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Aaron Sorensen
(awsorensen) - MLife

Locale: South of Forester Pass
Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/09/2013 21:52:27 MST Print View

Is this a windshirt thread?

I don't like trolls and how so many threads that start off interesting end up going off on tangents.

Travis Leanna
(T.L.) - MLife

Locale: Wisconsin
Re: Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/09/2013 21:55:04 MST Print View

What was trolled?

Aaron Sorensen
(awsorensen) - MLife

Locale: South of Forester Pass
Re: Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/09/2013 21:58:40 MST Print View

Just kidding


What I don't get...

I just don't understand why everybody brings sooo much crap with them when they go backpacking.
Even light is not really light on this site. The average backpack from trips on this site on a 3 day trip probably weighs 28 pounds or so?
Why do people need to bring their bed and kitchen sink with them?
I thought roughing it was a good thing when heading out on a trip?

I don't get it.

Stephen M
(stephenm) - MLife

Locale: Lartnec Nagihcim
Re: Re: Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/09/2013 21:58:59 MST Print View

I thought trolls lived under bridges.

Stephen M
(stephenm) - MLife

Locale: Lartnec Nagihcim
Re: Re: Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/09/2013 22:21:20 MST Print View

We bring a pad to sleep on, and a stove and pot to cook on.

Sleeping on 20f bare ground and lighting a fire at 12000ft can be a bit dicey.

Edited by stephenm on 03/09/2013 22:22:31 MST.

Greg F
(GregF) - F

Locale: Canadian Rockies
Re: Re: Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/09/2013 23:34:13 MST Print View

Aaron,

I think the reason is that Comfort UL is so easy these days. In no bear can zones you can go 10lbs and bring the kitchen sink (literally). So as tech has improved you can bring more stuff. And the benefit of cutting that stuff is minimal as for a weekend trip you can have a 18lb pack and a 12lb baseweight. My last trip I brought a chair and was under 10 lbs, my new goal is 10lbs full kitchen set up to cook pizza, cookies and bread. Luxury UL is what you are seeing.

Now back to back 40 mile days and my list changes a lot but where is the driver to go lighter than 10lbs for a 20 mile day weekend trip.

Edited by GregF on 03/09/2013 23:35:09 MST.

Cesar Valdez
(PrimeZombie) - F

Locale: Scandinavia
Re: mitts, windshirts, and...pee? on 03/10/2013 01:03:02 MST Print View

Glad I am not the only one that doesn't get mitts. I was half expecting to be mocked and trolled for not seeing the point.

Windshirts on the other hand, I get. I don't always bring one, but I often do, especially on section hikes and summer trips. For me it is about fine tuning warmth, and for around 100-200g depending on what kind of windshirt, it is not that much of a weight penalty. I have one that is 75g that sees the most use, but I also have a beefier running jacket that is around 200g that I use in cooler temps because it is warmer (plus has nice pockets too as a bonus). I have yet another that is 140g that is in my urban backpack that I use a lot as an extra layer--great for when I stay out later than expected and it's much colder around midnight.

Even in places that see a lot of rain, which probably includes where I live and hike, it is usually not raining. So my windshirts see more use than my rain gear. Plus it is multi-use: you can wear them to bed (I often do), wear as a shirt while you wash/dry your t-shirt, and if it is warmer out but raining it is a nice buffer between a rain jacket/poncho and arms (if, like me, you don't find rain shells as nice on the skin as windshirt nylon).

Now the whole pee bottle or pee in your pot thing I don't get either. Not because I think it is "gross" either--fresh pee is sterile, from what I gather. I just don't mind getting up to pee outside of my shelter, even in the rain. Only takes a minute or so, even when squirming out of a bivy. Maybe because this is not as frequent for me? I hardly ever wake up at home to pee, and would estimate that I wake up to pee out backpacking maybe 20-25% of the time. I do make it a point to try and pee before bed, though.

Stephen M
(stephenm) - MLife

Locale: Lartnec Nagihcim
Re: Re: mitts, windshirts, and...pee? on 03/10/2013 07:57:06 MDT Print View

Hi Cesar,

Just had a think and I have 4 pairs of mitts I use through the various seasons.

MLD Event mitts.
Gooses Feet down mitts.
Outdoor Pl 400 fleece mitts.
OutDoor Designs inferno mitts.

