Jason - I posted a sample graph of the type of data we are getting from load cells in another thread:

Tension Forces in a Guyline Measured Using an Inline Load Cell (Graph)

It's cool stuff for us nerds. We'll see if it reveals anything practical.

Edited by ryan on 01/25/2012 14:47:43 MST.

@Jason,

How do you get 9" Nails to go on your hikes?
That concept seems pretty unreliable knowing about the drug and alcohol issue bands are known for:-)

Nice long nails are my preferred stakes as well. They're heavy though.

Does anyone make an 8+ inch long, 0.25" dia.+ Ti nail?

I'm sure Lawson would.

From the MLD Facebook site;
"We added a little more info on the TrailStar product page yesterday to help anyone trying to decide between the SilNylon and Cuben versions."

Here is the link to the MLD sites Trailstar page;
http://www.mountainlaureldesigns.com/shop/product_info.php?cPath=21&products_id=102

Scroll down to "Cuben Fiber Vs Pro Silnylon TrailStar". Very descriptive and interesting to read.

*The MLD Trailstar page also includes a link to Eugenes video on pitching the Trailstar. I've enjoyed watching this multiple times.

Edited by thomdarrah on 01/25/2012 15:37:34 MST.

Thanks for that link Thom. I just read over that. Summarizes it nicely, that is it's pretty much Cost vs Weight which largely what most Cuben vs SilNylon choices are about. If saving 6.5 ounces is worth $165 (the difference in price) then it sounds like the Cuben would be for you.

Ryan,

Here's a 9" long CF nail from Ruta Locura (formerly Titanium Goat). Not sure about the diameter… http://www.rutalocura.com/Tent_Stakes.html

I didn't find the Trailstar hard to pitch; I followed Stever Horner's pitching guide (http://www.stevenhorner.com/?p=1051) and got a taught pitch easily on the the first attempt. If the ground isn't level then it can be harder to get a good pitch with it right to the ground.

In ~60mph winds I've had success with aluminium Y stakes that appear identical to the MSR Groundhogs. The real issue I had was with the centre pole driving into the ground. Flipping the pole over and using a rubber ferrule to protect the Trailstar should fix that.

>The real issue I had was with the centre pole driving into the ground. Flipping the pole over and using a rubber ferrule to protect the Trailstar should fix that.

As long as your pole is long enough and adjustable, let it sink into the ground and just lengthen it. Or you could find a flat rock or piece of wood to put underneath.

Travis,

regarding that photo in the porkies ... how deep was the frost and what did you use to pound the stakes?

(heading to porkies in 5 weeks ... appears there's now enough snow for snowshoes!)

Jim,
I'm pretty sure the frost was at least as deep as I could pound my stakes. However, in that particular campsite I was under pine trees, so the ground was much softer there. I think I hit a fluffy patch of frozen duff because I was able to push one stake in by hand. The other stakes were just pounded in with a rock. They go in relatively easy provided you don't hit a root or rock. By morning the aluminum will freeze into the ground, so I just lightly tapped the stake *further into* the ground to break that ice bond. I've broken stakes in the winter by hitting them at a sharp angle.

"By morning the aluminum will freeze into the ground, so I just lightly tapped the stake *further into* the ground to break that ice bond."

Funny how the stuff that makes the most sense often eludes us. Thanks Travis, I never thought of that! Brilliant in its simplicity and common sense!

Thanks Doug. However, I must credit Roger C for that. I extruded that little gem out of one of his posts a few years back.

I was actually surprised how relatively easy it is to pound a (very strong) stake into frozen ground, and how easy it is to get it out again!

And apparently, ice does not bond to titanium that well, so extraction is even easier.

Edited by T.L. on 01/25/2012 18:33:38 MST.

Love our TrailStar, but I still don't have a foolproof sequence for placing the stakes to pitch it right the first time (a)with a door mid-panel, or (b) with a high beak. I iterate & iterate, but it's never quite taut. I've looked at all the web instructions, so maybe Ryan can solve this math problem

Having a third pole makes for panorama views when wind is not an issue, or when the wind is steady from one direction.

Can't beat this tent - it makes looking at rain fun.

I've been spending too much time in cushy igloos and snow caves this winter to care much about stakes and wind. Methinks it's time to go on a fast 'n light trip with tarp and bivy again so I can join in this conversation. That 17 oz comment at the end of the article has had me giggling all through the four pages of commentary, Ryan.

I've really enjoyed the commentary section to this review - much value added by both members and BPL staff.

And what an intriguing shelter the TS is - a very appealing combination of weather protection and versatility for the weight. After spending most of my outings last season alternating between a Golite Poncho Tarp + TiGoat bivy and a Big Agnes Fly Creek UL2, this just looks really, really nice.

Ryan - thanks for the link. Results should be very interesting. Would also be interesting to know what sort of stress is being put on our little trekking poles in some of these shelters. The pole in my Duomid was flexing alarmingly in a strong wind. The idea of being in a shelter when a CF pole snaps is rather alarming:).

> ice does not bond to titanium that well, so extraction is even easier.
That's been my experience anyhow. I thump with just the heel of my jogger normally.

Cheers

For those that have the TS or are considering it, if you have a Poncho/Bivy setup presumably you would keep that even with a TS?

1] Poncho for Rain Gear (3 season) (GoLite Poncho 7 oz)
2] Bivy for bug protection (Katabatic Bristlecone 7 oz)

If that is the case then the TS weight is fully additive and the primary attraction of the TS to me is having a shelter where waiting out a storm doesn't mean retreating to a small poncho tarp where you really can't move around.

Edited by randalmartin on 01/26/2012 08:57:08 MST.

Randy, you don't really need any other protection under a Trailstar, except for bugs if its the season for them. It is large enough for two people to move around and still be plenty protected from rain.