I do all of my hiking in southern California (Gorgonio, San Gabriels, Jacinto, Sespe, etc) and during the summer in the Sierras. I recently went up to the Emigrant Wilderness and because it was colder and snowing/raining I wore a rain jacket. Other than that one time I've never put on my rain jacket, even when it was raining. I don't mind getting wet and as long as I keep moving I don't get cold. Is a rain jacket and/or pants something you always take, no matter the destination or weather forecast?

I'm in So. Cal. also. I always carry a minimal poncho in the Sierras. In our local mountains I'll look at the weather forecast and plan accordingly. I don't always pack rain gear in other words and when I do it's minimal. Even in the Sierras the last time I wore rain gear (driducks top at that time) was in 2009 on a JMT thru. It was an all day steady, but light, rain and I was soaked by the time I got into camp from sweating under the top. I went to a poncho after that.

I live in Colorado. It really doesn't rain much, here. In the mountains a lot of peaks get mid-day showers in some seasons so I almost always take one if I'm in the mountains, but if I'm on the flats and the forecast says no rain I usually just take a wind shirt- it is water resistant enough to get me through a quick sprinkle.

Edited by acrosome on 06/22/2012 12:51:00 MDT.

Here in the Pacific NW, it's colder and wetter. Even though we normally have a 2-3 month dry spell in the summer, the weather is definitely not always normal. Nor can weather forecasts out here on the edge of thousands of miles of ocean be relied upon. I always take rain gear. If I don't need it for rain, I may need it for warmth!

We mostly hike in the Adirondacks, White Mountains, Virginia or other eastern areas where it seems it can rain any time, day or night, independent of the weather report. We always bring rain jackets and umbrellas. And we've never regretted doing this!

No.

I usually do bring a rain shell, but find that it stays in my pack more often than not- I'm a NM resident. Last trip out I left my rain shell behind and used the Chrome Dome/ windshirt combination and was very happy with the setup, so much so that I will likely use that technique for most of my trips now on where I'm on trail and the weather doesn't justify a full shell.

Yes. Usually a poncho. Even if no rain is forecast I can use it for emergencies or even a sun awning, for trips where I don't bring a shelter.

At a minimum I bring a wind shirt (Houdini) and a poncho of some sort.

Yes

It rains a lot in Oregon and Washington

In the summer you can have thunderstorms

Also provides warmth and wind protection

I always, always carry my rain parka, either a GTX PacLite parka or an eVent parka. This applies to both day hikes and backpacking trips.

I depend on my polyester or nylon long sleeved shirts for some wind protection but think it's excessive to carry both a "wind shirt" and a WPB rain parka. If it's so windy and chilly that you need a "wind shirt" then you probably are better off wearing a WPB parka (IMHO and in my experience).

**Then too you can zip up your parka, cinch down the hood and put it over the foot of your sleeping bag to keep off tent wall condensation and give you at least another 5 F. of warmth at the foot of your bag.

P.S.> The other question is "Do you always carry your rain pants?".
My answer is "sometimes", depending on location (Always in the Rockies) and the forecast.

Edited by Danepacker on 06/24/2012 13:36:02 MDT.

Eric, it depends on where you are really. I've hiked in the desert mountains in spring where the sun was brutally warm but the wind was so much that I was freezing. A wind shirt cut the wind without providing much insulation...a WPB would have been way too hot to comfortably hike.

As for always bringing a rain jacket, I don't and it almost always bites me in the rear (despite hiking in a region that "supposedly" only get a handful of rain days a year). Now if I'm hiking minimally I'll throw in one of those cheapy plastic rain ponchos for just in case moments (only weighs 2-3 oz) so that should the need arise I have some water protection. That's usually only on short overnights. Anything longer and I'll throw in a full jacket.

"I always take rain gear. If I don't need it for rain, I may need it for warmth!"

