seth, I think you are on the edge with that bag and those clothes. Since it is only two nights your brother will survive on a full belly and all those clothing but he might not sleep much or be that comfortable. BUT for comparison, I am a warm sleeper and I have taken my 5 above bag to -12 and slept a little chilly but I blame that on being sick and not eating not the bag. IF it is a quality bag and true to the 20 degree rating and your brother usually sleeps a bit warmer, and wears all those extra clothes, AND eats a ton of food for dinner and then a nice midnight snack when he gets cold at 4 am then he should be just fine... Otherwise I would rent the warmer bag ;)

my gearlist is in my profile for review/reference. Getting stoked!!!

Wow nice list Jeremey. Seems like you have your winter setup pretty dialed in. Thanks for posting it. I look foward to seeing that MYOG down jacket. Looking at your list and Mike C. post that was referenced here inspired me to start making my own winter list and right off the bat I see some glaring holes in it as of right now.

Winter Shelter, Snowshoes, Winter Cooking Setup, Winter Sleeping Bag, Winter Footwear and Nalgene Bottles/coozies

Sleeping Bag I will probably double up on two bags for now.
Either 25*Down/30*Down or 25*Down/35*Synthetic

Footwear I have a few options that will work, non that are ideal

Snowshoes, maybe Santa will come through for me

Shelter, Im at a loss

Cook Setup, same as shelter

As for Clothes I have enough stuff to stay warm/dry moving and in camp.
Depending on my footwear choice, I may have to work out what Im gonna do in camp.


I will post my list when I finish it.

I would love to be able to go out and get some true winter gear, but the funds are not there for it right now. Depending on what I cobble together might have to go the rental route on some items.

I am getting stoked as well. Thinking of picking up a pair of MSR Lightning Ascents for the trip. I weigh 160, with gear the total weight would be around 190 I'm guessing. Would the 25s suffice?

Thanks Clint, I don't think you will need to get all that stuff right off the bat, but winter is a bit tricky because for the most part you can't really make do until you can afford something lighter or better. The most important are clothing, sleeping, and footware. As far as stoves go I am not sure of our final count but I think we are up to around 8-12? We should be able to get away with 4 or 5 white gas stoves/ 2L or bigger pots. Does that sound right?

If so I have one stove and 1.5L pot that I can bring but if anyone has an extra 2L or larger that would be a better choice.

Tent wise, I can hold one more in my SL2 if there is anyone that is a bivy sleeper, otherwise I might just sleep in my bivy/tarp and leave the SL2 at home.

Matt, I think you will be good with those shoes, they are pretty great I have seen them in action. I was bumming, those came out about 6 months after I bought my Denali's, night and day difference. I can't justify replacing snowshoes that have years of life left in them, so in a few years I am going to get the hovercraft version.

Also, I have never used poles. Are these a necessity for snowshoeing? I was thinking of grabbing a pair of wally world poles, just to see if i like them or not. I could also just borrow some poles from a friend for the Glastenbury trip.

I am going to try and rock a Vargo Ti Hexagon wood stove and .9l Cargo Ti Pot. I figure unlimited fuel. But I need to sort out my fire starting and bushcraft a bit.

I have a 15F Marmot Helium Bag and I will layer my 40F JRB down quilt inside.

Going to mess with some vapor barrier stuff as well. Why not (doggie poo bags are cheap!)?

Need to figure out hand insulation a bit better.

Matt- I think 25in snowshoes would work well for u w/ gear. I am bringing poles definitely (with baskets!)

@Bryce, Matthew and Jeremy - Thanks for the offers of possible rides. Right now I'm not sure if I'm in for both nights, or just Saturday night. Both nights would make the 5 hr trip more palatable(as would some company), but I'm also trying to save my vacation days. I really want to take a few in Feb to go to the GGG in CA, where I used to live. I may just have to bite the bullet and call in 'sick.'

@Seth and anyone coming up short in the winter gear dept - Both REI's in CT rent snowshoes, tents, sleeping bags and pads (heavy but at least you could get a 0* or close and be safe) and backpacks(for those who only have a pack for 7lb base weights). I don't see where they list prices, but I feel like in CA, when I rented snow shoes for my Sierra club snow camping class, it was about $35-$40 for 3 days.

Edited to add my tentative gearlist

Edited by jrmacd on 12/14/2011 12:18:43 MST.

That is a tough one, I think they are essential with snowshoes for some reason, but my girlfriend hates them the few times she has been snowshoeing. On this mountain if you don't have them, and don't usually use them I think you will be fine.

So Friday night is a 2mi hike in to Melville-Nauheim Shelter
Saturday is an 8 mile hike to the Goddard Shelter
Sunday is a 10mi hike out to the trailhead.

Saturday and Sunday will be exhausting for me, not going to lie. Especially if the snow is deep and breaking trail. (Ryan you'll have to lead the entire way with the motor you have. haha) Is this well within everyone's mileage given we'll be snowshoeing? (seems like a lot, but I've never really done this) What other winter trips have you done and what mileage?

