Forum Index » GEAR » That "Hydration Revolution" from Sawyer


Display Avatars Sort By:
Max Dilthey
(mdilthey) - M

Locale: MaxTheCyclist.com
That "Hydration Revolution" from Sawyer on 03/14/2013 14:07:51 MDT Print View

Talking about this: http://www.sawyer.com/water.html (second one, Sawyer Fast Fill Hydration Pack Adapters )


Just received mine. It works great! Something that wasn't apparent to me is that the male end of the apparatus, which branches directly off of the filter, is compatible with the Camelbak female mount that the entre tube stems from. So, you can use it with the Sawyer junction that you put into your cut tube, or you can mount the filter directly to the Camelbak. Pretty neat. it also lets you use your 2-inch mouthpiece tube connected directly to the reservoir in case you can't use your tube (cold weather).

It's not a huge difference, but it's smart. I dig it.

Not doing backflips over it though...

Anyone want pictures of anything specific?

Edited by mdilthey on 03/14/2013 14:08:58 MDT.

Jennifer Mitol
(Jenmitol) - M

Locale: In my dreams....
Yes please... on 03/14/2013 15:08:04 MDT Print View

I would very much like to see pics of the setup. I have a hard time picturing it and am trying to rework my hydration system. Maybe that will help...

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: That "Hydration Revolution" from Sawyer on 03/14/2013 15:10:33 MDT Print View

Max:

Did you try a "costume rehearsal" test?

1. Fill up your 2 or 3L bladder -- insert into your pack -- and pack up your gear like you were heading for a trail -- pack nicely cinched up and all.

2. Empty out the bladder through the hydration tube -- lightly shaking the pack as the bladder empties -- so gear pieces will settle nicely -- as they would when you hike.

3. Now try the gravity method. the "revolutionary" way -- without taking the bladder out -- or even opening up your pack.

4. Let us know if the force of gravity will fill up the bladder fully. I have doubts. If you need to add force by pushing water from dirty bladder to clean -- pushing 2 or 3L won't be much fun. And if you have to open up the pack and move things around to make room for the bladder to bulge back up -- then it may not be so revolutionary after all.

Anyway, please let us know!

Edited by ben2world on 03/14/2013 15:11:34 MDT.

Nathan Watts
(7sport) - MLife
Re: Re: That "Hydration Revolution" from Sawyer on 03/14/2013 15:22:41 MDT Print View

I used to hang a 2 liter bladder in an osprey pack and fill by plugging the hose directly to the output nipple of my katadyn pump filter. Worked really well. Could probably do it w/out even removing the pack.

I could see this being problematic with a gravity feed. And more so without a bladder hanger

I use a steripen now anyway

Max Dilthey
(mdilthey) - M

Locale: MaxTheCyclist.com
@Ben on 03/14/2013 17:11:53 MDT Print View

Ben,

I won't try because I'm sure it doesn't work. I don't have any misconceptions that I'm gonna slide my reservoir into a loaded pack and then empty/refill all trip. But it is convenient not having to "aim" the sawyer into an open reservoir. That is a huge challenge that this system avoids.

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: @Ben on 03/14/2013 18:22:52 MDT Print View

"But it is convenient not having to "aim" the sawyer into an open reservoir."

Simple tubing and the inline adapters included with the Squeeze will do this without the quick change adapters.

Rusty Beaver
(rustyb) - F

Locale: Rocky Mountains
Re: Re: @Ben on 03/14/2013 19:23:12 MDT Print View

"But it is convenient not having to "aim" the sawyer into an open reservoir."

"Simple tubing and the inline adapters included with the Squeeze will do this without the quick change adapters."

Or, simpler yet > sawyer

Maybe I'm missing something. Probably.....

Travis Leanna
(T.L.) - MLife

Locale: Wisconsin
Re: Re: Re: @Ben on 03/14/2013 19:28:26 MDT Print View

+1 to Rusty.

