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jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: $17 trillion deficit - blaming the symtoms on 10/21/2013 08:21:25 MDT Print View

It's just the system

People are allowed to spend unlimited amounts which has corrupted the system

And it's not that the people are all evil, it just sort of evolved and now it's difficult to fix

Like there's the about 30 right wing Republicans that vote to shut down the government if they don't get their way. And then enough other Republicans to make up a majority of Republicans have to go along with them or they'll get "primaried" by the Grover Norquist and Karl Rove groups.

Ian B.
(IDBLOOM) - MLife

Locale: PNW
Re: Re: $17 trillion *debt*- blaming the symtoms on 10/21/2013 11:21:47 MDT Print View

In 1997, I was mindlessly walking around Islamabad like an arrogant herd animal and had some time to do some window shopping. I didn't have a credit card then but had recently received my first debit card. I had no luck finding a compatible ATM and only found a few merchants who could accept my Visa debit card.

I mentioned this to my taxi driver who explained to me that most people in Pakistan deal in cash and felt that the fees associated with using a debit card were foolish. Obviously, the idea of paying credit card interest was simply absurd to them.

What a concept. If you don't have money, you don't make a purchase.

The GOP and Democrats are deplorable but I also feel that it's easy to use them as a copout. Our society is sick with the "play now and pay later" disease. While people are pointing to the problems we're facing in D.C., they fail to acknowledge how far into the red their own personal ledger is.

I'm admittedly a cynic but I really don't see a way out of this. 2008 was small potatoes in the big scheme of things. The way our country and citizens spend money is unsustainable and unless it’s corrected, a catastrophic economic disaster will result. This isn’t Tea Party hyperbole, it's simple math.

Katharina ....
(Kat_P) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Coast
Re: Re: Re: $17 trillion *debt*- blaming the symtoms on 10/21/2013 11:32:24 MDT Print View

"The way our country and citizens spend money is unsustainable and unless it’s corrected, a catastrophic economic disaster will result."

I agree with this.


My dad was a pretty simple man. He never made it to visit the US but he admired this country in many ways. When I was a teenager he told me that disintegration of family and unsustainable buying on credit were some day going to catch up in America and it wasn't going to be pretty.

Ian B.
(IDBLOOM) - MLife

Locale: PNW
Re: Re: Re: Re: $17 trillion *debt*- blaming the symtoms on 10/21/2013 11:48:06 MDT Print View

"When I was a teenager he told me that disintegration of family and unsustainable buying on credit were some day going to catch up in America and it wasn't going to be pretty."

The sad thing is we've already been down this road. Not a perfect comparison but there are some similarities between what we are experiencing now and the mid to late '20s.

Ian B.
(IDBLOOM) - MLife

Locale: PNW
Alan Greenspan on The Daily Show tonight on 10/21/2013 11:59:19 MDT Print View

Seeing that both the GOP and Democrats were convinced that his word was gospel, it will be interesting to hear his thoughts tonight about what we've learned since 2008.

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Alan Greenspan on The Daily Show tonight on 10/21/2013 12:44:14 MDT Print View

Greenspan was horrible

He was proud of being un-understandable just because he's such a genius or whatever - but Bernanke's idea is that if people understand what he's saying and the long term trend, it will affect the economy more than just a one time change in interest rates (or whatever) wondering how Greenspan came up with the decision.

And Greenspan "fixed" the 2000 speculative bubble in the stock market by raising interest rates which caused the economic collapse. Instead, he should have just raised margin requirements which would have just fixed the stock market bubble.

Not my ideas, just common understanding by many people.

Ian B.
(IDBLOOM) - MLife

Locale: PNW
Re: Re: Alan Greenspan on The Daily Show tonight on 10/21/2013 12:54:10 MDT Print View

Word.

It was interesting that most everyone from both sides of the aisle drank the Kool-Aid he was serving and mostly followed his advice. I guess not regulating too large to fail banks and other private sector business which are tied to our critical infrastructure (and are guaranteed a tax payer bailout when the shtf) wasn't such a great idea after all.

I'd still like to hear his thoughts though.

Edited by IDBLOOM on 10/21/2013 12:55:05 MDT.

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Re: Re: Alan Greenspan on The Daily Show tonight on 10/21/2013 15:49:18 MDT Print View

I switch channels when Greenspan comes on

You're right, (almost) everyone worshipped him. I think people have wised up a little though.

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: Alan Greenspan on The Daily Show tonight on 10/24/2013 09:36:45 MDT Print View

Agree with Ian et. al. regarding our collective, reckless use of debt. I must count myself as one of the herd who respected Greenspan. I still admire the guru for admitting publicly that he was wrong. Still trying to determine whether Bush and Blair's absence of any admittance of wrongdoing is due to ignorance or pride??

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Re: Alan Greenspan on The Daily Show tonight on 10/24/2013 09:52:11 MDT Print View

Greenspan half admitted he was wrong once, but afterwards hasn't repeated it

At least he's mostly dropped out of public view, sort of like Bush Jr. - I think they realize how much they screwed up and don't want to face anyone asking them about it