"I would appreciate (and so would Ryan I am sure), ANY info about other solutions from other open Forums which are working!"

-------------------------------------------



Here is one at the bottom of this post.

The site was started 10 years ago after a similar site instituted PAY to post membership requirement. The PAY to post site also offered a store and a print magazine.

When the new FREE site opened up, the majority of the membership jumped to the new site.

Over time the PAY to post site diminished and was eventually bought by the mentioned FREE site.

The site topic is Tent Trailers. Pretty small niche in the camper world. A vastly smaller number of tent trailers are sold each versus the number of UL packs!

As to Ryan being interested - I doubt it. When he ways exploring was to make BPL work a couple years ago, I PM'd him, offering to put him in touch with the owner of the FREE tent trailer site. Never heard back from him.

BTW, this site has been expanding its offerings during the economic turn-down.

popupexplorer.com

Edited by ngatel on 11/09/2012 17:23:49 MST.

"Thanks Ryan! GOOD JOB!!!"

+100!!! Simple, effective, and to the point. I do confess to being mystified at the carping about charging a $5 SPAM deterrent fee for new registrants as a bridge solution. Especially without any better solutions on offer.

NM

Edited by dillonr on 11/10/2012 06:39:10 MST.

Still free at other forums. We did this to ourselves, the forum users. Keep on saying that the real value here at BPL is in the forums. Many have said that they don't get value out of the articles here. So what is RJ going to do?, capitalize on that and turn it into something he can charge for. Like the strategic planning "retreat".

And had the MLifers been receiving the interim reports and updates of BPL, like we paid for, this might have all been prevented if someone did not have a colossal ego and could accept help from a community that offered it time and time again.

Sad to see this.

Cynical. Oh well It's how I think.

Prove me wrong.

Edited by kthompson on 11/09/2012 19:38:30 MST.

From Ryan's first post above:
"However, all previous forum posters (anyone who posted in the forums prior to the lockdown) will be grandfathered in for life and won't have to pay this fee, ever."

I might be wrong but i think that means all the previous free members will be let back in free.

The $5 charge will only affect newly registering members.

So in effect BPL will be right back to where we were before the spam debacle and everyone will be here; life, member, and free members will all be able to post free.

If the market will not bear new registrations at 5 dollars then time will certainly tell.

Has anyone considered the approach taken by Whiteblaze?
That site is free but donations are accepted.

What if BPL were to offer that $5 membership but and also solicit donations with a percentage of each going to trail protection groups like the PCTA, ATC, etc?
That way giving money to BPL would also mean giving money to the trails as well.

Might take the sting out of this whole mess and turn it around into something good for all.

"Still free at other forums. We did this to ourselves, the forum users. Keep on saying that the real value here at BPL is in the forums. Many have said that they don't get value out of the articles here. So what is RJ going to do?, capitalize on that and turn it into something he can charge for. Like the strategic planning "retreat".

And had the MLifers been receiving the interim reports and updates of BPL, like we paid for, this might have all been prevented if someone did not have a colossal ego and could accept help from a community that offered it time and time again.

Sad to see this."

What does this have to do with stopping the SPAM?

Well Tom. People saw problems coming for years. Some had offered help. Some don't even get a reply. Other forums continue on without charging, still during this global, all encompassing spam attack .

So charging to post must not be the only option.

And, please no need to yell spam, I'm tired too.

Almost forgot, Had the Mlifers received their info they would have been even better informed. And in a better position to help. Isn't that what that strategic planning forum is supposed to do? Solve BPL problems for Ryan? This would be a good one to solve.

Edited by kthompson on 11/09/2012 22:15:43 MST.

Good to see a solution chosen and now being implemented. While yes, there were dozens of different suggestions presented by dozens of different cooks in the kitchen, ultimately it's the BPL staff's decision and more importantly their name(s) on the line. One thing that I find comedic about the persistent haranguing and insistence that the community be allowed to help is that at the end of the day, if those same community people who opt themselves in decide "eh, f*ck this I don't want to continue for ______ reason" and leave, they've got zero to lose. Not reputation, not money, and only time that can't be that valuable because it cost absolutely nothing to anyone. And that's not even speaking to the quality of the suggestions, which in calling them all "quality" is a stretch. Of those people how many even have experience running a major forum much less a pay-for business?

Community efforts are fool's gold, and while appeasing to the mob mentality initially, in and of themselves it takes effort to organize the community which, in this case would certainly be more effort than simply using the resources at hand to come up with the best spit-balled solution. Let's "what if" though....

