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Bivy Plans - Checking on materials
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David Scheidt
(dscheidt) - F
Re: Re: Sorry for the delay -- Sewing Help on 01/16/2013 22:59:14 MST Print View

about the zipper: my generic advice is think real hard about how it works, with all the folds involved.

Assuming there's no flap over it, the easiest way to do a good job is to put the right side of the zipper to the right side of the fabric, matching the edge of the tape to the edge of the fabric, with teeth inside:zip 1

Stich, then fold so the teeth are in the gap and stitch again:zip 2

Do the same on the other side, and install a slider:zip 3

If there is a flap, you can do pretty much the same thing, either inserting a seperate flap piece between the shell and zip, or by offsetting the zip teeth from the edge before doing the top stitching.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Finished! on 01/18/2013 22:19:20 MST Print View

Thanks for all the help! I just finished! Once the fabric was cut, it didn't take me more than 2-3 hours to do all the stitching. More (and better) photos to come, but here's a quick one with my Synmat UL 7 LW. Goodnight!

Bivy Photo 1

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: Finished! on 01/19/2013 05:17:51 MST Print View

Tyler,

Get some rest as it seems you were up late putting the final touches on you bivy.

I can't wait for the posting of the "More (and better) photos".

Party On,

Newton

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Pictures on 01/19/2013 09:30:00 MST Print View

I'm really pleased with it overall. I can see a few areas where I could improve next time I build one, but seeing as this was my first time sewing zipper (without a zipper foot too), I think it turned out great.

Here's a few pictures:

I'm 6'3'' and I feel like this is plenty of room. Getting in and out is really easy. I have the zipper going 2' across the top and 3' down the right side.
Bivy with me inside

Head-end zipper and bathtub floor detail.
Bivy head zipper detail

Foot-end detail. I had to increase the height of the "bathtub" on the top piece because it turned out to be a little wider than the floor...but no big deal. My plan was 6" high at the foot, and 10" high at the head. I think it turned out to be around 7" high at the foot and maybe 8" or 9" at the head.
Bivy foot detail

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Now for a tarp - Dimensions and plans on 01/19/2013 09:51:56 MST Print View

So my next step is to make a flat tarp to cover this bivy, which measures approx. 96" x 47" at it's longest/widest.

I have roughly 150" x 64" of Sil to work with for the tarp and my thought is to make it 5' x 9' after reading through posts on here.

My only question - How many tie-off points do I need? I'll be using it with up to 2 trekking poles and want enough variation to go from dew protection to downpour cover. I'll probably bring along an extra groundcloth if I anticipate lots of rain.

Would 5 across, 3 down, and 1 in the center be sufficient?

Edited by FightingTheTide on 01/19/2013 09:52:26 MST.

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: Now for a tarp - Dimensions and plans on 01/19/2013 10:33:19 MST Print View

Tyler,

If you want downpour protection when it's needed I'd suggest going a little longer than 9' in length.

With your bivy's length at 8' you might want to add some length to the tarp to take care of "splash" from the ground in a real downpour. I'd also "scrounge" every bit of width out of that 64" width by folding over a 1/2" two times on the hemmed edges. If you do this on both sides you could have 1/2" hemmed edges and a 5' 2" width. 2" may not sound like much but in a real "floater" you'll be glad it's there.

Tie outs, 3 on the narrow "ends" & dependent upon your length one or two space evenly on both of the long sides. This would give you 3 or 4 tie outs on each side if you include the ones on the corners of the tarp from the original 3 on each of the narrow "ends" that I spoke of earlier.

Jamie will recognize this tarp ;-)

If you ever want to set it up in a Monk Tarp configuration you'll need a tie out in the center of one of the long sides.

Eugene will recognize this one ;-)

BTW your MYOG bivy turned out great!

Do you have a final weight?

Party On,

Newton

Jeff J
(j.j.81) - F

Locale: Oregon
Looks good on 01/20/2013 14:24:42 MST Print View

I second that the bivy looks great. Roomy but not wasteful. If I ever get around to making another, that's how I'll do it.

I haven't made a tarp yet just because I have the GoLite poncho and that's 15 D fabric, lighter than I'll find at an affordable price. I like its distribution of tieouts; corners plus the middle of the sides leaves me with plenty of pitch options. So that's what I recommend.

-Jeff

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Tarp - 2 questions on 01/20/2013 21:36:31 MST Print View

Thanks! I was going for something that would offer some flexibility if I need to store some gear inside for the night.

