Four years ago I purchased two pair of Patagonia pants. Gi II, full leg, not the zip off at 10.4 oz per pair. One pair in "Retro Khaki" the other in "some other word" for brown. They may be the last pants I buy from Patagonia. When I first purchased these pants at approximately $45 per pair I was impressed with what I though was quality construction, excellent fabric, great fit, and a promise from Patagonia that when these pants reached the end of their usefulness I could donate them to be used for recycled garments via Patagonia. I can't loose, right? Well, I have to say that I feel that I've been taken advantage of. How long could these perfect pants hold up? How long until I get to shop again? One year, two maybe.

How about a wear cycle like this: Khaki pair on for two days, Brown Pair on for two days, repeat. Imagine a montage (Muppet style) of the pants constantly on my body, working, hiking, traveling, family gatherings, working, hiking, etc. Finally, this year on a hike in CO I sat on a rock that looked less sharp than it was and put a centimeter hole in the butt of the brown pair. Location of said hole is right where it counts.

So, I'm thinking ok. I get to go buy some new pants after four freaking years. Then I get this email. "Don't Buy This Jacket" Ok, cool. I won't. I don't need a jacket, no problem. Then after reading the whole email, and frankly because I'm kinda a smart guy, really, I put two and two together I figured that they were not just talking about that one blue jacket. They were really talking about any color jacket, any Patagonia product, (having another smart guy moment here, real time while typing... any product you don't need, you don't need).

I feel cheated. Here I am looking for a way to help this struggling economy, and Patagonia is telling me, "Hey, guy. We'll fix that hole in your butt. We'll even match the fabric. So when you see people looking at your butt, you can rest assured they're not just looking at the crappy patch job, but their genuinely interested in your butt." - approximate conversation with Patagonia Customer Service

I should be clear... I may not have to buy another pair of Patagonia pants. The construction is quality. The fabric pretty darn good. The fit is perfect for me. Not too loose, but not too tight, no chafe induced by seams or stitching.
However, I'm not sure about the recycle portion of the deal. If they'll help me fix them, then I don't need to buy new pants. And if I don't need new pants these won't be recycled.

At about $45 per pair I've spent $23 per year to keep my lower body covered (you're welcome everyone). Those that know me, would say that's priceless.

Edited by Matt_Mahaney on 11/29/2011 20:55:03 MST.

Matt: Their stuff can last a long, long time. An older hiking acquaintance of mine has a Patagonia fleece, bought in 1985, whihc outlasted his hiking career (he just retired and starting some long trails back East when hit with a crippling disease - another story for another time). Comparing some Patagonia and other leading brand fleece I wear after work in colder weather, the Patagonia holds up better after 2 yrs., even color-wise, so the quality is there.

Still when I ripped a wind-resistant layer with a nail (helping push a vehicle off a road, I scraped a nail embedded in a telephone pole), it was a total loss for my LW R4 according to their customer service at the time. For city wear I'm going back to leather, probably backed with Kevlar (just semi-kidding). That nail could have done some damage.

(ed: punctuation)

Edited by hknewman on 11/30/2011 11:13:24 MST.

I used my 1983 hardshell Patagonia rain jacket this season, again, although I noted I have some seam-tape repairs to do inside the sleeves. The shell remains waterproof and the 1986 copy of a student newspaper left in the right outside pocket largely proves that, being essentially perfect other than at the folds. I purchased this as a second at Real Cheap Sports and I still haven't found the blem.

I occasionally still wear my 1982 fleece "bomber" jacket, also from Patagonia, but this one has an unfortunately imperfect patch on one arm from an encounter with a piece of angle iron that pierced the shell. Thankfully, my pants weren't involved with that incident...

I very often fantasize about fitting into my '85 Capilenes, which are fine, but seem to have shrunk in particular areas. Very odd, and clearly a product defect. Ahh, what the heck, I just bought some bigger ones a few years ago.

Back at the time I received my bomber jacket, Patagonia used to populate their print catalog with photos of owners in older gear. The old dude in a lobster boat with the red fleece on was an iconic image, at least to me. I often think that it would be cool if someone would snatch a photo of me when I'm hip deep in a mid-storm trail repair while wearing the old shell, would they run a photo of a product they obsoleted two decades ago? Would I be cool, then? Ha Ha!

