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SPIRIDON Papapetroy
(spotlight) - F
Looking for a non clammy windshirt with hood. on 01/23/2014 07:04:32 MST Print View

I am interested in buying a non clammy windshirt with hood, that i can wear next to skin without a baselayer. I have tried the Marmot Driclime windshirt (not the one with the hood) but the interior feels clammy to me and i will propably sweat very easily. I think the Ether driclime windshirt with the hood is made of the same material in the interior, so i am looking for alternatives. I was thinking of the Mountain Equipment Ultratherm. Any other suggestions?

Robb Watts
(rwatts) - M

Locale: Western PA
Windshirt on 01/23/2014 07:53:10 MST Print View

I have a Montane Krypton which is great for cold weather use. It's a pertex shelled, hooded jacket with a very thin fleece lining (like Driclime). It is very tight fitting so I use it more as a mid-layer (I wear it over a long john top then add a non-hooded soft shell as needed). It is fine on it's own in cooler (not cold) weather but for warmer use I have an unlined Montane hooded wind shirt which is much more versatile (great piece, I use it and take it everywhere in the three kinder seasons).
You could use the lined version next to your skin but I don't think the unlined would be very comfortable.

Andrew Zajac
(AZajac)

Locale: South West
fabric testing on 01/23/2014 08:01:14 MST Print View

Check this recent thread out for some info on fabric breathability.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=86498

Do you think that the issue with the driclime is that the fleece layer makes it too warm and causes you to sweat? I honestly can't imagine that shirt not being breathable enough after talking to a few people who use it and love it.

Woubeir (from Europe)
(Woubeir) - F - MLife
Re: fabric testing on 01/23/2014 08:10:29 MST Print View

So that should be actually the first question: did you purposely chose a lined windshirt ?

Dale Wambaugh
(dwambaugh) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Re: Looking for a non clammy windshirt with hood. on 01/23/2014 09:14:06 MST Print View

You might find some sun protection oriented hoodies with a better next-to-skin feel, but I doubt you will find much in the way of UL nylon windshirts that are comfortable without a base layer.

Daryl Daryl
(lyrad1) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest, USA, Earth
Works for me. on 01/23/2014 09:46:58 MST Print View

I wear a hooded nylon wind breaker for sun and bug protection. When the weather is warm enough I wear nothing underneath it.....just as one might wear a lightweight summer shirt.

For this to work I find that the garment must fit loosely and breath very well.

From recent discussions about coffee filters and breathability I now know that I'm using garments that are on the most-breathable end of the spectrum and that I am giving up much of the wind-breaking capability of the garment.


My Patagonia Houdini comes close but the light nature of the fabric causes it to cling to my skin. Most of the windbreakers I have bought new don't breath well enough for my use.

Used windbreakers (made of about 2 ounce per square yard fabric) that have been washed many times are usually the ones that work best. The jacket works better after a few days on the trail because it stiffens from sweat-salt accumulation and that stiffening helps prevent clinging.

I can't give you a recommendation for a new one but I have found that the cheap ones ($20 or so) tend to breath better.

Edited by lyrad1 on 03/17/2014 18:18:34 MDT.

hwc 1954
(wcollings) - M
lined vs unlined on 01/23/2014 11:27:07 MST Print View

I have a Marmot Ether driclime hoody. Love it in cold conditions. It's the first top layer I reach for in winter to block the wind or add just a bit of warmth, for example, when hiking in a powerstretch fleece and it's not quite enough on the downhill leg. The driclime is not clammy at all, but it is a bit of an insulating layer.

For summer, I always grab a Trail Wind Hoody. Same basic thing, but completely unlined, just thin DWR-finished fabric. Very light, very breathable. All of the outdoor and running companies make one. At something like 5 ounces, packed in its own pocket, it is always in my pack.

SPIRIDON Papapetroy
(spotlight) - F
About Marmot Ether Driclime. on 01/23/2014 14:11:47 MST Print View

Can you provide some more info about fit/sizing? Your height/weight/chest perimeter and the size you wear?

Edited by spotlight on 01/23/2014 14:17:13 MST.

Mark Andrews
(buldogge) - F

Locale: Midwest
Re: About Marmot Ether Driclime. on 01/23/2014 14:22:29 MST Print View

I love my Ether (I also have a Driclime Windshirt)...

I'm 6'/41"/32"/180-185# and I wear a M.

It is the perfect layering tool to me. I layer it over a 200wt merino LS and a PowerStretch/PowerDry hoody and has taken me down to 0deg while moving.

I find it breathes and controls moisture well.

My 2c.

-Mark in St. Louis

Dale Wambaugh
(dwambaugh) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Re: lined windshirts on 01/23/2014 14:30:05 MST Print View

A couple caveats about lined windshirts:

1. You're stuck with the lining. I would rather have a spare base layer for more versatility/options. They aren't very light either.

2. Some lack features like hem drawstrings, elastic cuffs, pockets, etc. Check those details! For example, the Marmot DriClime windshirt has a very shirt-tail like hem and you can't seal it off when you would like to.

Consider working a fleecy vest into your kit. There have been Power Stretch and Power Dry vests produced as well as 100/200w versions. I have a Patagonia R1 pullover vest that mates perfectly with a windshirt. That gives the option of layering up with your base layer and you could still wear the vest alone with your windshirt to keep the fabric off your torso if your base layer is wet, etc.