As for the tarp - These are a few setups I would love to have the flexibility for.
Modified lean-to
Half Pyramid

So how long would my tarp need to be? Bivy length + 2 feet?
And how many tie-outs do I really need? 13 seems to be the most flexible without overkill - 5 on the long sides, 3 on the short sides, 1 in the center (corners counted twice).

EDIT - I see the setup I used in the pictures has 17 tie-outs.

Edited by FightingTheTide on 01/20/2013 21:38:26 MST.

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: Tarp - 2 questions on 01/20/2013 21:57:30 MST Print View

"So how long would my tarp need to be? Bivy length + 2 feet?"

Tyler it's relatively easy to figure.

Do the string thing.

Lay your bivy out on the ground and using mason line and some sticks "mock up" the proposed shape of your tarp over your bivy. This gives you the opportunity to adjust height and width and length inexpensively. Think of it as "drawing the edges of your tarp" using the string instead of a pencil.

When you are happy with the "drawing of your pitch" measure what you see in front of you and size your tarp accordingly.

I'm guessing that the one in the picture in your post is an 8' x 10' tarp with 2' spacing on the tie outs on the small edge.

Party On,

Newton

Edited by Newton on 01/20/2013 21:59:31 MST.

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Looks good on 01/21/2013 17:29:25 MST Print View

Nice looking bivy!

Flat tarp? - use cheap materials so after you decide there's too much rain blowing under the edges and you go to a tarp/tent that goes pretty close to the ground all the way around, you won't have wasted a lot of money on the flat tarp materials.

(half humorous)

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Deciding b/w flat or tarp tent on 01/24/2013 19:43:06 MST Print View

Those who use flat tarps - would a 62" wide sil tarp offer enough protection if the wind and rain pick up? My bivy is 47" at it's widest.

Those who use tarp tents - would it be overkill to make a tarp tent without a floor or mesh, and use my bivy underneath? My only concern would be more weight over a flat tarp.

Once I get a better idea of what I need (flat tarp or tarp tent), I'll use the string method to mock up a final plan.


Also...

I bought a scale! The bivy weighs in at 8.8 oz.

Edited by FightingTheTide on 01/24/2013 19:46:10 MST.

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Deciding b/w flat or tarp tent on 01/24/2013 20:50:00 MST Print View

I use bivy under floorless tarp tent and it works good. If the weather is good I don't bother setting up tent.

With raised edge flat tarp, if for example, the edge is a foot off the ground, I like to be a foot back from the edge to avoid rain splash.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: Deciding b/w flat or tarp tent on 01/25/2013 13:19:36 MST Print View

I've looked at the dimensions and did a quick mock-up of what it would look like to have my bivy under a 62" wide tarp and it's not going to happen. I think it would be foolish to rely on that if conditions turned for the worst...especially since I'm new to tarps.

If I cut my raw silnylon in half and used a flat felled seam, I could end up with a 10' x 6' tarp. I would use it as 6' wide, 10' long.

It's either this or order some more materials to make a tarptent. Back to the drawing board...

Jamie Shortt
(jshortt) - MLife

Locale: North Carolina
Re: Re: Re: Deciding b/w flat or tarp tent on 01/26/2013 10:04:29 MST Print View

I haven't read the entire thread but did catch the familiar shot of my backyard (thanks Newton) so I had to reply.

Tyler it sounds like your bivy is on the large size so adjust what I say appropriately. I have good number of nights in the lytw8 bivy and bivy's of similar size under a flat 5 x 8 tarp or 5 x 8 poncho tarp. On several occasions I did see rain that did include windy conditions. Never did I get wet from the rain. I setup my tarp just like the picture that Newton posted. That picture is a setup in my back yard so it is not from an actual trip but it is the way I pretty much setup all my tarps. With respect to rain from the sides...I set my tarps up extremely close to the ground. This does not give much room to situp or manuever around, but I am mostly sleeping so it doesn't matter. What this does do is protect me from weather.

If you look at the picture the tarp touches the ground in the rear and is only inches above the ground up front. Even if rain were coming from a 45 degree angle its only going to enter say 6 inches from one side. If rain is blowing like that I can slide to the edge other edge if need be, but not sure I've ever needed to do that. I generally keep my shoes near the top and do recall moving them to keep them out of the rain.