+1 You don't have to be very high up before it gets cold when it rains up here. For me it falls under the heading of emergency gear during the summer, and a frequently used part of my wardrobe the rest of the year. It is always wise to plan for worst case scenarios in the Cascades; getting injured 8-10 miles from TH and then getting hit by a soaking rain at perhaps 5,000' or so is not pleasant to contemplate. For me, the extra 10 oz is a small price to pay for peace of mind.

mine rarely comes out of the pack, fortunately it's light (7 oz) and rolls up small

for day trips w/ little chance of rain I think I'm going to try one of the $1 ponchos, they are packed tiny and can't weigh much more than an ounce

I ALWAYS have my windshirt though, it's gotten me by on numerous rain events, even on the rare occasion it gets wetted through- it still provides wind protection and dries in a snap

PNW folks

what is the good light weight moderately priced raingear suitable for PNW. Right now I have synthetic base layers from target. Patagonia R1 fleece, Eddie Bauer Sirocco wind shirt and planning to get Patagonia nano puff. Still undecided on a rain jacket and pants.

I carry one on every trip that is over night. Can't remember using it for rain though. I use it for trapping heat and it works really great for that. Since I carry DriDucks, I only carry about 9 oz. for both pants and jacket. Been thinking of leaving the pants at home. Never take them out of my pack.

Mike,

I'm curious what $1 poncho you're referring to? I've thought about just bringing a heavy duty trash bag and cut some arm holes...anyone have some thoughts on that?

Yes as it is used as a rain jacket, wind jacket, and even for additional warmth if my sleep system isn't sufficient.

Its raining cats and dogs right here now in late june ... If u didnt have rain cover in the hills right now youd go hypothermic if you didnt keep moving ...

I own and use an or helium for the just in case jacket ... 6 oz that packs to the size of an orange ... You never know when youll get stuck ...

Always.

No, not exactly. While I always have some sort of protection for rain or inclement weather, what form it is depends on where I'm going and the forecast. ie, if it's in the mountains or rain forest areas, I will usually take an actual rain jacket. However, if it's low lands or dry areas, then I may only take a driducks top, wind shirt, or dime store tarp.

mama mia - I've always used Gore-Tex or eVent rain jacket. I make my own so I can't recommmend a brand, but they're sort of generic. Longer is better. Fewer pockets and stuff is better because there's less weight. EVent is supposed to be a little better.

Dri-Ducks are supposed to be good - cheap - light - not very durable but you can afford to replace occasionally

Always. I live in the Pacific Northwest, so the possibility of rain is high and the possibility of drying out is low. I carry a poncho for fair weather day hikes, so I have emergency shelter and rain gear in one. For that matter, I always have a spare layer like a fleece, light cap and gloves, spare socks, and space blanket bivy.

As I sit here at home in Seattle on June 23rd, it is 54F at 7:30AM, with a predicted high of 63F and 60% chance of precip (it is raining now). That is at or near sea level. Moving into the lower Cascade foothills, the forecast high is 55F with 80% chance of precip and 37F(!!!) overnight. That is classic hypothermia weather--- I don't want to get caught out for a night without rain gear and some sort of basic shelter.

We've been calling the recent cold wet weather "Junuary" :)

I agree that DriDucks are a good CYA light-n-cheap rain gear.

Edited by dwambaugh on 06/23/2012 08:43:14 MDT.

I don't understand what it means when they say there's a 60% chance of precip and it's raining : )

jerry pondered, "I don't understand what it means when they say there's a 60% chance of precip and it's raining : )"

Hehehe-- yeah. I figure anything over 40% means it *will* rain. Higher percentages just describe how *long* it will rain :)

I'm not trusting my comfort and life on a weatherman in the Pacific NW. Shift the jet stream a few degrees and you go from summer to winter in a day, or less.

Along with 260+ days of overcast and high, COLD humidity, what most people don't realize about PNW weather is that it rarely really pours: it DRIZZLES for hours, days, WEEKS, and everything around you is a dewy, soggy, mass of green (unless it is mud). Three days of rain might not come to 1/2", which might be a quick thunder shower in other parts of the world.

