First alcohol stove
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Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 17:18:04 MST Print View

I bought Crown's "green" denatured alcohol and put a little in my bottlestove tonight to try it out for the first time. Here's the result.

Air temp was around 65*, no wind, water was from the faucet (on cold). This is pretty much what I would assume in the summer here in the southeast...if not warmer.

The pot is a BPL Ti 1100 ml w/ lid, 4.5" in diameter. The windscreen is Ti from QiWiz.

I had 3 cups of water boiling in about 5:30.

From these pictures, can you guys tell me if I am going to notice much in terms of efficiency if I get a wider pot? The flames are definitely spilling over the side.

First boil 1
First boil 2

BTW - I might be hooked. That was cool! Big thanks to QiWiz for his help and for two great products!

todd harper
(funnymoney) - MLife

Locale: Sunshine State
Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 17:25:02 MST Print View

Judging from the pics, a wider pot would almost certainly yield better efficiency.

That said, your boil time for 3 cups beats most alchy stoves' 2 cup performance! Wow, that is really great performance. Which stove are you using?

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 17:36:27 MST Print View

I am using a bottlestove bought from Qiwiz

How wide of a pot should I get for this stove?

Jon Fong
(jonfong) - F - M

Locale: FLAT CAT GEAR
Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 18:21:40 MST Print View

Since you bought the stove and windscreen from QiWiz, you should probably ask him directly.

Edited by jonfong on 03/09/2013 18:22:24 MST.

steven franchuk
(Surf) - M
air intake holes in wind screen? on 03/09/2013 18:24:50 MST Print View

The flames look very yellow. This might indicate not enough air for the fuel to burn completely. I can't tell from your photos but you should have some way for air to get in at the base of the wind screen. Many people add a row of holes near the bottom edge to insure good air flow.

The flames on your stove are very pig and your boil time seems fast. If your wind screen doesn't have any air intake holes your stove might get very hot which would accelerate the fuel burn off and would produce larger flames. Your stove would be more efficent with a slower fuel burn rate.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: air intake holes in wind screen? on 03/09/2013 18:28:32 MST Print View

The windscreen from QiWiz has holes in the bottom. That's good information...thanks! I'll talk with him and see what he thinks.

Dean F.
(acrosome) - MLife

Locale: Back in the Front Range
Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 18:30:54 MST Print View

@ "That said, your boil time for 3 cups beats most alchy stoves' 2 cup performance!"

Yes, the TIME beat most other stoves. But how much fuel was consumed? Because that's how you get an alky stove to beat a canister stove on weight- you need decent fuel efficiency. With that quick a boil time I'll almost guarantee that he burned a ton of fuel.

I've done a fair bit of comparison recently, and that seems to be the trade-off: Faster boil times consume more fuel. He needs to fiddle with letting more or less air get through the windscreen, and the height of the pot above the stove, and see which nets the efficiency/time tradeoff that he prefers.

Clearly, though, yes, the low-hanging fruit right now is a wider pot. Or, actually, maybe a taller windscreen- in the house that tall jet of flame up the side of the pot probably worked well, but in even the slightest breeze it won't. Also, I have to wonder if those flames burn so high because of all the air they're getting? Maybe a higher windscreen would lead to the stove burning leaner, and thus a longer boil time but better efficiency.

Do you have a scale? The easiest way to measure fuel usage is to weight the filled stove before boiling, and snuff it and weight it afterwards and do a little subtraction.

Edited by acrosome on 03/09/2013 18:44:15 MST.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 18:38:33 MST Print View

I have no idea how much fuel I put in there, but the stove went out about 20 second after the boil started. Inside the stove, it wasn't more than 1/3" deep...bear with my guestimation as I don't have a means of measuring fuel at the moment.

I'll tinker with raising the windscreen to see if I can get better airflow underneath. Raising the pot, at least on this stove, seems counterproductive since the pot blocks the main opening from burning and pushes the flame to the outer holes/jets.