Max Dilthey
(mdilthey) - M

Locale: MaxTheCyclist.com
BPL Mascot on 01/23/2014 14:36:46 MST Print View

Daryl,

You have my vote for BPL mascot with that photo.

SPIRIDON Papapetroy
(spotlight) - F
Driclime sizing. on 01/23/2014 14:39:00 MST Print View

Mark do you wear the same size in the Ether and the Windshirt? I ask because according to Marmot website, the Ether has an athletic fit and the windshirt has a regular one. I have tried the windshirt and small was my size.

John Harper
(johnnyh88) - M

Locale: The SouthWest
Re: Looking for a non clammy windshirt with hood on 01/23/2014 14:40:15 MST Print View

You might consider:

Rab Boreas
Montane Mountain Star
Mountain Hardwear Chocklite

I have not tried the Chocklite, but the Boreas would probably be the most comfortable next to skin with the Montane a close 2nd. The Boreas is warmer (but not water resistant) whereas the Mountain Star has DWR and is not as warm (it also has full front zip and venting side pockets).

hwc 1954
(wcollings) - M
ether driclime on 01/23/2014 19:28:47 MST Print View

I'm 5'8" and 160 to 165 lbs. I wear a medium in all Marmot stuff. The Ether is a little snug over a power stretch fleece, but is fine. That's how I wear it most of the time. I think the Ether and the DriClime windshirt fit about the same. Both are sized appropriately for mid layer. Loose over a t shirt. Athletic/snug over a fleece.

Serge G.
(sgiachetti) - M

Locale: Boulder, CO
t2 + alpine on 01/23/2014 23:39:09 MST Print View

I've found both the driclime & ran VR alpine very effective over a thin base when i'm moving in colder temps. If you think the marmot is clamy, the rab vapour rise (with equilibrium outer) breathes a bit better. Its also a little warmer. That would probably be a good bet as a next to skin pertex/pile option. I've tried that, but I prefer using a polartec high efficiency base layer (mec t2 hoody) with an equilibrium wind shirt (rab alpine) for the same purpose. Having the grid fleece next to skin transports the moisture better if I'm working harder, its easier to seal out drafts, and there are more ways to temp regulate. Bother polartec high efficiency and pertex equilibrium are designed for breathabilty & moisture transport, so they work excellently together. If I'm working hard and moving steadily, that's my favorite combo, but if I'm doing more stop & go stuff & not generating much moisture, I like a thin wool with a pertex pile or wool + high efficiency + a softshell. (BTW, polartec high efficency is what Patagonia uses in the cap 4 baselayers.)

Stephen Komae
(skomae) - MLife

Locale: northeastern US
West comb Crest on 01/24/2014 07:18:24 MST Print View

I've been using the Westcomb Crest on a lot of my trips these days and I am thrilled with it. It's made of Pertex soft shell material and is very light. It's as breathable or more so than the older Houdini, but with stretch. Even in sustained high winds I can barely feel the wind through it but it is breathable enough that I never feel clammy or damp inside. Resists water and snow very well too. Only downside is it seems less abrasion resistant than the Houdini, but the trade off is that it wicks much better when or if you do sweat inside. Next to skin feel is fantastic. I can't imagine a better wind shell than this.

Ito Jakuchu
(jakuchu) - MLife

Locale: Japan
Re: West comb Crest on 01/24/2014 08:51:21 MST Print View

The Westcomb Crest and Rab Alpine Jacket are both made of Pertex Equilibrium.
There seems to be a slight raised grid pattern in the fabric that works wonders. I posted some images in the thread linked by Andrew above. Agree that it is one of the nicest feeling and breathable wind shirts I have had on, and when it does wet out it still feels great and dries quick.


edit -
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=86498

Edited by jakuchu on 01/24/2014 08:52:25 MST.

SPIRIDON Papapetroy
(spotlight) - F
About Ultratherm. on 01/24/2014 09:21:43 MST Print View

I just checked the Mountain Equipment Ultratherm and it has some elasticated parts (called EXOLITE I inserts) which don't seem to be covered by the windproof material that the rest of the jacket is.

Stephen Komae
(skomae) - MLife

Locale: northeastern US
Re: Re: West comb Crest on 01/24/2014 22:28:58 MST Print View

Jakuchu, I think there are several formulations of Pertex Equilibrium. The Westcomb Crest Hoody does not have a grid pattern. It looks pretty much just like any other lightweight softshell material inside and out. I will try to take a good macro photo on Sunday.

Even with the difference I think we can agree on the performance of Pertex Equilibrium. I was not expecting much based on the way the fabric looks (looks very loosely knit!) but it deflects wind, water and snow very well while still being breathable and wicking for comfort.

I think the only downside is that it doesn't seem as durable as the hard-faced nylon stuff used on more traditional windshirt fabric. At the waist I have already noticed a little bit of pilling although it seems to have no effect on comfort.

Ito Jakuchu
(jakuchu) - MLife

Locale: Japan
Re: Re: Re: West comb Crest on 01/25/2014 07:19:13 MST Print View

Stephen,
interesting to hear. Perhaps my description exaggerates the grid quality. If I hadn't photographed it or looked as close, I don't think I would have considered the fabric in this way.

"Even with the difference I think we can agree on the performance of Pertex Equilibrium. I was not expecting much based on the way the fabric looks (looks very loosely knit!) but it deflects wind, water and snow very well while still being breathable and wicking for comfort."

Yeah, exactly.

Anyway, your description makes me curious about your photos and if the fabric will end up same or different..