Man, that is so weird seeing the pack for real now. The design is so similar to the one I'm working on it's uncanny. I guess the demands of the design lead you to the same typological conclusions. But I must say the use of the drybag's lower slots to secure the shoulder straps is ingenious. I never even looked at the holes for their possible usefulness in the design. Wonderful! Just curious how do you keep the tendency of the drybag from rounding out against your back? Is there a foam frame? I want to buy this pack, so I'm curious about that. Thanks!

These packs look nice.
Do I understand it correctly this is a one of a kind offer? So once the stock is sold, that's it?
I hope some more pictures of the pack will be added to get an exact idea of how the pack looks and works in all directions.

Miguel-

There is a dense 1/8" foam framesheet that is in the backpanel of the pack that is non-removeable. In additional, there is a piece of 3/8" foam against your back. Additional rigidity and support come from the twin aluminum stays that are removeable as well.

Glad you like the pack and thanks for the kudos about the shoulder strap anchoring. Not only was it a good idea, BUT it also works really well! Always nice when that happens...

Brian

KEN: Yes, that's exactly what I do. My packraft does not get stowed inside the dry bag. So, the dry bag gets stowed in the bottom part of the harness, and the raft gets rolled and either stowed sideways in the top of the harness, under the roll top strap. I use a 4-piece paddle too, but unless I'm bushwhacking, I keep it at 2 pieces and stow the paddles down inside the beavertail, paddles down. The four pieces of the paddles will also fit into the 65L dry bag.

TOM: I'll be adding many more detailed photos next week. I'm taking this final prototype on a hike in the Red Desert and packrafting in the Wind Rivers next week. After that trip, I'll give Brian the green light on remaining minor issues, and this first batch will be wrapped up. This batch (Spring 2007) is a one time deal, but if customer feedback is good and it sells out, then we'll do more!

I'm just wondering how those who use hydration bladders while hiking are going to manage with this pack. I realize you can place a bladder in the exterior pocket, but this would place a tremendous amount of torque on the back. Placing a bladder inside would obviously compromise water proofing values in order to run the tube (somehow) out through the dry bag closure. For me, and the fact that I absolutely despise hiking with bottles would make the pack a non-starter.

I guess I'm a strange one, but I would much prefer to stick with my ULA Catalyst, and continue waterproofing it with a compactor bag and/or pack cover, and have a pack that I can drain easily should any interior liquid leak.

Piece of cake - in fact - quite a lot easier to deal with than conventional packs.

The bladder goes in the EXACT same spot as a regular pack with a hydration sleeve, but OUTSIDE the packbag (between the pack bag and framesheet), so access is easy!

And, if you want the bladder to ride higher, you can use cord through the grommet loops on the bladder and affix it to the top of the framesheet.

when will you determine the price?

George: It's in progress. It will be a few weeks, still.

Is there a way to resize the pictures so that they do not overlap the specs for the pack?

Thanks,

JA

I'm so getting one of these!! Sign me up!

Edited by SmokiesHanger on 04/08/2007 14:59:34 MDT.

I'm definately salivating over the pack! If there's a pre-purchase list going around. Sign this canuk up.
I've been dreaming about this design.

Edited by turk on 04/08/2007 15:32:12 MDT.

Thanks. From the pictures, and the way the suspension is described, it seemed the framesheet would be be too closely attached to the crybag to slide in a bladder. Your explanation clears this up.

How durable are these POE dry bags actually? Is it a delicate fabric or is it still quite robust?

It's not entirely clear to me whether only the zip gives access to the mesh pocket or that the pocket can also be reached from above. The dscription also mentions the use of the daisy chain for strapping an ice axe or trekking poles but it appears to me to be a less ideal solution when the mesh pocket is being filled with rather bulky items pushing the axe or poles to far from the back. Using the side compression straps for this is not practicle also due to the lack of a side pocket to store them, certainly when the pack is undrfilled. So what is the best way to store these items or how practicle would it be to make a small side pocket?

The drypacks are quite robust. Much more so than the lighter drybags of Sea to Summit. The fabric has a similar feel to that of say the new GoLite Jam2 or the Mountainsmith Ghost (though probably not as strong as the Ghost's material). The material is a bit stiff, with good fiber reinforcment. I think it can handle most of what you would encounter, even rock scrambling. And yet it's quite light, too.

Is there a cost estimate?
How suited is it for water / portage use?

Doug


.

Tom -

The dry bags are rather robust. I think you'll find them to have very good abrasion resistance. I've bushwhacked in mine a lot, and they've not been punctured. Don't count on them to resist desert thorns, etc. however. Willows, slide alder, devils club, no problem.

The zip is a vertical side zip that gives access to the mesh pocket. It's sealed from above.

The daisy chain, even when the mesh pocket is full and bulging "is one solution" (!). I've stowed trekking poles in the comp straps and just made sure to loop the lower strap through the handle straps for extra security. I've carried an ice axe when the pack is both bulging and underfilled on the daisy and it doesn't seem to be a problem, even if it lacks some aesthetic appeal because it isn't lying perfectly flat.

The compression straps fit many of the aftermarket "side pockets" very well, or you can make your own.

I have huge McHale "Super Side Pockets" that fit the pack, these may be my solution for serious overloading!

Doug: Costing is in progress. We will do a prepurchase on these packs. Look for that after April 18. We gotta get through Cocoons first, which go out for prepurchase tomorrow.

The pack is designed for water/portage/swimming/packrafting. You can extend the top strap with your own combination of webbing and buckles and carry anything you want in it: "Canoes!" "Chainsaws!" etc you know the routine.

I am interested too.

For the mathematically challenged:

1 liter = 61.024 cubic inches
1000 cubic inches = 16.387 liters

Therefore........
50 liters = 3051 cubic inches......call it 3000
65 liters = 3996 cubic inches......call it 4000



Total weight = 40 ounces with 50L bag; 40.8 oz with 65L bag

Weight: Harness (w/o frame): 26.0 oz; Two aluminum frame stays (included): 4.3 oz (for both); Dry Bags (included): 50L (9.7 oz); 65L (10.5 oz)

Edited by wandering_bob on 04/09/2007 15:12:31 MDT.

How would this pack compare to a Arcteryx NAOS or a ULA catalyst with at S to S eVent drybag inside. What would be a comfortable weight limit for this pack?
Don