Take all of what I say with a grain of salt. I have only used this stove once...and it's my first.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Pouring alcohol? on 03/09/2013 18:45:30 MST Print View

Oh and what's the best way to pour the alcohol out of the stock container? I'm going to get a small bottle soon...but even still, I'll need some tips. My first pour was a big spill.

Kevin Schneringer
(Slammer) - MLife

Locale: Oklahoma Flat Lands
Re: Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 18:47:01 MST Print View

Tyler I hope you know "alcohol" is addictive!
You will start thing about different designs a work then you'll wake up at 2:00 A.M with an improvement.
Ya you'll be addicted!

As far as measuring -(if you have) use one of the kids liquid medicine measuring cups most have milliliter increments

M B
(livingontheroad) - M
flames on 03/09/2013 18:48:08 MST Print View

It is really nice to be able to pick a pot up while the flame is burning.

That is the #1 drawback of having flames engulf your pot, may need to wait for the stove to burn out. Even so, an attached handle may then be too hot to use.

There is no reason to be in a big rush to boil water, efficiency is #1 goal.

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 18:48:17 MST Print View

IME I have learned that alcohol stoves like air drafting in from the bottom. After visiting QiWiz's site I'm not sure those elongated holes provide enough combustion air.

Try raising the windscreen off of the ground / surface 1/2" to 3/4". For the purposes of experimentation you can use some large paper clips on the windscreen as legs.

Judging from the pictures I would suggest a 5" diameter pot minimum and maybe as large as a 6" to avoid the obvious flames running up the sides.

Party On,

Newton

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 18:51:14 MST Print View

Yes, efficiency is my goal. I don't care if I need to wait for water to boil. I'll tinker with the windscreen a few times and see what I come up with.

Still would love to know the best way to pour from the stock container without spilling...even when pouring into a smaller bottle.

Link .
(annapurna) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 19:01:18 MST Print View

For filling your fuel bottle from the stock container this and for measuring this .

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 19:15:14 MST Print View

Thanks Anna! I'll see if I can find the same thing locally.

M B
(livingontheroad) - M
measure on 03/09/2013 19:28:27 MST Print View

the little measuring cups for kids medicine work good when playing around at home.

just make some mark inside the stove , a fill line, and fill to that when you are in the field. It can be as simple a sticking on a tiny piece of aluminum tape. Or scribing a line.
No need to bring the measure with you. One more thing to keep track of.

Link .
(annapurna) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 19:30:26 MST Print View

Yes, you can easily find these things cheap and locally,I figured it is easier to know what you are looking for with a visual.I can get all the free little measuring cups I want for free,my mom is in a retirement home and it is what they bring her pills to her in.

Edited by annapurna on 03/09/2013 19:33:55 MST.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: First alcohol stove on 03/09/2013 19:37:21 MST Print View

Yeah, the visual is great. I was thinking that was what I needed.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Second boil - Great at first, but then... on 03/09/2013 20:04:14 MST Print View

I didn't find any paperclips on hand, but found 4 black clips that raised the windscreen up about 7/8".
Clips on windscreen

I used about the same amount of fuel. At first, the flames were much smaller and seemed to barely even come around the side of the pot. I was thinking I had this thing figured out.Boil 2.1
Boil 2.2

And then about half way into the boil, the flames started spilling up the sides. This time, it was only in two concentrated spots, not a large area.Boil 2.3
Boil 2.5

I forgot to start my watch, but it was definitely faster than the first boil. What can I learn from this?

Brandon Guy
(brucky) - F

Locale: Central Cal
Re: Second boil - Great at first, but then... on 03/09/2013 21:38:10 MST Print View

To me it looks like the stove is getting too hot. When the stove gets too hot it forces more alcohol out the jets and it burns faster and higher. It happens for a couple reasons I know of...1)stove design, the jets are too low and the flames lick up the side of the stove and heat it too much 2) Too much heat is trapped by the windscreen or 3)you put in too much alcohol causing higher pressure. 1 oz of alcohol should be enough.

Those beer can/bottle stoves have a good size diameter so they usually do better with a larger pot. Tinny at minibulldesigns recommends 4 inches or larger for his stoves.