discussion of water/running packs moved from this thread:
Grand Canyon - BPL Group Run

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Nathan HPL 20 is very popular among ultra runners doing 50 & 100 milers.
it can be a bit warm because it covers a large part of the back and shoulders, so best for cool runs not ideal for hot runs.
I have one. since I do not use bladders (run with 2 handhelds) I removed the bladder and bladder pouch, and use it solely to carry food and clothes.
its a pretty small capacity pack, so it forces you to only take what you need.
it rides very comfortably on the back.

p.s.
the Nathan HPL 20 does not weigh 6 oz.
that is basically a lie on the Nathan web site.
Mine weighed 279 grams (9.8 oz) before modification and without the bladder.
my slightly modified and no bladder Nathan 20 weighs 241 grams (8.5 oz).

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Edited by asandh on 11/21/2011 08:16:53 MST.

Ordered after finding the Nathan 20 for $58.26 with free shipping on amazon. Thanks for the advice.

Over Thanksgiving (Thur - Sun) I am going to try a long(er) run 15-20 miles.

I've worked up to 2 hour duration - about 11 miles - but not carrying water or fuel. There is a nearby park that has a couple of connected trail loops 5.4 and 2.3 for total of 7.7 if run in a figure 8. I will do the 7.7 and then do just the 5.4 for total of 13.1 if I'm beat. The Nathan will not arrive by then but I will carry a 1L Platy or two in pack or hands with something rigged up.However, if I feel good I will go for two figure 8's, 15.4.

My plan is to do my first +20 long run ( 23.1 - 3 figure 8's) on that trail. Don't know when I will be ready for that. I hope to do that with the Nathan 20 next month.

I am starting to re-read the posts about fuel. Browsed the Hammer nutrition site. Maybe I will try something in addition to the hydration for next month long run.

Thanks all for the help with the water/running pack.

I love my delusions when they begin to approach reality - or is it vice versa : )

I have the HPL20 as well. Great pack, generally very comfortable, even with no shirt under it.

I'm going in Art's direction now...2 24oz. handhelds with the Nathan for food and clothing. I find I have a hard time gauging my hydration rate/remaining water supply when it's in a bladder on my back. With handhelds I have an easier time rationing my water.

For a R2R2R I'll likely carry the two 24oz. bottles, possibly with one extra in the pack (depending on our sources).

What brand of bottles? Do you have hand straps on them?

I would like to try carrying bottles, but I have not been able to find anything that looks like it would work well.

My favorites so far are the Camelbak Podium bottles. I think they have a great valve system; really high flow, but leak/drip free. I use Ultimate Direction handstraps/holders for them.

http://www.camelbak.com/Sports-Recreation/Bottles/Podium-Bottle-24oz.aspx

http://www.zombierunner.com/store/product233.html#233

I don't think you can buy the straps separate. I did use the Ultimate Direction bottles pictured in the link and liked them too...I switched to the Camelbaks after wearing out the originals.

that's funny, my favorite hand bottle holders are also the Ultimate Direction.
in fact they are the only ones I like.
get them from REI, they come with a bottle (which I do not like) so that jacks up the price a bit.

I only hand carry 21 oz bottles, the 24 oz are a bit heavy for me. if I need extra water I just put a 24 oz lightweight water bottle in my pack which I use to refill my handhelds.
I use the REI/Novara bottles (in the bike section). they come in 21 oz and 24 oz.
I mainly use them because they work fine for me and are cheap ($5 ea).

Edited by asandh on 11/21/2011 17:50:45 MST.

pack (HPL 20) may have changed???, Nathan's now lists it at 14.0 oz

http://www.nathansports.com/our-products/hydrationnutrition/race-vests/hpl-020

I'll probably go w/ my Talon 5.5 (it's 18.4 oz in size M/L) it's decently roomy even w/ a full bladder; the "not seeing your water" is definitely a problem w/ bladders, hopefully w/ 2 liters I can drink pretty regularly and won't run myself dry

I'll probably throw in an empty 0.5 l platy to mix w/ Gatorade powder at watering holes

Perfect - that's what I was looking for. Thanks. I think I will be set now for bottles/pack.

I will keep reading about fuels and energy drinks. Then try something. The original beast thread has been a great start for me.

Rereading back over those posts, I reread about shoes and more protection. I'm going to keep my eyes open for a good sale.

Mike
the HPL 20 has not changed. the weight was listed wrong on the web for a long time.
14 oz (with bladder) sounds about right since it weighs 9.8 oz without bladder.

George
I hope you realize there is a male and female version of the HPL 20, and they do fit slightly differently.
the male HPL 20 is typically grayish, while the female one is usually purple or blue.
but I have seen females wearing the male one, and a few males wearing the female one.
whatever fits.

Edited by asandh on 11/22/2011 06:05:14 MST.

Thanks, I know now : ) I checked my order and lucked out...

Nathan HPL #020 2.0 Liter Men's 2-Liter Hydration Race Vest (Flint Grey)

My plan is to use the bladder to start and then transition to carrying bottles. I'm looking forward to my attempt towards a long run. Appreciate the continuing inspiration and support from all of you.

Running Warehouse hase six of the mens NHPL20 hydration packs in stock;
http://www.runningwarehouse.com/descpage-NHPL020.html

Art,

What 50 miler road ultra did you recently complete?

(moved this post from the log thread)

Congrats on completing it!