Forum Index » GEAR » Ursack closer to being allowed in Yosemite?


Display Avatars Sort By:
Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Garcia Machine on 05/16/2012 12:42:41 MDT Print View

I have to say... the Garcia canister is heavy and ugly, but it works. I've never heard of one failing, except maybe if it got pushed over a hundred-foot cliff.

--B.G.--

Jason G
(JasonG) - F

Locale: iceberg lake
Re: Re: Garcia Machine on 05/16/2012 14:11:00 MDT Print View

"except maybe if it got pushed over a hundred-foot cliff."

found this one scrambling up from upper hitchcock lake to the mt whitney switchbacks. looks like someone wasn't careful when unloading at trailcrest.. the lid was gone and there was a crack in the top rim. still food wrappers and other trash in the areagar1gar2

(found that pad too)

Edited by JasonG on 05/16/2012 14:13:27 MDT.

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Garcia Machine on 05/16/2012 14:54:46 MDT Print View

" (found that pad too) "

It's amazing to me what good junk I can find along the trail.

Some beginners don't understand how tightly gear needs to be attached to a pack. When camped, some beginners don't understand how easily stuff will blow away in a breeze. Others just don't care.

I watched an entire three-man dome tent blowing away over a ridgeline one time. The former occupants just stood there and watched it as well.

--B.G.--

bill berklich
(berklich)

Locale: Northern Mid-West
Sleeping Bag on the AT on 05/16/2012 17:08:24 MDT Print View

Hiking So. bound from Pen-Mar in late March and found a sleeping bag hanging from a tree limb in the middle of the trail. Hadn't passed anyone in and day and a half so bundled it up and left it at the next shelter. Never did see anyone. I guess they just decided to go Extreme Ultralight.

Scott Bentz
(scottbentz) - MLife

Locale: Southern California
Garcia Canister on 05/16/2012 18:43:19 MDT Print View

"looks like someone wasn't careful when unloading at trail crest.."

Or, maybe someone just chucked it because they were carrying too much. Oops, I lost my canister. Oh, well.

Edited by scottbentz on 05/16/2012 18:43:57 MDT.

USA Duane Hall
(hikerduane) - F

Locale: Extreme northern Sierra Nevada
Garcia canister on 05/16/2012 19:07:54 MDT Print View

Horses allowed up there? Seems they would load stuff securely in packs/panniers though.

Duane

Jeffrey A.
(Jeff81) - F
Test in April on 03/03/2013 23:17:19 MST Print View

I know I'm bringing back an old thread but...emailed ursack and they notified me that a test should be happening in April. I have high hopes.

Carter Hunt
(TheChamp) - F

Locale: Portland, OR
Update. on 03/03/2013 23:47:36 MST Print View

Thank you for the update. High hopes here as well...

Jim Sweeney
(swimjay) - MLife

Locale: Northern California
From the Ursack web site // great video of recent test on 06/11/2013 23:37:45 MDT Print View

June 5, 2013

SUCCESSFUL GRIZZLY TEST. Ursack was tested in two configurations by the IGBC at the Grizzly and Wolf Discovery Center in West Yellowstone on May 30, 2013. I was there for both tests. Check out a video excerpt on our Bear Test Videos page. This is a slightly newer version of the Ursack S29 AllWhite which since April 2013 is sewn with Spectra thread. Ursack did extremely well. The IGBC test protocol requiresthat a product must survive 60 minutes of bear contact, which is defined as: "biting, clawing, pounding, rolling, compressing, licking or scratching." More than one Grizzly worked on the Ursacks, but the clock only runs while a bear is actively engaged. In one test, at least three (possibly four) bears attacked a baited unlined Ursack tied about five feet up a tree trunk. At the end of 60 minutes, the Ursack was fully intact with no punctures or tears. I easily untied it from the tree and opened it without the use of tools. The current IGBC published protocol states that: "If the product is not breached within the required 60 minutes of bear contact time, it will be considered to have "passed" the captive bear test."

In the other test, an Ursack with an aluminum liner was placed on the ground and not tied to anything. Sam and Illie--a brother sister tag team (Sam weighs 950 pounds)--attacked the Ursack. This bag was torn after approximately forty three minutes of contact. My interpretation is that the grizzlies were able to use their massive shoulder strength and claws to compromise the Ursack. Black bears are very different. They do not have the shoulder strength (no hump) or size of grizzlies and their claws are different. We have tested lined Ursacks on the ground with captive black bears and the Ursacks have easily survived. In the thirteen years we have been in business selling across North America (including Alaska and Canada), I have never heard of a grizzly compromising an Ursack.

