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Martin Clark
(Marty_Mcfly) - F

Locale: Southeast US
Navigation on 03/09/2013 09:53:37 MST Print View

Anyone have any useful and practical suggestions for how to acquire backcountry navigation skills?

my current methods are:

- books
- youtube videos

other considerations are:

- taking a class,
- finding someone who lives near me from BPL to assist me with acquiring such skills in exchange for money or free lunch/dinner

Brian Lewis
(brianle) - F

Locale: Pacific NW
can learn on own but practice on 03/09/2013 10:01:21 MST Print View

Have a look at http://www.backcountryattitude.com/navigation_map_compass.html
There are likely other good resources out there.

I think the biggest issue is to get a lot of practice. Print out free topo maps of whatever areas you hike in using one of the approaches here:
http://www.mountaineers.org/foothills/hiking/docs/how_to_print_usgs_maps_for_free.html

Get a compass and review materials from book(s) and/or web or whatever and even on trails you know, "track" where you are as you go along. Pay attention to landforms, try to stay oriented.

I think that it's worth mentioning too that we're not all the same in terms of assimilating spatial data. My wife seems to build a virtual 3-D topo map in her head as she goes along. I need to diligently use the map and any other tools available (compass, gps, signs on the trail) to figure things out. So you might or might not be sort of natively "good" at this stuff, but with practice/learning I think that any of us can become good (just not always using the same approach).

Michael Ray
(topshot) - MLife

Locale: Midwest
Re: can learn on own but practice on 03/09/2013 10:40:03 MST Print View

+1 to what Brian said. Practice is the easiest way. Keep an eye on the topo as you're moving on familiar trails so you can picture what the topo is showing you. Things are much more difficult when surrounded by woods (or in a cloud/fog/blizzard) and you can't see any landmarks. When you do have views on familiar trails practice "triangulating" your position - you don't need 3 landmarks, even 1 will work if you're certain you're on a known marked trail.

Also don't forget the topo can't show you everything so you may come upon an impassible 30' cliff that you'll have to go around. That shouldn't be an issue unless you're going off-trail though.

There are several BPL members in the southeast, too, if you can arrange a trip.

If you want a fun challenge, go geocaching with just map and compass!

Edited by topshot on 03/09/2013 10:42:03 MST.

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Learning Navigation : Plotting a route at home on 03/09/2013 10:58:29 MST Print View

Hiya,

Orienteering is complicated. There's lots of steps to it, and the best way to learn is just dive into it. But it really does get easier pretty fast. In my opinion, there are 2 parts to orienteering. First, preparation and following the intended route. Second, finding your location on the map when you're lost. Luckily I've never been lost. For me, the process of preparing the route on a map insures I won't get lost.

Here's how I prepare at home. If you follow this process, at the end you should be very comfortable with map compass, even if it's your first time. Being comfortable with map and compass is the most important thing to learn, if you ask me. In general the process has 2 steps with lots of little details in between.

Step 1 = Generating the topo map.
Step 2 = Plotting a route.

My advice if you're learning is to go ahead and plan a trip, get real topos, and spend an hour or two at the "kitchen table" reading map and compass and plotting the route. For an easier exercise, go to google maps. Search for your home address, switch it to satalite, then zoom in close enough so you can see your home and a few of your neighbor's homes. Print out that page, and use it plot a route from your house to your neighbor's house. Google Maps does has a scale, but it doesn't have north-south lines. You'll have to draw those in with a ruler to record the bearing.

Hint: I use gimp to do the cropping, stitching, cutting and pasting of the topo.

Now here's how I plot a route at home.

1) Generate topo for your hike.

1a) You need a good high quality topo map. Here's the link I always use to find USForestry service topos: http://fsgeodata.fs.fed.us/rastergateway/states-regions/regions.php

1b) If plotting a long course: Crop and stitch together the various adjacent maps so that your start point and end points are on the same map.

1c) Be sure to include the scale and the declination angle on your map, crop, cut and paste as needed.

1d) Be sure you are not changing the resolution ( aka the size ) of the topo(s).

1e) Bring the finished image file ( generally a jpg will work but I beleive a png will potentially give better results ) to a kinkos and have them print it 11x17 laminated.

2) Plot a route

Tools needed: Orienteering Compass, ruler, geometry compass, straight edge, multiple colors of wet-erase markers

** Confirm that declination angle on orienteering compass is set to 0 deg **

2a) Place the map in front of you so that the north on the map is pointing "up" on the map.

2b) Using the ruler and using the wet erase marker ( I use green for the arrows showing the route) draw arrows along the intended route on the map so that your intended route is made up of a series of end-to-end arrows. I like to but dots at the beginning of the arrow, but that's not required.

2c) Using the meridian lines on the orienteering compass line extend a north south line through the beginning of the first arrow.

