I got rid of my MB#3 as the baffles were underfilled.

FF or WM is the way to go. WM if you want a bit lighter and FF if you want a more durable, water resistant fabric (UL models compared).

Here is a video on FF and the Nanosphere fabric: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PS3SafL8N18

Edited by FamilyGuy on 06/13/2012 12:45:28 MDT.

Here is a video for you to see a comparison between the western mountaineering ultralite and a montbell super stretch(not the spiral),he mistakenly says the montbell is sewn though construction but you will still get an idea of what they look like side by side

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjwHUwQX3AI&feature=plcp

Edited by annapurna on 06/13/2012 13:24:13 MDT.

I have the Montbell #3 too. The baffles do feel a little thin but the bag wraps around you well and, in my experience, has kept me pretty warm to around freezing temperatures.

I recently got my new Enlightened Equipment quilt. If I were you I would consider this quilt. It is way more lofty than my Montbell. The fabric feels nicer. It is a lot more versatile. It's even a little cheaper. I would wager that the 30 degree quilt has enough loft to take me to 20 degrees; it really puffs up big. Take a look at their site.

Sorry OP, looks like it's been discontinued. It's a 30 degree model. no. 1 is approximately 25F, and no. 3 is closer to 35F. I'm guessing they didn't need a middle model. Anyway, great bag. To me, lofty and warm. Quilts could work too, and are usually lighter. People love Marmot Heliums if you're looking for a more traditional bag. Lots of options these days. It's what I love about living in the future.

WM, FF, and Valandre - That's the big three in the uber high quality sleeping bag arena.

I own 2 WM bags [Caribou 35F, and Alpinlite 20F] and one FF bag [Ibis 0F]. IMHO - I find the WM bags to have a higher level of workmanship and design than FF. The Alpinlite is a beautiful bag - it has far exceeded my expectations. It is a thing of beauty - both WM bags are. The wider bag [both the Caribou and Alpinlite are wider cut] is more comfortable for me and also allows for extending the range with a belay parka etc.

Valandre makes excellent bags as well. I've never owned or even touched one. They are highly sought after and probably have more of a following in Europe [they're French]. There are several Valandre dealers in the US as well.

It's funny because there are those with both WM and FF and say that their FF bags are of better quality. I think one thing is for certain - they are both at the top of the game.

Valandre look amazing.

Strangely enough, I gave my WM 5 degree Antelope to my husband and I now use a Mont-bell 0 degree UL SS Hugger or whatever. I just like it better. I guess because it does hug me and keeps those cold gaps from happening.

I'm starting to think I reached a point at which i am trying to choose one sleeping bag between the TOP 3, though at this point it's a very personal and subjective issue rather than manufacturer quality and garment/down quality differences.

The dilemma:
WM ultralight
FF hummingbird
Valandre Mirage

i don't think i will be disappointed choosing either one of them.

Edited by Anubis on 06/14/2012 00:55:16 MDT.

When you get that far in the comparison process, you can just pick one based on how the zipper works, or the shell color, or how tightly one will pack.

--B.G.--

when i started searching for a new sleeping bag I prepared a chart with the following parameters :

1.Temperature range
2.Weight
3.Down fill weight
4.Down fill power
5.Outer shell fabric
6.Inner shell fabric
7.Loft (in inches)
8.Draft tube (yes or no)
9.Draft collar (yes or no)
10. Price

is there any parameter i overlooked?

Fit? My problems lie in the shoulder and footbox.

I agree - both FF and WM are top-of-the-line. Which is better? it probably depends on the model and materials used. My WM bags use Pertex and Microlite XP [both sweet fabrics]. The FF uses Epic. FF now uses Pertex fabrics as well. Looking at the workmanship between my WM and FF bags [all of which are within 4 years of one another]. I'd give the edge to WM. Does it really matter who has slightly better stitching etc - not really.

I agree with Ken.

I've had both WM and FF bags. I prefer FF because of fit. I'm a skinny dude but the 59/51/38 shoulder/hip/foot of WM only fits nice if you neglect layering. I've found that the medium size from FF fits me just right. Wide enough that I can fit a midsized down insulation piece in with me to push its rating while still being snug enough to avoid drafts without layering. It is 60/56/38. The extra inch around the shoulder is great for layering and the 5 inches around the waist make the bags feel big and comfortable.

After all, it is just a bag of down. If you shell out the cash, all the primo manufacturers have got the basics locked in. (dwr, breathable, light shell with continuous baffle designs, roughly the same weight specs, and high quality down) The only remaining question is which one fits you best for versatility and efficiency. Ha. That is a point that favors WM. You can actually try their bags out in person. Feathered Friends seems to have decided that they want to serve the Seattle area only and aren't producing for retailers outside of the PNW.

I am with Mike on the fit.

I really like the space in my FF Lark and PHD Hispar , I used a WM Summerlite and Alpinelite and found them far too narrow.

The WM Alpinlite is far bigger than the FF Lark so it's definitely not tight by comparison. The 32F WM Summerlite, on the other hand, is definitely a squeeze. I think I'd break-out into a claustrophobic fit.

FF Lark 10 deg F: [60/56/38]

WM Alpinlite 20 deg F: [64/55/39]
WM Summerlite 32 deg F: [59/51/38]

Cheers Mike,

Meant to say Ultralite :-)

The Alpinlite would compete with the Feathered Friends Swift, which has the same shoulder width but is wider everywhere else.

Was it the swift you ordered Dave?
I had a look at that Prolite gear YouTube flick you posted, very informative as to how Nanosphere works.

Indeed I did. Should be here in about a month. I had 2oz overfill put in as well.

I must say, it was a brutal decision to make between WM, FF, and Valandre.

have you thought about a quilt? I use one for 20 degrees or so and up these days and was just wondering.