If it's a good product, buy it. If it comes from China or Argentina or Turkey, but it's a solid product and you like the price, buy it. If somebody else has a problem with that, well then change your whole life to satisfy them.

Or not. I got my part figured out. I'd buy Patagonia again, if they'd just make more tall stuff.

@Eric.
When you first started posting, i thought English was your second language, or maybe you were dyslexic, as your posts were difficult to read and understand. They are sometimes written like a drunk child.
However, your last posts on this thread were pretty 'normal'. Obviously then, you have chosen your particular online persona. Maybe if you posted 'normal' more often, you wouldn't get so much grief?
This is meant with good intentions, as i assume you don't deliberately set out to wind folk up?

I think it's a great ad. Sure, they're touting how good and environmentally conscious they are, but it's an ad nonetheless. Here's how it came across to me: Don't buy a lot of stuff, but if you have to buy stuff, buy it from Patagonia because they make stuff that lasts a long time, they will help you repair it if needed and they will recycle for you if necessary. Maybe they will even give you a discount for a new or recycled item that you would BUY from Patagonia.

It's almost like getting rid of an older, running car and buying a hybrid so you can say you're environmentally sensitive. Nevermind that the new car still requires new materials and energy to build.

Mike

Its quite simple ... I view forums as informal conversation

Just as i rather not wear work suits after work ... I feel absolutely no need to treat forums posts as one would an academic paper or work email

I personally find it quite ridiculous that some people here write multi page essays to argue a point on an internet forum .... Or for every answer

But thats their choice

y'all might be doing yourselves a favor if you didn't care so much. I have to guess it's kind of stressful, or even annoying. My world has enough judgement to endure, the interwebs seems like a needless addition.

"I personally find it quite ridiculous that some people here write multi page essays to argue a point on an internet forum .... Or for every answer"

+1, though I will say that this place can be refreshing & thoughtful when not mired in pointless rants.

I like hearing Mike say "wind up". Or when others say "cheers". Fun avatars are great too.

Leave out punctuation and I will probably skip the reply, too hard to follow, I am busy
multitasking.

It does make my head hurt when Rog posts epic long climate change arguments using words
I can't follow. Reminds me of the local full page conspiracy letters to the paper about how the UN is taking over the world by putting cariboo on the endangered species list.

>Just as i rather not wear work suits after work ... I feel absolutely no need to treat
>forums posts as one would an academic paper or work email
While you may feel this way, remember that it takes two people to read a post: the poster and the reader. By contrast, it only takes one person to skip a post. Why would someone want to stop reading? One example: the ellipsis has specific uses in English writing, and by misusing it in every post, you force your reader to constantly adjust to your writing, which makes your "casual style" HARDER, not easier, for us to read.

>I personally find it quite ridiculous that some people here write multi page essays to
>argue a point on an internet forum .... Or for every answer
Then maybe you should go somewhere else because you obviously don't want to be a part of the community here, which you consider ridiculous.

>But thats their choice
Similarly, it's our choice to take nothing you say seriously. If it's not obvious to everyone here that you're just here to mess with people, that's only because they're giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you have some sort of mental disorder, perhaps asperger's, which renders you insensitive to the normal social cues.

Edited by artsandt on 11/30/2011 22:01:19 MST.

"While you may feel this way, remember that it takes two people to read a post: the poster and the reader. By contrast, it only takes one person to skip a post. Why would someone want to stop reading? One example: the ellipsis has specific uses in English writing, and by misusing it in every post, you force your reader to constantly adjust to your writing, which makes your "casual style" HARDER, not easier, for us to read."

I've found that this actually becoming more common than not. Between text messages and IMs alone (not to mention the bulk of forums out there), I'm actually more used to his style of writing then the classic norms. Skip his posts, I'm a "reader" and won't dismiss him for the things you would. It's this whole diversity thingy, I embrace it.

"Then maybe you should go somewhere else because you obviously don't want to be a part of the community here, which you consider ridiculous."

Whuh?!? Excuse me while I dismiss your venom and look to promote diversity. It's his choice to have an opinion, just as it is yours. He is not telling people how to post, not only does that sound short-sighted - it's my choice to say it's wrong on some fundamental levels. You would tell him to exude decency, but only to do it with proper punctuation. That's mighty decent of you, pffft

"Similarly, it's our choice to take nothing you say seriously. If it's not obvious to everyone here that you're just here to mess with people, that's only because they're giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you have some sort of mental disorder, perhaps asperger's, which renders you insensitive to the normal social cues."