Jerry you are just getting the 60% up front. Like an advance. Non negotiable.

Living in SoCal I did not own a rain jacket.

Up here, you bet I take one.

Erik- something along these lines http://www.amazon.com/Emergency-Poncho-Orange-Color-0-02mm-Size/dp/B005NRTZZ6

close to a disposable poncho, but in a pinch would work- I'm guessing about 1 ounce

MIke

I always carry at least a windshirt on overnight or longer trips. I only bring a rain jacket when there's a reasonable chance of rain and/or an uncertain forecast.

For southern and central CA, that means I almost never bring a proper rain jacket.

Along with 260+ days of overcast and high, COLD humidity, what most people don't realize about PNW weather is that it rarely really pours: it DRIZZLES for hours, days, WEEKS, and everything around you is a dewy, soggy, mass of green (unless it is mud). Three days of rain might not come to 1/2", which might be a quick thunder shower in other parts of the world.

Dale, how does a DWR windshirt (e.g. Houdini, Sirocco, etc.) hold up to that sort of low volume/long duration drizzle? I'd expect that for me, full rain gear wouldn't be sufficiently breathable in such conditions.

I bring a GI poncho (yep, it's heavy; but, it's also cheap and a multi-use item: poncho, pack cover, "front porch" groundsheet for my hammock, improv Grizz beak to close off one end of the hex tarp if the wind really starts to blow, my wind gear for Florida, and 1/2 of an emergency bivy in case I get forced down during a day hike--the other half being a space blanket) on every trip. The forecast for FL any time between April and October usually includes a 30% chance of rain in the afternoon, usually with lightning and thunder (translated: "It's gonna pour for an hour somewhere between 2 and 6 PM!").

So, it's worth covering my bases to have the poncho. While it's rare for me to feel cold above 50 F, if that rain is coming down hard enough and I'm tired enough, well...let's just say that I'm glad to have the poncho.

A windshirt won't cut it, and I like to use one too. IMHO, a windshirt provides a wind barrier to add to your base layer or fleece, yet remains breathable. Great for when you need that extra bit when exertion is low and the wind is cooling you too much. It can't be relied on for a rain shell. It will handle a light sprinkle, but not an all day drizzle and wet brush. I think anyone who relies on a windshirt for rain protection runs a very real risk of hypothermia. If you are hiking in the Pacific Northwest, you need rain gear, period.

Always rain protection, but not always a rain jacket. Depends on expected conditions. Hikes in the northwest, monsoon season in the Rockies, and when the forecast calls for rain lasting more than one day, then yes. If not I'll pare back. Summers in the Sierra, Grand Canyon in the winter I carry a poncho. Can fashion it as shelter at night if needed.

And then I always carry an oversize trash bag that I can fashion as a poncho in a pinch.

http://www.sportsmanswarehouse.com/sportsmans/Frogg-Toggs-DriDucks-Emergency-Poncho/productDetail/Rain-Ponchos/prod999901361562/cat117605

Walmart started selling Frogg Toggs.

Anna,

Do you know how much it weighs?

"how does a DWR windshirt (e.g. Houdini, Sirocco, etc.) hold up to that sort of low volume/long duration drizzle? I'd expect that for me, full rain gear wouldn't be sufficiently breathable in such conditions."

It won't, pure and simple. The reality is that, either with or without rain gear, you're going to get wet in a classic all day PNW rain/drizzle. The difference is that with full rain gear you will be wet and warm, but without it you will be cold, wet, and at serious risk of hypothermia. It happens all the time up here. A personal example from last weekend: I was out on a 12 miler that started out in a slight drizzle. I hiked without my rain gear for the first 2 hours, but as we gained elevation the drizzle turned into soaking, increasingly cold rain and I started to shiver. I donned my rain shell and very quickly warmed up. I was just as wet as I would have been without the shell, but comfortably warm. Venting kept the heat from building up to an uncomfortable level. I would not have wanted to try and finish that hike without my shell. This is a very typical situation up here.