The Mld pair are what I use most and layer the Down or fleece mitts under them if need be but prefer to keep the down ones for camp use.

The infermo mitts have a crazy amount of synthetic fill (around 220gm2) and are solely for winter.

When using the Mld pair on the move in winter I will usually have 1 or 2 pairs of liner gloves under them, in summer I may wear them by themselves.

Edited by stephenm on 03/10/2013 08:02:10 MDT.

Nick Larsen
(stingray4540) - F

Locale: South Bay
Skin out weight on 03/10/2013 08:56:51 MDT Print View

I don't get "skin out" weight.

I mean, if my everyday dress is jeans, shoes, car keys, wallet, pocket knife, cell phone, etc. I'm probably wearing 5 lbs of clothes. But, since I wear this on nearly a daily basis, my body is used to the weight as if it was my own body weight.

Based on that, I don't see the point in calculating the weight of anything other than what is in your pack, unless you normally walk around naked, or your backpacking clothes are heavier than your EDC. I doubt either of those cases are ever true.

In fact, I propose that the standard be to calculate your skin out weight, but you subtract your EDC weight from that number, and the result is your actual backpacking weight.

I'm gonna start wearing a 30lb weight vest 24/7, so backpacking will feel like I lost weight, lol.

Travis Leanna
(T.L.) - MLife

Locale: Wisconsin
Re: Skin out weight on 03/10/2013 11:10:34 MDT Print View

I hear ya on that, Nick.

I guess I "get it," but never saw the need to really care about total worn weight in a spreadsheet. I do pay attention not to stuff my pockets full of extra stuff and when I buy a garment I look for the lightest version of what I need.

I've even considered using an *inside/on/attached to* the pack only measurement; not including the pack weight. Why? Because good, supportive packs are light enough now that when worn empty they feel light like clothing. Plus, a good suspension system can make the load feel lighter than it is.

Aaron Sorensen
(awsorensen) - MLife

Locale: South of Forester Pass
Re: Re: Skin out weight on 03/10/2013 11:19:48 MDT Print View

+ 2 with Nick.

I don't even care what my base is. It's all about the weight carried on my back.

Stephen M
(stephenm) - MLife

Locale: Lartnec Nagihcim
Re: Re: Skin out weight on 03/10/2013 11:21:07 MDT Print View

I will make sure I don't have any coins in my pocket but that's about it.

Travis,

I find a weight minus pack measurement makes sense for me most of the time.

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com)

Locale: PDX
... on 03/10/2013 11:28:18 MDT Print View

...

Edited by daniel@fishfamilypdx.com on 06/12/2013 22:49:19 MDT.

Stephen M
(stephenm) - MLife

Locale: Lartnec Nagihcim
Re: shelter weight without guylines or stakes on 03/10/2013 11:29:53 MDT Print View

It makes it easier for them to tell porkies :-)

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
2.5 lb bivy shelters for below treeline use. on 03/10/2013 11:44:31 MDT Print View

Don't get it.

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: shelter weight without guylines or stakes on 03/10/2013 11:46:58 MDT Print View

"I don't get why many tents are advertised with a weight minus guylines and stakes."

Because there are many different guylines and stakes with varying weights out there. I might use a different set, at a different weight, than you. So advertising only the shelter weight makes sense.

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com)

Locale: PDX
... on 03/10/2013 12:10:42 MDT Print View

...

Edited by daniel@fishfamilypdx.com on 06/12/2013 22:51:28 MDT.

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
Re: RE: Bivy on 03/10/2013 12:23:38 MDT Print View

Pretty awesome, eh?

Tee, hee.

Lyan Jordan
(redmonk)

Locale: Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem
The "I don't get it" thread on 03/10/2013 13:44:54 MDT Print View

moving slow enough to find a rain jacket tolerable to wear as a wind shirt, I don't get it.

Ken Thompson
(kthompson) - MLife
Re: The "I don't get it" thread on 03/10/2013 13:51:30 MDT Print View

Esbit. Many here seem to love it so. I find it smelly, messy and slow. Have a canister stove. Want to give it a go? Though I am very happy with my alcohol stove and cone. I can see some advantages on paper, but in real life I am not a fan.