Companion forum thread to:

2007 Montane eVENT Quick-Fire Jacket REVIEW

That's an awfully expensive hardshell. We can only hope the exchange rate will improve (hah!). Montane continues to make well designed garments with a large focus on keeping the weight down. Good to see real functional cuffs that can be opened and some attempt at venting options on such a light shell. Nice to see weights given for different sizes in the review.

My continuing question about eVENT is will the PFTE membrane lose it's oleophobic qualities and eventually be contaminated w/ dirt, salts, body oils and subsequently leak or otherwise degrade. I'm thinking both long trip scenarios and long term use.

Secondly, will we ever see lighter forms of eVENT? Outdoor Research proved that a real sub 10oz.hardshell jacket using a top tier W/B material that was not cut ridiculously short, is possible (in the case of the Zealot and Celestial, using Goretex Paclite).

Edited by kdesign on 04/24/2007 23:37:55 MDT.

I'm not sure why having the velcro stormflap is considered a drawback. When walking hard and ventilation is a big consideration, but the rain is coming down strong, closing just the velcro tabs, but leaving the zipper open will provide excellent ventilation, no?

> closing just the velcro tabs, but leaving the zipper open will provide excellent ventilation, no?
Yep, too right.

The GoLite Zealot has a 'waterproof' zip. It isn't really waterproof in my experience, and both my wife and I have trouble getting the ends together to do it up. That's with bare hands in warm weather. In cold weather (like in the snow) it becomes ... VERY hard to do, and impossible with gloves on. Nice idea, but no thanks.

Cheers

scientic studies at Leeds (UK) University clearly show that waterproof zippers are not reliable. they reported that the only guaranteed waterproof setup is double stormflaps with a drain channel - exactly as the Quickfire is built!

edit - forgot to add that manufacturers suggest that EVent must be kept clean with frequent washing and reproofing to maintain high performance levels.

Edited by sideshowandy on 04/25/2007 05:39:53 MDT.

I googled this jacket looking for $US sales on this item and found this ...

http://www.outdoorgb.com/p/montane_event_quick_fire_jacket/

As far as I'm aware this is the best deal around at the moment

http://www.craigdonmountainsports.com/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Montane_Mens_Event_Quickfire_Jacket_800.html

approx $200 - but I don't know if they'll ship abroad!

Montane uses a similar storm flap design on the Featherlite H20 jacket - see this week's spotlite reviews.

This design works great for keeping out weather, but is a genuine hassle to operate, IMHO. The velcro tabs join the flaps join together, even when you are trying to operate the zipper, making the most basic function of simply unzipping the jacket an annoyance. I think this design needs more thought to come up with a way to close out weather without being a hindrance to the simple operation of the zipper. Other users may find this less of an issue - but I found it to be a genuine design issue.

Doug, Will, Ryan and BPL,

Really glad to see Montane jackets reviewed on your website. The more the better. How about doing a review of Rab's new eVent shell line as well? If it wasn't for your site, I'd feel like I'm the only person in the States wearing Rab and Montane. Thank you.

I have the Rab Super Dru and some older Montane shells. Super Dru, at 14oz is not the lightest basic shell, but with all the features on it its not a basic, but a superb technical shell with full hood protection, padding and helmet compatibilty. By far the best jacket I've worn. The subtleties are worth it.

It would be great to see some more of these jackets reviewed.

Gary

Don,

Maybe a "fix" to the sticky velcro problem would be to sew a flap of sil-nylon over the velcro on the storm flap. This could be the same size as the velcro strips and simply tacked with tread at the top of each strip.

Of course, to close the velcro one would have to move the sil-nylon strips out of the way. So, this probably doesn't solve the problem but reverses the problem.

At least one could choose one's problems to deal with. I wish we had that choice in other aspects of life!

Mike

Andy,

I checked with craigdon mountain sports. They do not ship outside the EU. :-(

Mike

.

Edited by pappekak on 04/25/2007 09:41:29 MDT.