See, my brother-in-law has aspergers. While I can appreciate your point, I'm afraid I won't be joining in on your goose-stepping parade. I believe he has managed to stay more than composed given some of the responses seen here. If all this is that troubling... ignore

grain of salt fellas....

btw, in case anyone was wondering, I bought 3 of "those jackets" 2 for me. you know just in case.

I bought the other for eric and I had "PATAGUCCI" embroidered on the back as large as would possibly fit.

"I bought the other for eric and I had "PATAGUCCI" embroidered on the back as large as would possibly fit."

that's how it's done right dare. Thank you

can anyone tell me the Arc'Teryx equivalence? I own both brands and already use the "patagucci" term quite a bit, the hipster in me needs to know about this urban-slang stuff

Art

Thats yr opinion

Personally i have no desire to read multi pargraph essays on an internet forum over some minor argument no one will "win" anyways

But then its the posters choice to write that ... If it concerns you so much i suggest asking BPL to ban all posts that arent grammatically correct

IMO ... Those who nitpick over the posting style on an internet forum of all places ...are those who have nothing better to say

Im not the one assuming mental illness on another bpl member ...

Just my opinion

Edit .... Note to mods this is way off "topic"

Edited by bearbreeder on 12/01/2011 09:22:53 MST.

"can anyone tell me the Arc'Teryx equivalence? I own both brands and already use the "patagucci" term quite a bit, the hipster in me needs to know about this urban-slang stuff"

Craig, that would be "Deadbird".

Thank you, Kat. Now I finally know what the heck that means.

haha, that's awesome. Thanks!

I know this has totally devolved from the OP, but Eric: it's not cute or hip or edgy to appear unintelligent. You can type just as fast using real words with proper punctuation, and the point that you want to communicate gets across more clearly and in a way that other people (and search engines) can better understand.

You obviously care to be heard. You've posted over 2000 times on this website. The reason BPL exists is because of people that want the best from themselves and the tools they use in the backcountry. It's not a stretch for you to extend some basic common courtesy to the people who's work you use and appreciate so people can understand the point you're trying to make without getting a headache.

"You obviously care to be heard. You've posted over 2000 times on this website."

2100 posts in 18 months. And countless posts on BP and RC and God knows what other internet forums. It's getting so that certain people can hardly find time to climb some off-width gnar in a Patagonia fleece and Arc'teryx tights.

Edited by DaveT on 12/01/2011 09:49:10 MST.

"it's not cute or hip or edgy to appear unintelligent."

I don't think he's trying to be cute, hip or edgy. He's trying to be himself, perhaps y'all will stop forcing a template of intelligence on him -> it's looking kinda' dumb to do so

"You can type just as fast using real words with proper punctuation, and the point that you want to communicate gets across more clearly and in a way that other people (and search engines) can better understand."

again, SUBJECTIVE! He comes across quite clear, just as your intolerance is coming across quite clear.

"It's not a stretch for you to extend some basic common courtesy to the people who's work you use and appreciate so people can understand the point you're trying to make without getting a headache."

It's not a stretch to extend some basic common courtesy to not judge someone based on grammatical clarity. No headaches here and I suggest using the ignore option if you're taking it that serious.

Kyle

Take from it what you will

If you cant read my posts ... Then dont read em

I skip over many lengthy post .... Simply because im not reading 10+ properly formtted paragraphs that simply argue a minor point ... I dont tell the posters not to write those APA style papers

This isnt work and it isnt academia ... Its a free worl to post as one likes

Enough people i find understand enough of my posts

This who dont and complain ... I would suggest reading some of the other excellent long posts from other members

You really shouldnt read this particular post as it can be difficult and is the work of a mentally damaged individual ... According to some bpl members

How a few extra " ..." Has bpl up in arms ;)

I suggest starting a particular thread for this topic in chaff if it so concerns you ...

As to dead bird ... Dead bird themselves uses it and said it was a term of endearment .... Ill find the quote when i get back to an actual computer ... Ie not an iphone