It is my very strong belief that Ursack, whether lined with aluminum or not, tied up a tree or not, would pass a captive bear test with black bears. I suspect that an Ursack (aluminum lined or not) tied up a tree to minimize claw and shoulder advantage would survive a captive grizzly test.

The IGBC has not issued its official evaluation yet. We hope to receive approval within a couple of weeks. Stay tuned. I will post video excerpts of the IGBC test soon.

Edited by swimjay on 06/11/2013 23:41:15 MDT.

Jim Sweeney
(swimjay) - MLife

Locale: Northern California
Grizzly slobber on 06/11/2013 23:42:01 MDT Print View

Not sure I'd want to eat the contents of the Ursack after the workout the Grizzlies gave it!!

Edited by swimjay on 06/11/2013 23:42:45 MDT.

Jeffrey A.
(Jeff81) - F
Very cool on 06/11/2013 23:44:51 MDT Print View

I hope the approval does come.

USA Duane Hall
(hikerduane) - F

Locale: Extreme northern Sierra Nevada
Strength? on 06/12/2013 06:52:13 MDT Print View

Jim, how are grizzleys able to use their strength? Please explain. What are they doing that black bears can't, whereas tied in a tree, their strength is of no use? I'd only be guessing.
Duane

scree ride
(scree)
Re: Grizzly slobber on 06/12/2013 07:13:41 MDT Print View

You're not hungry enough then. It beats the alternative. I'll play the odds.

Jim Sweeney
(swimjay) - MLife

Locale: Northern California
strength on 06/12/2013 08:46:10 MDT Print View

Duane, my post is a direct quote from the Ursack site.

USA Duane Hall
(hikerduane) - F

Locale: Extreme northern Sierra Nevada
Strength? on 06/12/2013 08:57:31 MDT Print View

Sorry Jim, thought you had a direct connection.
Duane

Lyan Jordan
(redmonk)

Locale: Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem
Ursack closer to being allowed in Yosemite? on 06/12/2013 09:36:47 MDT Print View

I don't see ursack coming to yosemite any time soon. Unless the whole product has improved, they are not the reward free type of food protection the park wants in use. But the website makes it sound like only the stitching changed.

If the new bags can with stand up against teeth and claws without a puncture sans liner, that would be a huge improvement.

Ursack vs Bear

Jennifer Mitol
(Jenmitol) - M

Locale: In my dreams....
Re: Ursack closer to being allowed in Yosemite? on 06/13/2013 05:50:53 MDT Print View

You don't understand...of COURSE it will pass all the tests and be allowed everywhere!!!

Because I just bought a bearikade.

Billy Ray
(rosyfinch) - M

Locale: the mountains
not so sure on 06/13/2013 07:27:43 MDT Print View

As I read it, seems the UrSack passed the test when hung in the tree, but failed when on the ground. I'm guessing the park service will NOT be impressed with that failure. In addition, the test was for grizzlies. Not sure the CA parks will accept that test. In addition, there are other considerations, like tree damage. I believe Inyo Nat Forest allows UrSack use with metal liner, but NOT tied into the trees because it causes damage to trees when the bear claws at the bark. That is the test that the post said failed... the on the ground test.

I will be happily surprised if and when the Ursack is approved by Yosemite and SEKI, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

Bill

Jim Sweeney
(swimjay) - MLife

Locale: Northern California
long time Ursack user on 06/13/2013 09:42:13 MDT Print View

The thing is, it seems like the Ursack works splendidly as long as it's never challenged. And hey, I've used one for years, and never had a problem. But after reading Jeremy's post, seeing his photos and the most recent test videos from the Ursack site, I have to conclude that it's not an effective protection system, either for our food or for the bears. Those bears in the test weren't simply persistent; they were being rewarded. Notice that they keep licking the bags. So even if they're just crushing the food, slobbering through the porous weave of the Ursack, and then licking off the now-food-flavored slobber, they're learning that attacking an Ursack pays off.

Josh Brock
(needsAbath)

Locale: Outside
Re: Re: Ursack closer to being allowed in Yosemite? on 06/13/2013 12:44:15 MDT Print View

Jenifer- having not used my bear can yet I will be trying to send mine back for a refund should this thing get approved.... Lets be real hear I'd rather lose a Ursack to a bear than a bearikade. and I havent yet had a problem with bears. Not saying it wont happen I just would rather carry the Ursak and take my chances than carry a Expensive heavy UL bear can. I was fighting with myself buying it in the first place!!! It being the best of the all bad options.

When do they find out if it gets approved?