2d) Spin direction of travel arrow on orienteering compass to North ( 0 deg ). Move the orienteering compass on the map so that the center of the compass is on the beginning of the first arrow and is lined up along withe the north-south line from previous step.

2e) Press the orienteering compass firmly on map and spin the direction of travel so that it is directly on top of the direction of travel arrow that was drawn on the map.

2f) Read the bearing indicated at the top of the orienteering compass.

2g) Write this bearing on the side of the map: "Section 1: 172 deg, "

2h) Remove the orienteering compass from the map. Using the geometry compass, measure the distance of the first segment.

2i) Without changing the distance on the geometry compass, line up the two points of the geometry compass with the scale on the map.

2j) Read the distance on the scale and write it on the side of the map: "Section 1: 172 deg, .75 miles"

2k) Locate the closest elevation line on the topo map of the beginning of the segment on the map.

2l) Read the altitude indicated by the elevation line and write it next to the beginning of the arrow on the map.

2m) repeat steps 2a - 2l until entire intended route is represented as a bearing, a distance, and an altitude.

Optional: Locate a few natural land marks on the map and take a bearing to these land marks from the intended route on the map. I draw dotted orange lines and write in orange the bearing to the land mark from the intended route.

Once you have done this, it's pretty intuitive ( in my opinion ) to follow the route as a test. The most important thing to remember when following a route you prepare at home is this: you MUST set the declination angle on your compass as listed on the US Forestry Topo you are using. If you forget to do this all the bearings measured at home will be off by this declination angle. Also regarding declination angles.. the can change dramatically in as short as two - three years. If using a map printed more than 2 years ago, check it out on the US Forestry website before your trip to make sure that the declination angle has not been updated.

If there's interest I can write up a detailed how-to for following the route in the field...

sincerely,

-daniel-

Edited by daniel@fishfamilypdx.com on 03/09/2013 11:05:20 MST.

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Good resource: Freedom of the Hills on 03/09/2013 11:02:56 MST Print View

http://www.powells.com/biblio/2-9780898868289-6

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Navigation: Using a handrail on 03/09/2013 11:15:35 MST Print View

The easiest way to stay on the intended route is to identify any possible handrails from a topo map as part of your route planning process.

A handrail is some geographic feature which runs parallel for large portions of the intended route.

Examples: A river will be on my right for approx 2 miles, then I cross river and I walk thru a valley ( aka up hill on both sides ) for another mile, then I traverse a ridge for 2 miles, uphill should be on my left. Then the river is back on my right... etc.

Hope this helps..

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Good resource: Freedom of the Hills on 03/09/2013 11:16:54 MST Print View

It makes a lot more sense if you use the title of the book, Mountaineering: Freedom of the Hills.

--B.G.--

Dale Wambaugh
(dwambaugh) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Re: Re: can learn on own but practice on 03/09/2013 11:18:37 MST Print View

I like learning such things from a book. REI does some classes and you can probably find some outdoor organization that have classes too.

One way to practice is to get out in a park and run triangular courses and see if you can end up in the same spot. Try it with a hood blocking your view so you can only see the compass and a little ground in front of you. You will be counting steps to estimate distance as well as mthe compass direction. A soccer field makes a good practice area. Most books will have some suggestions for practice.

You can test your triangulation skills in town using tall buildings, broadcast antennas and water towers. You can use a smart phone or GPS to confirm your results.

It's really a process of understanding the angles and adjusting for declination. In the field, taking regular bearings and following your progress on a map will avoid needing to do things like triangulating on peaks. If you do need to go there, following your progress will let you know which peaks you are looking at--- something you need to know to get your location. In other words, don't wait until you are lost to get out your map and compass!

I enjoy the process and having a map in hand lets you know what features are in your view. I've been working on getting to know all my local peaks I've lived among them for a lifetime and its fun to be able to name them as well as have a feeling for the trails, lakes and rivers around them.

This is the sort of thing you have to put up with in Seattle. I know a few of the major peaks:
Partial view of Cascade range from Seattle

Jeff McWilliams
(jjmcwill) - M
Orienteering on 03/09/2013 18:48:08 MST Print View

Speaking of orienteering, have you looked for orienteering clubs in your area?

There are clubs devoted to orienteering that often hold regular meets. They are a great way to practice your map & compass.

Brian Lewis
(brianle) - F

Locale: Pacific NW
printing free topo maps on 03/10/2013 12:38:23 MDT Print View

Daniel described a process using this site:
http://fsgeodata.fs.fed.us/rastergateway/states-regions/regions.php

The problem for me with this and similar sites is that you get a pdf file that's native size is much bigger than most printers will handle --- so you either reduce image size to too-low or you print on multiple pages. Or do a more complicated process like it sounds like Daniel is using to piece together what you want and then drive to a local kinkos or the like to actually print it.

