Between the Cocoon UL 60 pant and the Inner Pant from Montbell is there any recommendation from anyone who has shopped these items? This gear is sought primarily for sleeping and the paramount concern is warmth. Would appreciate very much hearing your thoughts before making the purchase. I am leaning toward the Montbell but would like to accelerate this decision based on the short window of availability of the Cocoon stuff.

They're both great insulated pants. If I were going to use them much as part of a sleeping system, I would get the Cocoons, simply because they will retain loft when wet and make a good back up when using a down bag or quilt.

Ultimately, depends on when and what you will be using these puppies for. Remember, good quality down (when properly taken care of) will last longer than a synthetic insulation.

Um, John, if I may ask... do you know of a Cocoon 60 Pants link that I don't know about? I very much wanted to get this, but the option to order it seems to have long passed...

Miguel, it's still an option if you want any size other than med.

Just a thought, M. I think it would be possible (upon examining my Cocoon Pants) to get the large size and take in the waist band to fit you. The inseam length (according to the BMW sizing chart) is the same. Perhaps a compentent sewing MYOGer can comment on this to back me up.

Yes Miguel, I do have special dispensation and an available source of Cocoons. But do not despair-you too can have this much sought after garment. Just put on a few pounds and order a size large. They are still available as of this writing.

Kevin, These pants are for sleeping. ( loose variation of the Nancy Sinatra hit of the 60s) I prefer down but I wonder if these Montbell pants may not have enough down in them? That’s the main concern. As far as moisture goes, all of my other stuff is down-jackets and sleeping bags- I haven’t had the best of luck with synthetic insulation maintaining its insulating power. But it has been many years since I have tried synthetic and if the Cocoons are warmer to start with and technology has significantly advanced since the days of Polargard, they may be the best way to go. However it would be just a wild guess for me at this stage and am seeking the sage advice of the gear wonks like yourself.

Thanks a bunch, John

Believe it or not, I'm really more of a "get that cool gear out into the wilderness" wonk. Besides, those with full gear closets feel incredibly guilty (or they should!) if they aren't just "doing it'. :-)>

My subjective opinion is that the Cocoon Pants are as warm as the MB's off the bat (I have tried them on). I also think that the drape or tight cut of your bag or quilt could effectively decrease the easy to compress loft of the down pants---they aren't exactly overfilled to begin with. But perhaps a MB user could comment as to that.

Miguel, I would second Kevin's thought. I ordered a large in the Cocoon Pants. I tried them on last night and realized an XL would fit me better. They were just a little snug around my upper legs but fine otherwise. Large often works for me but not always. The Cocoon Vest in large is perfect for me. You may not need to make any modifications to the pants to make them work, particularly if you don't mind a little extra room for layering or for the stuff in your pockets. Hemming them does not appear too difficult and the waist is shock corded. I'm not a competent sewing MYOGer either so hopefully someone will back me up as well.

John, I think the Cocoon pant will be warmer than the Down Inner pant. I've tried on the Down Inner pant, the Thermawrap pant and the Cocoon pant. The Cocoon has more loft than the others. My sense, and that of the sales person was that the Thermawrap pants would be slightly warmer than the Down Inner pants because of all the sewing necessary to stabilize the down. I own a Thermawrap vest and now a Cocoon vest and I can tell already that the Cocoon vest is going to be warmer than the Thermawrap vest. The difference in loft between the Thermawrap vest and the Cocoon vest is the same as the difference between the Thermawrap pants and the Cocoon pants. Hopefully someone with even more experience than I will chime in.

Kevin and Eric,

Thanks for your help. I have ordered the Cocoons.