BS

Interpret that OK?

Glad we can all act like adults and have intelligent conversations.

"Some (dare I say most) people speak liberally."

You mean literally don't you? Or do you mean people talk too much. See how using the wrong can change the whole meaning?

You've got some poor arguments going there Chris. And no. mentioning the other Daisys changes nothing, it's about the other two, and not so much whether they are unique or not but the process by which they ended up on the HMG pack.

Edited by wildlife on 01/18/2012 19:33:48 MST.

Dan, thanks... I caught that after I posted. Hopefully this won't come across the wrong way but I do have a question. You seem to gladly admit that your pack would be $100 more for the same design as the HMG Porter. What's the value proposition that justifies the 36% percent premium? Is it just that they're producing the same pack over and over and yours is produced per order?

DM

No, I mean liberal. As in go about a mile down the road and make a right. About a mile is used in a liberal sense. It might be 3/4 of a mile or 1.5 miles.

Don, I was mostly making the point that there is no way my version would cost 2 to 3 times more than the Porter for the same thing. Chris was speaking out of ignorance. As for the premium, Ryan even questioned the durability and quality of the Porter seams in the review. My quality would be unquestionably and obviously excellent.

Edited by wildlife on 01/18/2012 19:44:13 MST.

Can we really buy a simple cuben McHale for $400?

Edited by dandydan on 01/18/2012 19:45:47 MST.

"Glad we can all act like adults and have intelligent conversations."

Hey we are just trying to figure out what you mean since we can't tell by what you write at times. Geez.
You are taking this review way too personally. Just because it is crap does not mean you are.

Stay objective, not reactive.

OK that was fun. I am done here.

Edited by kthompson on 01/18/2012 20:10:40 MST.

Did Costco have a good deal on vitriol ? I am almost out and I need some handy, just in case..
;)

Dan, the cost is not the point. Do you really think the potential difference in the cost of a pack has any bearing on the argument? Do you want me to make you a Cuben pack like the Porter Expedition for $400.00? At least I would not have to feel like I was copying somebodies design. Even the way the frame is done inside, is our alternate design, and one I have done for more than 20 years, and is like the packs Ryan has purchased from me - all of which were purchased before HMG even started up.

Edited by wildlife on 01/18/2012 19:57:24 MST.

Dan,

I promised myself I wouldn't join into the fray but here I am.

As I read Chris's logic, price was exactly the point as a differentiating factor. Your packs are significantly more expensive and as far as I'm aware you don't offer a cuben fiber fabric variant as an option. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm honestly not completely familiar with your line since the price has been prohibitive to me in the past. Don't read that as a knock on your line. I'm sure I'm not your target customer.

I get the argument that the daisy chain configuration isn't necessarily unique. I don't think that you can argue that your product is a fair comparison to the HMG Porter simply because of the price disparity.

More importantly to everyone being so rude in this chain step back and consider what you're trying to accomplish. If you were offended by the intro you could simply move on. If you were deeply offended maybe send a PM. The aggressive messages and pointless bickering leads to nothing constructive.

DM

Why is it that every thread turns into garbage these days?

Ryan

Don, what does this mean?

" I don't think that you can argue that your product is a fair comparison to the HMG Porter simply because of the price disparity."

OK, I see.

Edited by wildlife on 01/18/2012 20:21:25 MST.

"Dan, the cost is not the point. Do you really think the potential difference in the cost of a pack has any bearing on the argument? Do you want me to make you a Cuben pack like the Porter Expedition for $400.00?"

I see....I thought you were saying your simpler packs sell for about $400, but now I understand that you're saying you don't make a pack equivalent to the Porter, but if you did then it would be around this price.

On a side note, have you ever though about making a dry bag hauler? I.e. the ULA Epic.

Edited by dandydan on 01/18/2012 20:16:58 MST.

Dan,

I mean that your packs are sufficiently more expensive that they can't be reasonably considered as an option for a person buying in the HMG Porter range. Additionally, you don't have a cuben fabric option.

DM

Don and Dan, I do make packs as simple as the Porter and with simplicity the price goes down and I do offer Cuben. My packs can be very simple. Have you seen what I call the Windsauk? It's even simpler than the Porter and so are may other packs I show. I have a pack posted for $399.00 that even has 2 detachable side water pockets and a top lid fanny pack. You can't say that's so much more expensive that they can't be compared.

I did not come on here to sell packs though.

Ken, thanks for the support. It's amazing that at a site where numbers mean so much, words can mean so little.

Edited by wildlife on 01/18/2012 20:49:23 MST.

NM

Edited by Cameron on 01/18/2012 22:35:00 MST.

Imitation is not the sincerest form of flattery. Luke, I'm not going to hate you.

Luke said,

"I actually recall a comment somewhere (I think it was Ryan Jordan's blog) comparing the HMG Porter prototype to McHale packs. I don't recall the specifics but basically Ryan said he was excited about the HMG pack and that he thought it MIGHT be almost as good as a McHale pack. Personally I'd say immitation is the sincerest form of flattery."

Don't you think The Porter might be almost as good as a McHale if Ryan is designing it for them? Doesn't anybody get this? Ryan takes in packs from various companies ostensibly to review and test them and then takes that knowledge to help other companies design their packs and build his reputation? Do you think it's a coincidence that the width of the Daisy Chains on the Porter is within 1/4" of mine? a 1/4" Margin of error in 12" is not much when dealing in fabric. What else is going on? Is this the sincerest form of Flattery? We know Ryan has been helping them - it's all over the net. If it's their design, they don't need him, so it is what it is because of him. But gosh, I guess it's OK because they are selling it cheap.

This is better known as Conflict of Interest.

Edited by wildlife on 01/18/2012 21:20:47 MST.

NM

Edited by Cameron on 01/18/2012 22:36:37 MST.