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Re: Re: @Ben on 03/14/2013 19:30:33 MDT Print View

"Simple tubing and the inline adapters included with the Squeeze will do this without the quick change adapters."

what????

this is pretty simple:
squeeze2

Maybe I'm missing something. Probably.....

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: Re: Re: @Ben on 03/14/2013 19:38:59 MDT Print View

"Maybe I'm missing something. Probably....."

What the!!!!! I thought the Sawyer Squeeze as an enema bag, hence the tubing! It all makes sense now!

Just got mine and haven't used it yet, so thanks Rusty, that does make perfect sense. I'll carry the tubing, though, to set it up as a gravity filter at camp.

Jason G
(JasonG) - F

Locale: iceberg lake
filter? its just sediment... on 03/14/2013 19:48:56 MDT Print View

huh?

pretty simple and light..
dr

Colin Krusor
(ckrusor) - M

Locale: Northwest US
Sediment on 03/14/2013 20:14:14 MDT Print View

Lots of reasons to use a filter other than sediment. There are good reasons that the National Park Service tells campers at some coastal/lowland locations that only filtering or boiling will make the water safe to drink.

Jason, I could name half a dozen ubiquitous parasites that would laugh at your little bottles, if they could.

This strays from the topic of the thread, though. I'm looking forward to photos of the OP's new system.

Edited by ckrusor on 03/14/2013 20:18:35 MDT.

scree ride
(scree)
Sawyer on 03/14/2013 20:27:12 MDT Print View

The Sawyer filter will also work inline with the Geigerrig pressurized hydration system.
Now if I can use my Geigerrig pump on an inflatable mat it may earn it's spot.

Greg Mihalik
(greg23) - M

Locale: Colorado
Re: Sawyer Bladder Failures on 03/14/2013 20:57:56 MDT Print View

There are other posts on BPL, but just in case you missed them...

SawyerBladderFail

This was loosely wrapped around a PointOne in a hipbelt pocket with plenty of room.
No unusual abuse.

If you are going to rely on the filter, do yourself a favor and find an Evernew.

Edited by greg23 on 03/14/2013 20:58:58 MDT.

Michael Ray
(topshot) - MLife

Locale: Midwest
Re: Re: Sawyer Bladder Failures on 03/14/2013 21:12:01 MDT Print View

FYI, the Sawyer bladders have been redesigned for 2013 to address this.

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: Sediment on 03/14/2013 21:30:45 MDT Print View

"Lots of reasons to use a filter other than sediment. "

One option is to treat the water with chlorine (household bleach) -- wait 30 minutes -- to kill viruses and bacteria. Then drink through an inline filter like Aquamira Frontier Pro to block the bigger stuff like protozoa. Advantages over Sawyer:

1. FP is lighter (weighs just 2oz) and much more compact.
2. FP incorporates a carbon core -- will improve water taste -- which Sawyer won't.

Relying on chemicals to kill just the small stuff (and not everything) means shorter wait time - 30 min. even in cold water.

Relying on filter to block only the big stuff (protozoa) means a smaller, lighter and simpler filter that requires little sucking effort.

The FP can also be used in gravity mode -- just like Sawyer. To me, gravity feed is great when at camp. But waiting for gravity to do its work can be very tedious and annoying in the middle of the day -- esp. if it's raining or skeeters and flies are biting. Mid-day water stops -- 'just scoop and go' is my preference. I can quickly resume hike (if need be) and let the chlorine do its work.

Finally, the FP comes with its own bite valve -- so it can be screwed directly onto a Platypus for easy drinking at camp. I believe FP beats all in the versatility dept. -- the Houdini of water filters.

Edited by ben2world on 03/14/2013 21:38:14 MDT.

Jason G
(JasonG) - F

Locale: iceberg lake
Re: Sediment on 03/14/2013 22:23:03 MDT Print View

"Lots of reasons to use a filter other than sediment. There are good reasons that the National Park Service tells campers at some coastal/lowland locations that only filtering or boiling will make the water safe to drink.