On our 2005 thruhike of the AT both my wife's and my Integral Designs eVent jackets got VERY damp inside during a 3 day streach of rain through the Shananadohs. We both agreed they leaked. We thought the might have been hurt from an incident with housekeeping and a can of Raid back in Fontana Dam (they did buy my wife a new jacket which was real nice of them. My jacket was hardly misted). However, we contacted ID, they exchanged the jackets. Great! Good customer service. But... around Maine, mine started to get moist on the inside during some bigger storms. It really seemed to be leaking again. It still seems to leak. I still have this jacket.

So, I have had 3 jackets now that look like they might be leaking. It's hard to say 100% that they do leak. I would love to give my jacket to a test lab to see if they can see if it does leak...

Gravity Ga-Me 2005

Thomas - The WPB "I think it might be leaking" phenomenon is most frequently caused by the jacket's outer surface wetting out from abrasion and/or frequent rain.

You can determine if this is the problem by doing a simple test using a water faucet. Put the jacket on and then put your lower arm under the running faucet for a minute. Note if the water beaded up and rolled off or wetted any part of the surface. Next take off the jacket and put one of the shoulder strap areas under the faucet for a minute. Again note if the shoulder strap area surface water beaded up and rolled off or wetted any part of the surface.

If any part of the outer surfaces got wet (wetting out), your DWR needs replenishing and the eVENT membrane is not leaking. Most DWR treatments will only last between 30 and 60 miles of abrasion before they wear off.

Edited by richard295 on 04/25/2007 13:16:56 MDT.

Doug,

It's kind of hard to tell from the pictures - can you (or anyone else that has tried one on) please comment on the length of the jacket in front and back. Is the front length generally long enough to partially cover or fully cover your privates, and is the drop tail long enough to fully cover your butt? Since I often walk in warmer weather without rain pants, except when above treeline, I prefer longer shells (unable to find a shell long enough of highly breathable material, I may give in and buy or make a rain kilt). Been eagerly waiting for a review of this shell for a while - thanks for the informative writeup!

I'd also like to second that "waterproof" zips can often fail and they are super difficult to operate in cold weather with gloved hands. A storm flap might add a bit of weight, but it also adds bombproof protection for those who live or walk in very rainy areas.

There seems to be a wide range of quality of the so-called waterproof zips even by the same manufacturer. With the YKK's that I'm familiar with, 2 ( on a Beyond Fleece and a Wild Things softshell jackets) have given me no trouble at all after a couple of years. Another zip on a different jacket, failed within weeks and was extremely difficult to operate from day 1.

Patagonia no longer uses these zips, I've noticed, opting for more conventional designs w/ flaps.

Thomas,
as Richard noted, a failing DWR is often the cause of what is experienced as a leaking jacket. I had the same thing happen with my paclite jacket at the sleeves. To find out if the jacket was really leaking or that the DWR had failed, I took it to a retailer who has a simple device to test the waterproofness of a jacket (using a a bit of water, a tissue to test leaks and a handpump to build up pressure). Not a drop of water came through at exactly the same spot where I had experienced possible leaks. For me it clearly showed what an effect DWR has on breathability and preventing condensation.

About the waterproof zips, I wonder how big the variation in quality is. My Arc'teryx paclite with the original waterresistant zips has never given me a problem, even in heavy rain. I agree they are a bit harder to operate although I neve experienced any real problems. The newer vislon waterresistant zips are supposed to be easier to operate although I haven't read a review about experience with it. BTW, as far as I know, Patagonia is still using these waterproof zips and presently, not a single jacket of them has an external rainflap.

Edited by Woubeir on 04/25/2007 14:53:18 MDT.

I stand corrected on Patagonia zips (sorta). Some softshells or their successors that had waterproof zippers a few years back now have water-resistant ones w/ an external flap. Some of the more bomber Hardshells ( Spraymaster) use their newer waterproof zips in conjunction with an internal "windflap". Some like the Jetstream just have a waterproof zipper.

Edited by kdesign on 04/25/2007 15:08:10 MDT.

... but these guys do seem to:

http://www.outdoormania.co.uk/ProductsByCategory.aspx?CategoryID=1

Great review Doug!

I'll second the question: can someone compare the length to the ID Thruhiker or other similar jacket?