Edited: Footnote-a windshirt would not have lasted 10 minutes in that rain, and I would have been in a very tenuous situation, with at least an hour and a half hike back to the car when I was getting cold. Hypothermia would have been a serious concern.

Edited by ouzel on 06/23/2012 17:28:19 MDT.

It's interesting that none of us here from the Pacific NW will leave home without rain gear, and none of us trust the weather forecasts, either!

I never did figure out this percentage business, either. We had a 50% chance of rain forecast for today, which may be correct because it rained fairly hard all morning but cleared up in early afternoon and is now sunny. However, more clouds are rolling in, so I don't think we're through for the day!

I never have found the perfect rain gear. I've tried several different Goretex configurations and couldn't determine any difference between those and non-breathable raingear. I haven't tried eVent but my budget won't run to that anyway. I tried Marmot Precip and it wetted out during an hour's walk (in cold rain, so I wasn't sweating) after I'd had it only a few months (and worn it only in town). It wasn't just damp; it was as wet inside as it was out! So it's once again back to non-breathable raingear. I currently have an anorak (cut really big for more ventilation) and rainpants of silnylon. One advantage is that I can use it as a vapor barrier suit in my sleeping bag in below-freezing weather. If it's warm and raining, I just get wet--my clothing will dry in 15-20 minutes on my body once the rain stops. If it's cold and raining, I wear only a base layer under the silnylon anorak and am quite comfortable (it does help that it's cut really loose!).

Most o the time I do. Summer along the coast from Big Sur to Fort Bragg, I don't bother with any more than dry clothes, a wind shirt or the like. That said, when it's colder - or I am in other parts of the country - it's easy to bring a 7-9 oz. rain jacket or a 7 oz. poncho tarp. I like the poncho, as it's a pack cover and shelter too. My close-to-home trips are point Reyes and the sierras west of Tahoe. The first boast some wet foggy days and the latter, cold. The rain-proof layer is too little weight for the dry comfort when needed. Sunny, hot, dry, June weekends, though, odds of either for any prolonged period are slim.

Edited by bcutlerj on 06/23/2012 18:27:18 MDT.

The Driducks emergency poncho will work, but it is small and won't cover a pack. You would need to tuck it under the shoulder straps and they will get damaged.

The weight was 2.8oz on the ones I experimented with. I tried making a pull-over style top out of one and extended the back of another. They aren't worth the bother to adapt. I think they would be okay as a backup for kids or a better-than-nothing option, maybe a little better than a plastic one. If they would make them full sized and long in the back I wouldn't mind taking one for a day hike option.

The "regular" Driducks poncho is still weak on the back length. It will cover much more than the emergency version and last longer.

"The "regular" Driducks poncho is still weak on the back length. It will cover much more than the emergency version and last longer."

Thanks, Dale. I was thinking of it for Sierra trips, because I almost never have a need for my O2 Rainshield jacket, but it sounds like the shortcomings outweigh the benefit of a couple ounces saved. I think I'll stand pat.

The poncho is a good size for me but I am 5' tall and 105lbs

Thanks Tom, Dale! I haven't had the opportunity to test my windshirt in wet conditions yet, so wasn't sure at what point on the rain/drizzle scale it'd give out. My current hard shell appears to be only rated 3k/3k and what DWR there is needs refreshing, so a modern shell sits pretty high up on my shopping list.

I always figure that % rain forecast is an estimate of how much of the time it will be raining. So I take a 60% forecast to mean it will be raining 60% of the day. Then again, living in NZ which bears many similarities to the PNW (though even less predictable) I never trust the forecast even if the chance is 0%. The minimum I take, even on a day hike, is a cuben poncho that can also serve as a ground cloth or shelter if I get stuck out overnight. This can happen even if it's not raining where I am due to rain higher up suddenly making a river unfordable. I also plan for situations such as injury that may change even the best laid plans for a day hike. It really comes down to how risk-averse you are, and the likely conditions you hike in. It's just a personal choice.