Jason, I could name half a dozen ubiquitous parasites that would laugh at your little bottles, if they could.

This strays from the topic of the thread, though. I'm looking forward to photos of the OP's new system."




Sure there are always areas that a filter would be superior. But for me the drops are all I have needed. I hike on the west coast mainly in CA and mainly in the sierras and a filter is not needed up there. I do own a Frontier pro in case im going somewhere that i think i might need it but never have actually used it..

I'm curious what parasites you think would survive a chlorine dioxide treatment? I was under the impression drops kill everything including viruses (which filters do not)

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: Re: Sediment on 03/14/2013 22:28:03 MDT Print View

Jason:

I've read that certain protozoa (such as cryptosporidium and giardia) are quite resistant to chlorine - at least the concentration level that we can still tolerate drinking. While they are still microscopic, they are much bigger than bacteria, and some of them have shells which further protect them from chemicals. Those don't exist everywhere, but where they do, they can make you pretty sick. In my post, I described my own method - which combines chlorine with a simple filter.

Edited by ben2world on 03/14/2013 22:29:16 MDT.

Max Dilthey
(mdilthey) - M

Locale: MaxTheCyclist.com
Let me explain it better? on 03/14/2013 22:37:32 MDT Print View

Sorry about the pics taking a while. Computer troubles. I don't know if it's that exciting. Check out this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAn4DBeMn2M

In it, she shows the male end of the Sawyer's blue cap tube connecting with the little modifier she put into the Camelbak tube.

That female end is identical to Camelbak's (proprietary?) tube connection system. The blue and yellow port on the reservoir where the tube connects is also compatible with Sawyer's blue cap/grey tube mount for the Sawyer Squeeze.

Makes sense?

Michael Ray
(topshot) - MLife

Locale: Midwest
Re: Chlorine vs chlorine dioxide on 03/15/2013 06:12:06 MDT Print View

Ben,
It's true that cysts are resistant to chlorine (ie, bleach) but it is NOT chlorine that kills them when using chlorine dioxide despite the name. It may take 4 hours to do so in certain conditions, but ClO2 will get them.

I am curious as to what other critters Colin is referring. I've not read anything along those lines.

scree ride
(scree)
Fronteir Pro on 03/15/2013 06:18:46 MDT Print View

The FP hanging off the end of my hydro hose makes it rather bulky and more difficult to use. The Sawyer fits inline, so it can go in the pack.

Loki Cuthbert
(lokbot) - F

Locale: Portland, OR
You dont need to buy an attachment on 03/15/2013 10:27:41 MDT Print View

Take the bite valve off and clip a piece of tubing off. Reinstall the bite valve then use that tube to connect the sawer to your bite valve with the mouth piece pulled off.Sawer gravity fill 1Saw<img src=Sawer gravity 4

Edited by lokbot on 03/15/2013 10:29:24 MDT.

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: Re: Chlorine vs chlorine dioxide on 03/15/2013 10:48:04 MDT Print View

@ Colin, who wrote, "Ben,
It's true that cysts are resistant to chlorine (ie, bleach) but it is NOT chlorine that kills them when using chlorine dioxide despite the name. It may take 4 hours to do so in certain conditions, but ClO2 will get them.

I am curious as to what other critters Colin is referring. I've not read anything along those lines."


Colin -- just to be clear -- I was referring to chlorine - as in common household bleach -- not CLO2. Bleach is cheap as heck whereas CLO2 is expensive. While the latter is effective against cysts, the treatment time can take hours -- which is impractical unless treating water overnight. Much better, IMO, is to simply use chlorine -- to kill the tiny stuff -- and rely on a simple filter like the Frontier Pro to trap the bigger stuff (like cysts). The combo can cut way down on treatment time.

