I am looking for leg warmth on breaks, in temps perhaps down to -10F. WOuld the cocoon or montbell inner down pants under a liner be comparable to the micropuff or chugach pants?

Thanks,
Kevin

Well, the cocoon pants should be slightly more loft than the micropuffs, if they're the same spec as their respective pullovers. BPL measured the loft of the Micropuff pullover at 0.53", where the cocoon line is 0.6" loft. Can't speak for the Montbells or Mountain Hardwear.

I'm planning on replacing my Integral Designs Denali Pants (0.8" loft, 19 oz) w/ the Cocoon Pro pants when they're available. I'll just add Smartwool tights under my softshells if I need to.

Edited by PA_Jay on 02/06/2007 19:39:59 MST.

Kevin,
Richard N. reports that the clo value of the micro puff polarguard delta insulation is higher than that of montbells exceloft, so naturally the puffs are warmer. (and much heavier at 397g vs. 281g). They have about the same ratio of insulation/weight. My suggestion is to calculate the clo of each product using Richards previous posts...Or, buy for a feature you require. For example, I have the montbell thermawraps(3/4 zip), but I need full zip for alpine trips, so I am buying the micro puffs.

edit:thanks for the info/correction, Jason.

Edited by Brett1234 on 02/06/2007 21:36:42 MST.

Brett,
The upcoming Cocoon PRO pants have full side zips, as well as a wp/b shell, as opposed to the original zipperless, pertex quantum Cocoon pants.

Check them out here
http://www.bozemanmountainworks.com/?do=showproduct&id=40

My BMW Cocoon pants size XL weigh 8.2 oz and have about 3/4" of loft. I sized them extra-large so they would fit over my snow pants and above my waist and over my upper layers. They don't pull over my boots, though; not a big deal since I loosen my boots and straighten my socks on breaks anyway. If it's well below freezing then an additional liner probably isn't necessary as it's not likely to be raining; snow blows right off the Cocoon pants.

My solution for stop-and-go activity is to add insulation under my snow pants: Wal-Mart ThermaStar 100-wt microfleece pants cut off just above boot height, which weigh 11.1 oz (size M; cut).

Edited by Otter on 02/07/2007 11:49:55 MST.

Cabela's sells Thinsulate insulated Gore-Tex ski pants W/ suspenders & side-leg zips. They also have semi-circular hypalon patches on the inside of the cuffs to keep ski steel edges (or crampons) from cuting them.

They are THE least expensive Gore-Tex insulated ski pants I know of. I love mine. For a testamonial I can say for sure they are great at -15F.

These are not lightweight pants but for bitterest weather they are the best overpants I've seen.

Edited by Danepacker on 02/08/2007 20:29:28 MST.

Still thinking of what to wear on legs at rest stops where temp around 0F or so. Has anyone ever seen a sort of half bag that would be open with a draw chord on both ends, sort of like a tube, and that would take a pad on the bottom instead of down / polar? Benefit would be that it could be slipped over everything, even boots with Crampons, and could also be an overbag or at least a half overbag too? It should be fairly light since it is half of a half back, since there is no insulation on the bottom. Hey, a 0.25%

That could be added to a sleep system too, replacing the cocoon pants or whatever lower insulation layer you were using. It would probably be half the weight of cocoon pants.

Call it the Cocoon 1-Legged Pant. 2.7oz Polarguard Delta on top, Microlite shell, 2 drawstrings with micro cordlocks. 4 feet long so it can be sinched at the waist and closed shut over the feet like a sleeping bag end at night.

I'd try one! Great idea.

Dude, it is and must be, * * * The PADDY POUCH

Making a prototype this weekend out of previous generations high tech stuff (tyvek, insulation from local fabric store, etc etc etc

I picked up a couple of yards of "polyester backing" from Joanne Fabric (thickest they had) and got out the duct tape and the lightest emergency blanket I could find. I made the tube, and will all this junk work it supposedly weighs under 24 ounces and gives me 3" of loft. Now where it started off as a potential overbag, the use of the emergency blanket makes it waterproof. Now, an insulated vapor barrier inner bag! If I can hand sew silnylon I will get some along with primaloft and make one a bit more durable, for what $40 or so?

Total cost of the one I made was about 30" in time, 20 or so feet of duct tape and $10 (for the insulation and the emergency blanket?

This has potential. THe one I made is not really usable, but it is my friend