I have one but I am relegating it more to the winter since we have had 50% of the rain we usually get this year. I am liking the windshirt and umbrella combo thing paired with a trash bag rain skirt. I have been looking for something to prop up a bug netting bivy with and can use the umbrella. Just have to find a good bug netting bivy now. Can always take a rain poncho/tarp and use that also if need be. Options. I like my rain jacket but I have never found one I loved.

I still think the Packa is one of the best ventilated rain parkas going due to its being open on the bottom area of your pack.

I'll bet that when his patent expires you'll see "mainstream" makers like REI selling Packa-like parkas.

Yes I always carry rain jacket with me since it always helps in some way or the other..........

in the summers here in PA i don't. if the trip forecast looks like good weather i will just bring a windshirt. rainstorms during the day are a welcomed shower. i simply just walk in my t shirt and enjoy the cleaning and refreshing. i keep the windshirt in my pack for camp warmth, as others have mentioned... fall, winter, spring however the rain jacket comes with me, begrudgingly...

Yes, I always carry my goretex rain parka. Living in New England the old saying goes "If you don't like the weather, just wait a minute." It is so true. I can head out for a short hike with the sun shining and 30 minutes later it's pouring rain or snowing.

Growing up hiking and camping in the White Mountains of NH, I was always taught to prepare for the worst weather you can imagine. My rain parka is always in/on my pack and I've never regretted carrying it.

wait- I thought that was a Montana saying :)

We said that in Michigan all the time. Now I hear it in Oregon...

My rain jacket gets more use than most items in my pack, if it isn't raining I wear it for a bit of extra warmth around camp or as a wind breaker.

I usually watch what the forecasters say will happen with the weather, then pack my pack for the exact opposite because they either have the worst luck in determining weather or the science behind it is complete trash. :)

Just kidding, I suppose it is better now than it was ten years ago, but it is still 60/40 at best. I always have my golite poncho/tarp. I also have my hammock tarp. So what I usually do now is get to my camping spot, setup camp and if it is going to rain, I will add my poncho /tarp to the edge of my hammock tarp to create a vestibule of sorts and chill down there til it stops. I rarely ever put it on unless I am still hiking and don't want my gear to get wet.

If there's one thing people are universally bad at, it's predicting the future. Weatherman included.

Even in Southern AZ, I always take a rain jacket or poncho. Just in the past year I have been rained/snowed on and rained/hailed on when the forecast showed a 0% chance of rain for the next 10 days! That said, those are really the only two times I've had to use my rain gear in the last year...

Nope.

Depends on the trip for me.

If you always carry a rain jacket, do you also always carry rain pants?

I wonder what the stats are for weather pattern change and instability in light of global warming? Could it be that the computer models used for forecasting need some adaptation, or perhaps it is more chaotic?
That should make you take your rain gear!

By the way, chance of rain refers to the percent of the area that's expected to receive rain, as I understand it. My wife and I had an argument about this a while back, she won so it stuck in my brain.

If there's any chance of rain it will rain... somewhere, unless the weatherman screws up. Which never happens of course :)

Edited by JacobD on 06/26/2012 09:56:01 MDT.

"By the way, chance of rain refers to the percent of the area that's expected to receive rain, as I understand it."

Close: http://www.srh.noaa.gov/ffc/?n=pop

Chance of rain = (probability that it will rain somewhere) x (percent of area expected to receive rain, if it occurs at all)

If there is a 40 percent chance of rain, then "the correct way to interpret the forecast is: there is a 40 percent chance that rain will occur at any given point in the area."



"I wonder what the stats are for weather pattern change and instability in light of global warming? Could it be that the computer models used for forecasting need some adaptation, or perhaps it is more chaotic?"

I think one of the primary reasons weather forecasts may be inaccurate is due to a lack of data. If they could have weather instruments every 100 yards that supply real-time updates and if they had massive computing power, I think their predictions would be more accurate. Also, if any one is like me, they don't remember all the times the forecasters were right - just the times they were wrong.