What if Ryan Jordan decides "yeah okay it takes a village." Then what? He has to get the word out, he has to organize and bring order to however many people wanting to do however many things, and then see it through. He has to decide which suggestions to follow, which to cull. Now you have people who are pleased and working, and a group of people who most definitely feel shot-down. It's a no-win situation. And again, if volunteers with no stake in the outcome other than not-being-butthurt decide to split, BPL is back to square one. Alternatively if someone in BPL follows one of those crap ideas through and it doesn't pan out, it's still BPL's fault in the end in the eyes of everyone.

Lastly, what's so wrong with the BPL forum software? You can post can't you? Hell you can even inline post images using plain old HTML, links too. The PM system is clunky but then again I only have to check my email to see who PMed me and it took me precisely 3 minutes to get accustomed. I've run several PHPBB boards (with your tax dollars paying me, US citizens) and I can tell you it's utter sh*t (too many poorly implemented features, not secure as you would like to dream, is difficult to modify lest you essentially rewrite entire portions of its business logic, and hard to administer, to name a few). Plus it's ugly.

My advice? F*ck it, keep on trucking BPL! Satisfy the majority (or even super-majority) of forum users as you're doing and go back to content creation because it's where the money is made and it's what keeps the lights on. Nowhere can you advertise "free forums now 100% Ken Thompson Satisfying and now extra-free!" and make MORE money. Or any money for that matter.

Edited by aeriksson on 11/10/2012 02:27:38 MST.

RJ has had legitimate offers from professional programmers that he does not have the courtesy to even reply. But hey, your the expert here now aren't you Alex? You've seen it all from day one. Thanks for singling me out.

'Satisfy the majority (or even super-majority) of forum users as you're doing and go back to content creation because it's where the money is made and it's what keeps the lights on."

Because the reader generated material on the forums makes no money. OOOPS! it does now.

I realize that no one solution will please everyone. But there has to a better one than this.

Continued remarks about BPL staff kills me. There is Ryan on payroll with sometimes help from the web intern. That's it. Roger C. does it free. Everyone else has jumped ship and don't even post here anymore
Carol, Jay, Don, Will and Janet, Chris, plus more have come and eventually leave for good.

Edit: One more thing. As BPLs favorite critic, Ryan expects this type of post from me.

Edited by kthompson on 11/10/2012 07:56:08 MST.

Going to go figure out what has happened to the engine management computer on my Dad's 2004 truck today.

Alex, you can help diagnose it.
Ken, you get to haggle with the parts house for the best price.

You both are quite remarkable people.

Keep it real fellas.

Cheers

Too funny a b. I was a Mercedes parts specialist for 12 years. The markup is insane.

Round and round and round and round and round and round we go.

Correction:

> There is Ryan on payroll
Ryan has not been on the payroll for some time now. He has a full-time outside job in order to support his family. GFC...

Cheers

Ken wrote: "Too funny a b. I was a Mercedes parts specialist for 12 years. The markup is insane."

That markup is compensation for putting up with the owners!

I sold auto parts for 25 years, but haven't leaned on a counter since 1995. I'd rather get a root canal without anesthesia ;)

You should try Peugeot for an interesting owner demographic.

>You should try Peugeot for an interesting owner demographic.

Hey now, what are you saying...

"And, please no need to yell spam, I'm tired too."

Then get some sleep and come back when you can answer my question: What does your rambling rehash of prevous whining about everything wrong with BPL have to do with the problem at hand?

Semantics Roger. He who pays the bills and has access to the bank account is on payroll. Many these days work two or more jobs to make ends meet, I do.

Edit: @ Tom. Later perhaps. Just got done with work and need to head off to the store. But really, you can't see how this all fits together after all the years you have spent here? Look at the forum admin. and support index and read some from way, way back and see what's changed.

@ Helwig, Some day in the mountains this will be so laughable.

Edited by kthompson on 11/10/2012 17:56:38 MST.

"But really, you can't see how this all fits together after all the years you have spent here? Look at the forum admin. and support index and read some from way, way back and see what's changed."

Slow child that I am, Ken, I can sort of see, dimly, what has changed, without even cheating by referring to the FA&S Index. What I can't see is how it relates to dealing with....SPAM.

Will this new user type "Forum Member" be able to create threads in Gear Swap? Could be an interesting incentive for newcomers to pay the $5...

"Will this new user type "Forum Member" be able to create threads in Gear Swap? Could be an interesting incentive for newcomers to pay the $5..."

Looks that way. Check the subscription page.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/bpl_subscriptions.html