Hi,

I'm going to try one more Sierra trip this season. To avoid experiencing the surprising level of cold I felt the last time I did this:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=52492

I'd like to try a thinlight pad. To play it safe, I'm considering either the 3/16" pad or two 1/8" pads. I've never used one of these pads before. While two pads would allow for more flexibility, I'm concerned that too many moving pieces here would cause slippage or other problems with my quilt. What do you folks think?

Thanks,

rhz

I would go thicker rather than thinner. I wouldn't worry about friction or slippage. I think the Ridgerest is good pad and in winter or late fall I'll use it with another plain ccf pad about 1/2 in thick. I also sleep with a quilt.

As I was reading your previous post about being cold. I wondered if having the fly on your tent all zippered up was aiding to your feeling cold. I find wet/moist air more cold than dry or drier air. I like more ventilation than less. You might try allowing more ventilation than less and see if it works better.

Edited by JBMcSr1 on 10/25/2011 16:57:54 MDT.

Go with the thicker pad.

Yeah, thicker is better. Don't worry about slippage, that is one of the nice things about closed cell foam (it isn't slippery). I've combined foam plenty of times as well as combined foam with inflatables and self inflating mattresses.

I'm a really cold sleeper; I'd go with the thickest CCF pad you can get. Put it on top of the NeoAir.

Also, your NeoAir (or any insulated air pad) needs to be blown up to the maximum to have its full R-rating (see the recent articles on insulated air pads). If you had it soft enough to be comfortable for your prior trip, that was part of the problem. If, like me, you need it soft to avoid painful hips, consider a Ridge Rest for on top of the NeoAir.

When I tried a NeoAir in cold weather (18*F), with a 1/8" GG Thinlite pad, I about froze. It was obviously the pad since no matter how I lay, I was warm on top while the part of me against the pad was shivering! Experimentation came up with the warmest combination being the pad blown up full and hard and the Thinlite on top rather than on the bottom. It still wasn't enough, but at least I got a few hours' fitful sleep. Every time I moved, though, I rolled off the pad! And I moved a lot because my hips got really sore!

The justification for a quilt is that the sleeping bag insulation under you is squashed to maybe 1/2 inch, so the part under you is wasted insulation/weight. However, the part under you is not zero insulation, just considerably less than the fluffy down on top of you. That's one reason I prefer a sleeping bag to a quilt, and would want a warmer pad if I did use a quilt. The other is that I toss and turn a lot, and since childhood I've learned to take the sleeping bag with me. With a quilt setup, I'd probably end up with the sleeping pad on top! Your mileage, obviously, may vary!

I read your other thread; be sure to take the down pants, warm socks or down booties and a balaclava!

Unless you can gather enough duff under your sleeping pad, assume the pad needs to insulate better than your quilt.

I often find my sleeping pad is the weak link when sleeping on cold hard ground.
If I can pitch my shelter on plant matter, I am much warmer.

I also find that insulation is more effective on my core and head. I keep my head well layered and wear a puffy vest when I sleep near freezing.

You will find that if your core and head are warm, your arms and legs won't mind the cold so much.

There is also the school of thought that says make sure you are slightly cool when you go to bed. If you are warm, your body will perspire more, causing condensation in your quilt, degrading the insulation in the quilt.

Do not let yourself get too warm when you first get to bed. Have the extra layers on hand for 3:00 AM when you do get cold.

Yes, a thicker pad would certainly be warmer. I had thought that two 1/8" pads might offer more flexibility, but now I'm actually leaning toward the single 3/8" pad which comes in at just under 6oz. Unfortunately, that puts my neo-air all season large + foam pad at near 2lbs--significantly heavier than the quilt. Does anyone know the diameter of these pads when rolled up? I was not counting on fitting such a thick pad in my pack.

Thanks again.

rhz