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Mountain Hardware Phantom
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Steven Hanlon
(asciibaron) - F

Locale: Mid Atlantic
Mountain Hardwear Phantom on 03/25/2012 18:25:57 MDT Print View

i picked up a MH Phantom this weekend and have noticed that it's next to impossible to get it into the included stuff sack. since it's down, i would prefer to have an added layer of water resistance. i do use a plastic bag as a pack liner, but i have had instances where that was not enough and having a down bag in a silnylon stuff sack meant i would have a good night.

anyone have any suggestions on how to get the Phantom into the included stuff sack? it almost fits and i can't imagine trying to cramming it there with cold hands.

Edited by asciibaron on 03/25/2012 18:26:32 MDT.

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Mountain Hardwear Phantom on 03/25/2012 18:30:38 MDT Print View

There are different temperature versions of the Phantom. It is possible that you have the wrong stuff sack for yours.

I have the 32*F version, and it perfectly fits its stuff sack.

--B.G.--

Steven Hanlon
(asciibaron) - F

Locale: Mid Atlantic
Re: Re: Mountain Hardwear Phantom on 03/25/2012 18:36:08 MDT Print View

it's the correct stuff sack, Phantom 32 is screen printed on it :)

todd harper
(funnymoney) - MLife

Locale: Sunshine State
Re: Mountain Hardwear Phantom on 03/25/2012 18:42:21 MDT Print View

Other companies provide stuffsacks that are too small as well & I hate that!

My recommendation is to buy another, larger stuffsack and use that one for something else. JacksRBetter makes great sacks, and MLD & others make great cuben ones as well.

Todd

Ken Thompson
(kthompson) - MLife

Locale: Behind the Redwood Curtain
Re: Tiny Sacks on 03/25/2012 18:45:40 MDT Print View

My WM bags barely fit in their supplied sacks also. A sil bag is lighter. Annoying just the same.

Steven Hanlon
(asciibaron) - F

Locale: Mid Atlantic
bags o'plenty on 03/25/2012 19:10:39 MDT Print View

i have a dozen bags that won't hold that for which they came with. Marmot, REI, MH, and even Kelty. i do have some silnylon bags that i can use, but should i have to?

Ken Thompson
(kthompson) - MLife

Locale: Behind the Redwood Curtain
Re: Tiny Sacks on 03/25/2012 19:15:44 MDT Print View

A 25% increase in size would do the trick don't you think. I don't want a hard cylinder of fluffy down in my pack. Nor do I want to break a sweat trying to cram it in the stuff sack.

So no you should not have to. Though it is starting to sound like SOP for everyone.

Hamish McHamish
(El_Canyon) - M

Locale: USA
_ on 03/25/2012 19:20:15 MDT Print View

If you have to get a different stuffsack for the bag, you might as well get one that is light and very water resistant:

http://www.seatosummit.com/products/display/170

Colin MacCall
(colinm) - F
Fold and Roll on 03/25/2012 21:34:47 MDT Print View

I know people say not to fold your sleeping bag, but I have never been able to put the Phantom in the stuff sack by just "stuffing" it in. I fold it in half and then lie on it to compress it a little. Then I start rolling it allowing air to escape and I haven't had any trouble with it fitting.

Edited by colinm on 03/25/2012 21:35:24 MDT.

Jared King
(jking) - F

Locale: Middle TN
Re: Mountain Hardwear Phantom on 03/25/2012 21:48:26 MDT Print View

I have the MH +32, and i remember the first time I tried to stuff it in the stuff sack. I thought for sure that there's no way it could possibly fit, but somehow it did. I just kept stuffing to the point that i thought the stuff sack was going to bust at the seams. 2+ years later, it still hasn't busted.

Just keep stuffing it. It will fit.

Hikin' Jim
(hikin_jim) - MLife

Locale: Orange County, CA, USA
Re: Fold and Roll on 03/25/2012 21:53:54 MDT Print View

I have the Phantom 15. Great bag, but same deal. REALLY hard to get it into the stuff sack. I use a slightly larger bag that came with something else.

