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just Justin Whitson
(ArcturusBear) - M
single walled shelters and condensation, a sort of solution? on 02/01/2013 15:43:10 MST Print View

Thought i would run this idea by you folks. I don't mind a little condensation, but when i'm sleeping and it's dripping on me (my face more specifically), not so much fun because it tends to wake me up. So i thought of this, take some lightweight silk, sew 4 small pieces of velcro on the corners, and a loop on the middle. Put a loop on the top bottom of my Tyvek shelter, and glue some velcro on 4 points, then hang the silk between me and the top of the shelter. It wouldn't have to cover all of me, mostly just my upper body and face area.

Silk is quite absorbent, and instead of channeling all that moisture down the sides, and to the bottom, like most synthetics would, it would tend to absorb and spread it. It will gain weight with the moisture absorption, but later you could wring it out, and very light/thin silk dries fairly quickly.

Franco Darioli
(Franco) - M

Locale: Melbourne
single walled shelters and condensation, a sort of solution? on 02/01/2013 16:22:33 MST Print View

Justin
Take a look at the Tarptent liners (for the Moment/Rainbow/Double Rainbow)
that is pretty much what you have in mind...
This is my video on the Moment liner :
Moment Liner(/a)>

Samuel C. Farrington
(scfhome) - M

Locale: Chocorua NH, USA
Justin, on 02/01/2013 23:15:47 MST Print View

Since your goal is to channel water away, why not use the very light, but water repellent fabrics available from Thru-Hiker, DYI, Titanium Goat and others. That's around .66-.8 ounces per square yard. You want lots of vapor permeability to limit condensation, but also water repellence to keep the moisture from dripping through. Since one is usually a trade off with the other, the sellers mentioned above are pretty good at giving you an idea of how they are balanced in each material.

The only problem is these are all or mostly all nylon fabrics, and they will sag considerably when the cold and humidity increases, and limit your headroom. Don't know how silk performs under these conditions - if you do, please post.

I'm a little leery of Velcro's holding power when it's wet, especially with small Velcro dots holding something up against gravity seeking to peel the Velcro open. You could try the thin plastic rectangular loops used on watchbands, sewn with twill or grosgrain tape close to the outer shell, and then run Velcro tape sewn to the liner through the loops and back upon a piece of Velcro sewn flat on the liner to get the attachment as close to the outer shell as possible and cut down on the loss of headroom. With mitten hooks, you would get more distance between the shell and liner.

You might note that many tentmakers are using .7-.8 ounce insect netting for this. TarpTent is, and Franco might post about that. They seem to feel that the netting is sufficient to stop water from condensation (not from leaks) from dripping onto you. That has been my experience also, and I agree. So I'm looking around for polyester netting in the same weight range, as it will probably have much less sag than the nylon.

After thinking about this issue a lot, I also agree that something is needed to stop the drips, and protect the occupant and gear from rubbing against condensation in single wall tents, DESPITE the weight penalty. So it may be, that it makes more sense to just design the liner into the tent. But if you already have a single wall, or really like a single wall on the market, the liner would be needed. Someday, we will have ultra-light material for tent walls that passes water vapor but keeps water out. In the meantime, some form in inner will make the tent much more comfortable. Couldn't agree more.

Edited by scfhome on 02/01/2013 23:19:35 MST.

just Justin Whitson
(ArcturusBear) - M
replies on 02/04/2013 16:40:42 MST Print View

Hi Franco and Samuel,

Right now, i have some leftover lightweight silk and it's the only lightweight material on hand right now, which is why i originally proposed using that. But, i think i will experiment with using both that and some lightweight synthetic as well out of curiosity.

Yes, i don't expect the velcro to hold up much weight in and of itself, but most of the weight would be supported from the loop on the top.