with weaker poles like the LT4s and strong winds.

The larger size is great for two people in poor weather, especially if you get stuck in the shelter for a while.

Stuart .
(lotuseater) - M

Locale: 40°N,-105°W (Near enough)
Russian dolls on 02/24/2014 21:23:18 MST Print View

But Josh, how do you get into or out of the inner sanctum? Might make a midnight pee run rather tricky:-) Good size comparison. I've thought of doing the same with my Duomid and Supermid.

To the OP, I have to say the Duomid is tight for two without the duo inner. Perhaps the Supermid with the duo inner in the back half of the shelter would make a better combination. The centre pole can be offset 18" or so without a problem. You'd have a comfortable sleeping area with a massive vestibule for less weight than the SL5 in that setup. For centre pole in the Supermid you can use two poles lashed together, but I prefer a 60" carbon fibre pole set from Ruta Locura.

Bradford Rogers
(Mocs123) - MLife

Locale: Southeast Tennessee
Re: Russian dolls on 02/25/2014 04:59:14 MST Print View

I don't know if a super mid is much lighter then a shangri la 5. My fly only is 29.2oz seam taped and the super mid is 24 oz before seam sealing and guy lines. It still might end up lighter but not by as much as one would initIally think. The Shangri la 5 is also bigger at 9.5ft x 9.5ft vs 8.9ft x 8.9ft and for the same price comes with a center pole and inner net that while heavy for backpacking is great for car camping if thAt is something you do also.

I had bear paw make me. Custom inner that was 9 ft by 4.5 ft and it is 18.1oz with a sil floor. I always thought the m MLD mids were too short with an inner

Stuart .
(lotuseater) - M

Locale: 40°N,-105°W (Near enough)
Re: Re: Russian dolls on 02/25/2014 08:01:29 MST Print View

@Bradford - agreed the weight difference between the SL5 fly and the Supermid tarp is negligible. The savings comes with the inner and pole. GoLite's combination is so overbuilt it pushes the overall weight to 5lb 10oz. Daniel asked for a setup for exposed Alpine conditions, including an inner net with floor. At that weight I'd suggest looking at a double wall tent like the Hilleberg Nallo 2.

The MLD duo innernet adds 13.5oz, and the RL 0.600 pole is 4.75oz. Add stakes and you're looking at a total package for the MLD Supermid that's below 3lb 4oz.

The tradeoff is an additional $270. However it's still a lot less expensive than an Ultamid.

Good point about BPWD - he can make a custom sized inner for Daniel's chosen mid.

Edited by lotuseater on 02/25/2014 10:16:16 MST.

Brian Johns
(bcutlerj) - M

Locale: NorCal
Trailstar? on 02/25/2014 19:24:51 MST Print View

Trailstar may be a little more windworthy and certain roomier for two than a duomid. Just a thought. Bearpaw WD could put something together for you I'm sure. Just another option, not that you aren't considering great ones already.

John Harper
(johnnyh88) - M

Locale: The SouthWest
Re: HMG Ultramid & MLD Duomid: Couple's use? on 02/26/2014 13:07:40 MST Print View

Well a mid for couples may have arrived. See MLD's facebook page for photos of a 7'x9' asymmetrical mid (pole height is 5.5' tall).

Here is what the post says:

"Prototype of a New Mid. It is asymmetrical, so 2/3's of space is behind the pole to fit two people. About 7' X 9', about 24oz in SIi, 15oz in Cuben. A bit shorter and smaller than the SuperMid and larger than the DuoMid. Door is on the wide side allows entry in the rain without getting your gear behind the pole wet. We will have a dedicated InnerNet for this one."

Looks great for 1 man + dog too.