That's way too much effort for me. For the local outdoor group that I volunteer with, a few of us analyzed this process and the result was the link I shared before,
http://www.mountaineers.org/foothills/hiking/docs/how_to_print_usgs_maps_for_free.html

The first option we listed there gives an approache that allows you to print out desired topo map chunks at decent resolution from your own printer, and without using any additional tools or a very complicated process. I.e., non-geeks can manage it just fine. I suggest that folks try this as at least their first option before deciding that they might want something more complicated.

Certainly a knowledge of more tools and choices gives you more options to control exactly what you get for the, I suspect, < 10% out there that really want that. Maybe well under 10% as I'm a somewhat geeky guy and the simple approach does me just fine in almost all cases.

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: printing free topo maps on 03/10/2013 13:33:01 MDT Print View

Brian, I'm not sure what you are using for a computer system.

With most systems, it is not the printer that is the limitation. Generally the computer operating system has a print spooler, and when you click Print in the application program, the print file is prepared and then "spooled" out to the printer a little at a time. If the print spooler of the OS can't handle it, then that is not the printer's problem.

I routinely open huge PDF files either within the PDF software or else within Adobe Photoshop. Photoshop may need to rasterize the file before it goes ahead. That takes a while, but it works. I print maps out on Super A3 paper.

--B.G.--

Jeremy B.
(requiem) - F - M

Locale: Northern California
Re: printing free topo maps on 03/10/2013 14:56:04 MDT Print View

Brian,

I just re-checked caltopo.com and they've added a feature to create PDFs. When you choose that option you can select both paper size and map scale, and get a nice overlay to show exactly what area of the map will be included.

A quick test print at 1:24000 scale is a perfect match to the corresponding scale on my plotter. Be sure when you print the PDF to disable any "ignore scaling/shrink to fit" options.

Marty C
(mcochran77) - M

Locale: Southern Oregon
Re: printing free topo maps on 03/10/2013 19:17:44 MDT Print View

Thanks Jeremy,
I just checked out CalTopo.
It has the most intuitive print to pdf interface I have seen on a free mapping tool,
especially when printing multiple pages.

Dena Kelley
(EagleRiverDee) - M

Locale: Eagle River, Alaska
REI has nav courses on 03/11/2013 10:46:30 MDT Print View

If you have an REI nearby, sign up for their mailing list. Our local REI offers free and low-fee courses every week. Orienteering with map and compass, and using a GPS are both courses that are offered every single month.

Brian Lewis
(brianle) - F

Locale: Pacific NW
Wow! Caltopo is tops on 03/11/2013 11:13:50 MDT Print View

Thanks so much, Jeremy --- caltopo.com is clearly the best way to do this! I'm definitely going to pass this on to lots of folks in my local organization.

We push everyone to bring a map on every trip they go on, but IMO we (and likely most similar non-profits) do a poor job of making it as easy as possible for them to do so.
This option ratchets down the difficulty factor another notch while adding features (I particularly like ability to easily print a UTM grid overlay).

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
a complicated process? on 03/12/2013 01:18:47 MDT Print View

moi? a complicated process? sounds like you know me pretty well.

Yes, I have a knack for the complicated and the befuddled :)

I was actually doing this today ( stitching together a topo for a trip coming up ) and I was completely rethinking the "Gimp". It is really annoying.

Regardless of how you learn the basics of navigating, i think it adds a new level of comfort and security on the trail. With map and compass in hand you have knowledge of landscape for miles surrounding your home away from home. Kudos to folks interested in learning this skill. You won't be sorry. However you arrive at the topo for the area, practice on paper at home. I think this is the best way to get over the initial learning curve.

Sincerely,

-daniel-

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
US Forestry Service Website is down... on 03/12/2013 01:37:47 MDT Print View

FYI, I haven't been able to get to the US Forestry Topos Website since about 7:30 PM PDT... that's just my luck. I recommend a site that's down.

Daniel Fish
(daniel@fishfamilypdx.com) - M

Locale: Pacific Northwest
US Forestry Service Website is back! on 03/12/2013 11:08:50 MDT Print View

Hopefully it was down for maintenance and it wasn't all of us over-taxing their server(s).

Randy Nelson
(rlnunix) - F - M

Locale: Rockies
Orienteering clubs on 03/13/2013 10:37:07 MDT Print View

"Speaking of orienteering, have you looked for orienteering clubs in your area?

There are clubs devoted to orienteering that often hold regular meets. They are a great way to practice your map & compass."

+1. I took the family to a meet run by the local club last year and it was really fun. Here's a list of clubs by state: http://www.us.orienteering.org/clubs/all

Kevin Sullivan
(bustedchucks) - F
really helpful read on 03/17/2013 10:01:00 MDT Print View

http://www.adkhighpeaks.com/forums/nava.php

Also I read the navigation/compass chapters of lots of books and the one that made it click for me what the chapter in Freedom of the Hills.

Edited by bustedchucks on 03/17/2013 10:03:09 MDT.