The only real exposure you have is rain coming from the front. You will want to watch out for this and try to predict wind direction before setting up the tarp. I have noticed this and I simply slide the bivy back towards the lower end if wind changes direction and blows into the front. Some people may not like the need to adjust your position depending on the weather. To me it is actually part of the fun. Approaching nature with minimal dependcy on gear and using my brain to adapt to any situation. This is just what I like. The majority of backpackers probably prefer less adaptation...setup and forget it. If this is more your strategy then yes I would argue for a larger tarp design or a tarp tent.

What I have found to be a great compromise is a trapezoid tarpt. It provide a little extra room up front, taking the width from the rear. More like this....9 feet long, 6 feet wide in front and 4 feet wide in rear can be made from 3 yards of silnylon.

Not sure if this rambling helps or not. Regardless, I think you will have a magnified outdor experience using gear you made yourself. Nice job.

Jamie

Edited by jshortt on 01/26/2013 10:08:39 MST.

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Trapezoid Tarp - design, beaks, and size on 01/26/2013 11:54:29 MST Print View

Jamie, your ramblings are much appreciated. Where in NC do you live?

And which picture are you referring to? The first or second one Newton posted?

You hit the nail on the head with a trapezoid. Here's a few pictures of what I'm thinking. Still debating on beaks. Here's two ideas I have with design.

First idea - cutting material from the head and foot, flipping it, and sewing it back on to increase the ridgeline length. Another advantage is the trekking pole in front would be inside the tarp without sacraficing usable floor length. There's a lot more sewing and sealing going on here. Not sure if it's worth it, but it does provide maximum coverage. The foot-end beak could be overkill.
Beak option 1.1
Beak option 1.2

Second idea - cut an angle from the top where the two panels join at the head end, sew back together to form beak. This is a little less coverage, but much less sewing/sealing. Another disadvantage is the trekking pole sits further back into the tarp. Coverage should be good though.
Beak option 2

Side by side:
Both beak options

And would it benefit me to cut down my bivy so I can make a slightly smaller tarp? I'm okay doing that.

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: Trapezoid Tarp - design, beaks, and size on 01/26/2013 12:14:52 MST Print View

Tyler,

It was the first small A frame pitched tarp. Hover over it with you mouse and you'll see the note referring to Jamie.

IMHO beaks aren't worth it. What I prefer is to extend the ridge line of a shaped catenary cut tarp out 12" to 18" leaving the front and rear tie outs "swept back" towards the middle of the tarp. It's similar to what is done with the Nightwing tarp from Six Moon Designs.

Nightwing Tarp

You get the benefit of a beak without having to crawl on your belly to get under your shelter.

Face the foot end of your tarp into the prevailing wind. Think of it as an umbrella for your bivy.

Party On,

Newton

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
My version of the Nightwing - the Fightwing on 01/26/2013 15:12:23 MST Print View

I made a Nightwing recently per the specs on SMD. It turned out to be a hack job. Great design, though!

I just spent the last few hours with scale models of my raw material and came up with what I think will be the final product. Gotta love lazy saturdays...and gotta love finishing in time to see NC State beat down on UNC! GO PACK!

Anyway...the Fightwing has 8' (length) of floor space and isn't going to be roomy by any standards, but it should work! (fingers crossed). Also, I played around with different "rain angles" with and without a beak, and found a small beak to actually be somewhat beneficial since the overhang on each end is only 1'. 45 degrees was optimal.

Protactor skills - checked "rain angles" before I cut the paper.
Fightwing 1

Here's the front. Should be a tight fit!
Fightwing 2

The foot-end. I do plan on closing it off in some fashion - preferably without having to sew the doors on and instead use the existing material. Shouldn't be hard. I might even let it be open closer to the ground for ventilation. This would allow me to scoot closer to the foot end if for some reason the wind switches.
Fightwing 2

Now to build the scale template.

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: My version of the Nightwing - the Fightwing on 01/26/2013 16:19:26 MST Print View

Tyler,

If you are going to include a beak on your tarp take a look at what I did with mine to make entry easier.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=36489

Zippered Beak Tarp

It made entry and exit less of an exercise in "human origami". ;-)

Party On,

Newton

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Re: My version of the Nightwing - the Fightwing on 01/26/2013 16:32:04 MST Print View

That must be a zipper

That works pretty good.

I have evolved to "half pyramid":

half pyramid

Then there's no contortions getting into bed,...

Tyler Miller
(FightingTheTide) - F - M

Locale: Southeast
Re: Re: Re: My version of the Nightwing - the Fightwing on 01/26/2013 17:11:24 MST Print View

Good stuff! My beak won't be that big since I'm limited with the material I have...but I'll work that into the plans if possible.

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