Who has maps of the area? What are the best maps to buy? (some sort of Long Trail map?)

What "feel" will this hike have? With the miles we'll be covering it will be long days of hiking me thinks as opposed to hanging in camp. And long days will prob require some hiking in the dark. If this is the case, it will affect the stove I may bring (might pair up with someone else's gas stove and just carry extra fuel and leave my idea of wood stove at home as less day light to collect sticks) and the clothes I bring (bring less camp clothes if I'm just going to hike 24/7 and then eat a bit and crash in my sleeping bag)

Thoughts?

Hummm. I think it will be alot of hiking, you almost always have to either start or finish a winter hike in the dark. The good thing is if we have about 8 or so people we can roll the leader out every 50 or 100 yards so that the same person isn't breaking the trail the whole way. I think that should speed up our pace to around 2 mph fairly easily since when the leader rolls out they get a few minute break to drink, eat, adjust clothing layers...

I don't think I would bring less clothing, we will still be spending alot of time boiling water for meals and drinking. I plan on bringing a little Gin to keep warm in camp;)

Not sure about a map, I am going to swing by REI a few weeks before the trip and get something. The usgs quad I found online is too old, it doesn't show the current trail location. I think we stay on the AT the whole time.

Thanks for the info Jeremy. I definitely don't want to be "that guy" but I realize this is going to be WORK and I want to make sure I can handle it and I'm not holding anyone back. A 10-15mi hike during 3-season is a good day for me. Doing the same in the winter with snowshoes will be a big task. I'll have to think about it.

Also, how much water do people generally burn through on a trip like this? If I am rocking the wood stove I'll feel bad if I am slower to get a boil going. :p Thx.

Water is a personal preference, my norm is...
I start the day with 2 bottles of water, one hot and one cool (this is the one that if I am going to add a drink mix to like gatorade powder or tang) I drink all of the cold one and most of the hot one on a normal day, plus the occasional handfull of snow if it is a warm day and fresh snow is on the ground. For breakfast I have a cup of hot chocolate with oatmeal all mixed together and possible some tea. Then dinner is more hot chocolate, a soup, and enough to rehydrate dinner. So 2L to drink while hiking, then another 2-3 for food and hot drinks in camp.

I say bring the wood stove, I have never really seen one in action so I would love to inspect it, and frankly I want to see if it will put out enough heat to boil water in camp. It looks like there "should" be running water by both shelters so we hopefully won't have to melt snow for water. I will bring enough fuel that if you can't get it to boil in a reasonable amount of time you can pull off of my stove. Does anyone have a water bucket? OR 2? Those would be a great 6-8oz!

Hrmm, I wonder if I'm going to be the tard bushwhacking off trail to find twings buried under 2 feet of snow during breaks. haha. (I was thinking I'd break off dead sticks from low trees)

But if there will be water sources, that'll make things much easier... I guess streams don't freeze up there in January? *scratches head*

The stove definitely can melt snow, but again, my firestarting ability needs to be on point:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNf--xVOv4M

I will have a .9 Ti pot (if we need to melt snow, otherwise something lighter me thinks).

I also dug up a "water bag" for carrying big loads of water into camp from a nearby stream kind of things. I got it NIB at a garage sale a long time ago and never used it. Is that what you're after?

Bryce, it's probably going to be a rugged trip. Elevation gain on day two will be really easy up until the last mile or so, but 8 miles is a pretty hefty distance. I think we can do it, though. :)

As for water, melting snow will be the only source of water on night two. There's a spring at Goddard Shelter, but it's small and will probably freeze or be snowed over. Night one, there's a stream, but it's not big. We may need to melt water. I've got my old whisperlite, and we can definitely get three or four people going on one of those. The wood burning stove... I think that'll work. You can almost always find decent firewood if you take a little bit of time in New England. Between the bunch of us, we can get that fire burning!

Maps... the Green Mountain Club's Long Trail Map is the best. I've got a track on my GPS from the same hike done earlier in the season, so if we have trouble and don't want to play around finding the trail, we can cheat that way.

I have one extra pair of MSR Lightning Ascent 25 snowshoes. Who wants to use them?

Since We will be melting our water supply, do we still treat it?

Does it have to be boiling for a certain number of minutes?

If it hits a rolling boil..you're good to go. If we want to conserve fuel, drop a Micropur tablet into lukewarm water.

I look forward to the pictures from this one. should be epic.

/lives vicariously through the local nutcases ;)

Hi,
I'd really like to go, but I don't have a car. Could I hitch a ride with someone?
Thanks,
Barry

glad these things live lives of their own to get moving.

I'm in. I may be able to get one housemate to join since her parents live up in VT.

depending on whom of my friends want to go I can give rides from Boston, the pooch will be joining though, in case of any allergies.

I'd also be down with tent sharing if others are interested? I've got a Losi 3P, unknown as to whether the pooch will want to sleep in the tent, but he is an excellent heat source...

I need to read through this thread a bit more and see what gear I may still need...