Sea to Summit "dry" bags work pretty well, but they aren't all that waterproof in my experience. Mine are several years old, so maybe they've improved them.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving

Eric Blumensaadt
(Danepacker) - MLife

Locale: Mojave Desert
MH Phantom 32 v.s. WM Megalite on 03/25/2012 21:56:48 MDT Print View

Look at the WM Megalite. MUCH better loft. TRUE 32 F warmth.

Plus full length zipper and Made in USA. Yeah, more $$ but well worth it.
Had a MH Phantom 32 & ret'd. it to REI.

Re. stuff sack: You may want to look at Wal Mart (Ak!) and see if they still carry the 3 bag package of Outdoor Products lightweight dry bags. I use one for my Megalite and a smaller one for my down sweater. The roll sown top helps customize teh size better than a drawstring stuffsack. Good quality dry bags,which I feel is essential insurance for down garments.

Edited by Danepacker on 03/26/2012 12:06:01 MDT.

Ken Thompson
(kthompson) - MLife

Locale: Behind the Redwood Curtain
Re: MH Phantom 32 v.s. WM Megalite on 03/25/2012 22:00:47 MDT Print View

Eric. You are relentless. Really not the point of this discussion though. Don't you find the size of stuff sacks for sleeping bags are a little small?

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Mountain Hardwear Phantom on 03/25/2012 22:05:52 MDT Print View

Think of it this way, the stuff sack is small enough that you aren't carrying around very much excess weight.

I simply didn't like its weight at all, so I sewed my own stuff sack out of mosquito netting with a produce bag inside it as a waterproof liner. Mine was half of the weight of the MH stuff sack.

--B.G.--

Steven Hanlon
(asciibaron) - F

Locale: Mid Atlantic
Megalith on 03/25/2012 22:08:43 MDT Print View

Price is a consideration for me, the phantom 32 will work just fine for a majority of my 3 season trips.

The MH stuff sack weighs 1.1 ounce. Removing one of the string and spring clip saves .4 ounces.

Edited by asciibaron on 03/25/2012 22:10:33 MDT.

Jeremy and Angela
(requiem) - F - M

Locale: Northern California
Keep stuffing on 03/26/2012 00:29:54 MDT Print View

We have Phantom 0s, regular and long. Never had a problem with the stuffing, although the "down brick" aspect is unwieldy; I would consider a larger bag solely to alleviate that.

My method consists of stuffing a little at a time while slowly rotating the side I stuff. Solid pressure over time, but not over-exertion. Patience helps; it's not a particularly fast process. Trying to speed it may be counter-productive, perhaps?

John Donewar
(Newton) - MLife

Locale: Southeastern Louisiana
Re: "I do have some silnylon bags that I can use, but should I have to"? on 03/26/2012 03:59:02 MDT Print View

Steven,

FWIW I am not familiar with your sleeping bag and I do not know what pack you are using. I use a top quilt not a traditional sleeping bag.

Is it an option for you to stuff your bag into the bottom of your pack minus the stuff sack?

I believe that you mentioned earlier in this thread that you do use a pack liner.

When I load up my pack my pad goes in first, then my pack liner followed by my top quilt stuffed into the bottom of my pack without a stuff sack. I do use a stuff sack for my clothes bag. It goes in next on top of the quilt. It is a relatively tight fit and I press it down into the pack on top of my quilt. This aids in keeping the quilt compressed. The rest of my gear goes in after the clothes bag.

Could this be an option for you?

Just something to think about. ;-)

Party On,

Newton

James Marco
(jamesdmarco) - MLife

Locale: Finger Lakes
Stuff in a stuff sack on 03/26/2012 04:55:52 MDT Print View

There are as many ways to do this as there are people doing it. Generally, I drop the origonal bag and use a Granite Gear compression sack. It has three options.

1) Normal Bag in a bag.
2) Two sleeping bags: For the wife and myself. I usually carry this.
3) Solo: With additional long johns, long & heavy wool sleep socks, and down jacket.