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: Fronteir Pro on 03/15/2013 10:50:19 MDT Print View

@Terran Elam, who wrote, "The FP hanging off the end of my hydro hose makes it rather bulky and more difficult to use. The Sawyer fits inline, so it can go in the pack."

The FP has the option of fitting at the end of your hydro hose -- but it too can serve as an inline filter -- and a more compact one than the Sawyer. Simply (and carefully) remove the bite valve to expose the connecting "nipple".

scree ride
(scree)
Fronteir Pro bite valve on 03/15/2013 14:05:29 MDT Print View

There is a nipple, but not a quick connect. The nipple is too large to fit a hose around. A smaller hose will fit inside the nipple, but isn't secure. It's made for a straw.
FP makes a filter for Geigerrig that has the quick connects that fits next to the bladder. Albeit 7 bucks more...Both good for only 50 gallons. For that the Katadyn charcoal is refillable though perhaps a bit bulky.

Ben 2 World
(ben2world) - MLife

Locale: So Cal
Re: Fronteir Pro bite valve on 03/15/2013 14:35:34 MDT Print View

@terran:

FP's smaller intake nipple - I insert Platy tube over the nipple.
FP's fatter output nipple - I insert Platy tube into the nipple. Fits well enough although not super tight.

Michael Ray
(topshot) - MLife

Locale: Midwest
Re: Chlorine vs chlorine dioxide on 03/15/2013 15:14:10 MDT Print View

It was me, not Colin, that had responded. I also use just plain household bleach and carry a Frontier Pro, but have never actually used it. The likelihood of cysts is quite small in reality and I try to pick wise sources. If it is suspect (valley where beavers live, nearby cattle) then I could also use the filter. Lucky so far I guess.

ClO2 is ready in 30 min for most mountain sources. I have started carrying some tablets as backup (or for poor sources).

scree ride
(scree)
pressure on 03/15/2013 16:35:38 MDT Print View

Ben, I guess the difference would be that the Geiger hydration system is under pressure. The lines have to be quite positively connected with barbed or quick connectors.

Jeff McWilliams
(jjmcwill) - M

Locale: Midwest
Frontier Pro vs Sawyer Squeeze on 03/17/2013 06:15:39 MDT Print View

These both interest me, so I thought I'd outline the differences

Frontier Pro
Weight: 2oz
Capacity 50gal
Filter size: 3 microns
Requires secondary treatment for Bacteria and Viruses
Works inline
Works as gravity filter

Sawyer Squeeze
Weight: 3oz
Capacity: 1 million gallons
Filter size: .1 micron
No secondary treatment required for Bacteria
Works inline
Works as gravity filter

I'd personally pick the Sawyer over the Frontier Pro. Capacity of only 50 gallons is a limiting factor. I can share the Sawyer Squeeze among 2 or 3 friends. 3 of us shared one in the Adirondacks. If using the Frontier Pro, the need to also carry secondary treatment, the 30 minute treatment time requirement, and the limited filter life would be significant downsides.

I can see the attraction of the Frontier Pro for solo hikes, where that extra ounce or two really counts.

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Frontier Pro vs Sawyer Squeeze on 03/17/2013 09:17:10 MDT Print View

For Sawyer, you also have to take backwash syringe that weighs 1.2 oz if you're going to treat many gallons, depending on water quality.

Jake D
(JakeDatc) - F

Locale: Bristol,RI
Re: Re: Frontier Pro vs Sawyer Squeeze on 03/17/2013 09:27:44 MDT Print View

Did 18 day Long Trail thru hike treating water out of tiny trickles in a very dry season last year and back flushed once and really didn't notice a difference (ie probaby didn't need it). So unless you are doing one of the long thru hikes or expect really silty water i doubt most need to carry the syringe.

John S.
(jshann) - F
Re: Frontier Pro vs Sawyer Squeeze on 03/17/2013 10:02:25 MDT Print View

The Sawyer does not filter virus particles, so you would pre or post treat for those.