The biggest failures of the WM bags are the tiny sizes of their stuff bags. Breaking camp in the morning is always a chore when I was using the factory supplied bags. That's all right; it is the smallest they recommend for stuffing the sleeping bag. The tiny bags also take a few minutes to work the sleeping bag into, though. I don't think I ever did this without working at it. A larger bag helps a LOT when breaking camp and, un-stuffing at night. The sleeping bag does not need the extra shaking and lofting necessary when the bag was heavily compressed. This can take about 10-15 minutes for a heavily compressed bag. Using a one size larger bag will reduce this to 2-5 minutes.

Hmmm...a little explanation....
Generally, I take a bag that is lighter than recommended. Usually around 1#11 for down to around 20-25F. Since I need a jacket after hiking anyway, I simply add this into my stuff sack. Same for sleeping cloths. In a pinch, say a 25F morning, I have all the layers on, but they are NOT needed when hiking. The jacket weighs about 11 3/8 oz. The pants weigh about 5-8 ounces(light or medium weight.) And the shirt weighs around 10-14ounces (again, light and medium weights.) Basically this lets me use one bag from around mid spring to October/November (depending on the year.) The sleeping cloths pick up body oils rather than putting them into the bag for the first week or so, and, adds a bit of longevity to the bag on longer two and three week trips. Anyway, look for a stuff sack around 5-6" dia. It should *just* fit into the bottom of your bag when you are done putting your sleeping bag & sleeping cloths in it. Don't compress it beyond the size of the pack. It will add a little rigidity to the overall pack. And, it should be about the same diameter as the pack is thick...usually between 5-7". A dry bag is good for wet weather but it also weighs more. When stuffed it should be fairly soft to fill in the corners pretty well. I use a small volume pack (~2800ci) most often. Soo volume is fairly important. Bushwacking or off trail travel wants a smaller pack to keep snags to a minimum. Same for scrambling the High Peaks area in the ADK's. Using a stuff sack (or dry bag while canoeing) lets me keep things quite small. It will also keep your bag dryer in the event of a spill or heavy rain storm. The compressed bag will not be quick to pick up tons of water. Down works well even damp. (Synthetics should NEVER be compressed, so I'm not considering this.)

Generally this is about the whole sleep *system* you will use. The tiny bags supplied by WM are really too small to be convenient. (But, you *can* dip them in a bucket of water and not soak the whole bag. High compression means your bag will resist water penetration.) Getting a larger stuff sack has several benefits for the additional 2-3 ounces in weight, but may not work well for you. Not using the stuff sack is NOT recommended except for dry areas. A dry/compression bag works well for very wet conditions. Note that down can be compressed a lot, as evidenced by the small stuff sacks offered by WM, without damage. The more you compress down, the more time it will take to uncompress it at night (sort'a increasing geometricaly with higher compression values.) It is ceartainly possible to use additional clothing to extend a bag's temp rating, but all(sleeping bag & sleeping cloths) needs to be kept dry so as not to introduce moisture into the sleep system. A stuff sack can add rigidity to your pack, making it easier to carry without fold up.

My thoughts only . . .

Steven Hanlon
(asciibaron) - F

Locale: Mid Atlantic
messing about on 03/26/2012 05:18:46 MDT Print View

i have a Granite Gear compression stuff sack that is much easier to work with, so that will be used instead. i don't like depending on just the pack liner to protect the contents of the backpack, it would be my luck that the liner gets a hole and i drop my pack while fording a creek. wait, that has already happened to me :)

M B
(livingontheroad) - M
stuffing on 03/26/2012 20:25:36 MDT Print View

I dont have any problem stuffing high quality lightweight bags.

Just start stuffing it in. The problem is mostly billowing back out.

Sometimes hold sack in both hands and use thumbs to do it, the bag just dissapears down the rabbit hole. When you get close to end, you stuff a little harder, then pull the string.

They are stuff sacks. Not roll-up-and-then-put-inside sacks.

Edited by livingontheroad on 03/26/2012 20:26:43 MDT.