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Clint Wayman
(cwayman1) - M

Locale: East Tennessee, US
Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 13:11:19 MDT Print View

Ok, so can somebody explain what these protests are ACTUALLY about? WITHOUT political name-calling? So far, these are the basic points that I'm getting:

-the protests are against government-aided bank bailouts because the banks misused the first round of bailouts.
-the government needs to stop helping the wealthy 1-2% of Americans just because they help fund the government.
-corporate money needs to get out of politics
-government needs to shorten the gap between rich and poor
-democrats hate republicans and republicans hate democrats, but that's not even the original purpose of the protests

My questions:
-who started them?
-are they heavily influenced by one particular political party, or is it a legit mixed group of concerned individuals?
-are they funded (partially or fully) by either the government or outside organizations?
-if the protests are against government bailouts, and certain political groups are also against government bailouts, why are there not more political groups hopping in on this? or are they?'

again, please keep your comments as un-bashing as possible.

many thanks,
Clint

Jon Franklin
(Junto01) - F
Occupy.....demands straight from the horses mouth on 10/08/2011 13:17:56 MDT Print View

See the official demands below, some are rather humerous.


http://occupywallst.org/forum/proposed-list-of-demands-for-occupy-wall-st-moveme/

James Castleberry
(Winterland76)
Occupy______protests on 10/08/2011 13:31:28 MDT Print View

I don't know where you got that "official" list. Clint, I think this speech by rapper Immortal Technique explains better what the movement is about. It's about young people with no jobs and no good prospects (offshored!) pointing out the obvious - the interests of the financial industry and politicians are diametrically at odds with the interests of we the people. Which makes for an interesting conundrum with so much we have wrapped up in 401ks, mutual funds, etc.
http://qik.com/video/44583274

Dale Wambaugh
(dwambaugh) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 13:36:32 MDT Print View

I see it as a general "I'm mad as Hell and I'm not going to take it any more" approach. We have a lot on our plate:

War
Terrorism
Poverty
Education
Medical care
The economy
Unemployment
The environment
Human rights
Energy
Global competition
Overpopulation
Genocide
Apathy on all the above

Sheesh!

What really chaps my hide is the practice of partisan politics at the expense of the country. With all we have going on, it is NOT the time to be quibbling. I say, get to work or get out.

In the words of Bob Dylan,

"Come senators, congressmen
Please heed the call
Don't stand in the doorway
Don't block up the hall
For he that gets hurt
Will be he who has stalled
There's a battle outside ragin'.
It'll soon shake your windows
And rattle your walls
For the times they are a-changin'."


Straight answer to what some of the protesters have to say:

From http://occupywallst.org/:
"Occupy Wall Street is leaderless resistance movement with people of many colors, genders and political persuasions. The one thing we all have in common is that We Are The 99% that will no longer tolerate the greed and corruption of the 1%. We are using the revolutionary Arab Spring tactic to achieve our ends and encourage the use of nonviolence to maximize the safety of all participants."

Lyan Jordan
(redmonk)

Locale: Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem
Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 13:36:55 MDT Print View

Very young movement, still under development, actively seeking input from various sources.
Things moving slowly as they try to be inclusive of views and opinions.

The banks stole our future. People are upset. No jobs available, People are now finding occupations.
Until the future is brighter, no reason to move.

#ows

larry savage
(pyeyo) - F

Locale: pacific northwest
road blocks to change on 10/08/2011 13:48:32 MDT Print View

1. In 1986 James McGill Buchanan won the Nobel Memorial Prize for Economics, Buchanan's work initiated research on how politicians' self-interest and non-economic forces affect government economic policy. His public choice theory is often used to explain how political decision-making results in outcomes that conflict with the preferences of the general public.
2. We have no realistic term limits for politicians.
3. We have no realistic reform of banking practices. [The Dodd-Frank Bill versus the SEC]
4. The average age of a US Represntative is 59, a Senator is 61.
5. Senior citizens experience twice the voting power as the younger third of voters.
6. A CEO's salary in the US is out of proportion with the rest of the world.
[see below]
7. Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission, the Supreme Court made any attempts at meaningful campaign reform non-existent.
I cut this out of another thread but it seems appropriate hereceo ratio

jerry adams
(retiredjerry) - MLife

Locale: Oregon and Washington
Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 13:52:22 MDT Print View

What's it about?

people are mad that we have the best government money can buy

that's my biased opinion

it's interesting to compare to the tea party - some similarities - but the tea party got hijacked by the elite, wealthy, right wingers.

it'll be interesting to see what happens in the near future

Craig Savage
(tremelo) - F

Locale: San Jacinto Mountains
occupy on 10/08/2011 14:13:37 MDT Print View

whatever your opinion, do not let the corporate media lead you to believe this is a political institution (occupy). this is not about democrats & republicans anymore

Tim Zen
(asdzxc57) - F

Locale: MI
Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 14:47:58 MDT Print View

I don't have any factual knowledge to back this up, but the protest is about...

HK Newman
(hknewman) - MLife

Locale: Western US
Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 15:23:05 MDT Print View

*A dry run was done in NYC the summer prior to protest city-level and federal - level cuts around the time of the 2 Aug budget vote in Congress:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/10/occupy-wall-street-origins_n_1083977.html?page=2

The protest is like "gremlins"; go after 1 and 10 more pop up.

Add, the ability to organize anonymously on no budget, probably due to experience planning all those raves away from the prying eyes of law enforcement ... kind of ethereal.

(*edited with new info from HP 11-12-2011 linky above, just didn't want to update and ignite a heated thread)

Edited by hknewman on 11/14/2011 11:39:47 MST.

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
Re: Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 15:37:53 MDT Print View

Dale hit it on the head.

My take is a tad different though somewhat the same:
The working and middle class has been under class warfare for the past 20 years or so. The gulf between the "haves" and "have nots" has increased dramatically over the last 10 years. The wealthy that make up the upper echilon are not paying their fare share of taxes. Wall St. has been plundering America and us working and middle class citzens have been paying the brunt of it. I am tired of watching banks charge me fee after fee, whether it is raising an interest rate on one of my credit cards or not willing to work out some mod on my home loan because my house is $70,000 underwater. I am tired of them looking for any loophole they can when The Government shuts them down on another. I am sick of seeing poor and mentally ill walking the streets with no place to sleep. I am tired of seeing hungry folks going to foodbanks because they cannot afford to feed themselves. I am tired being tired.

I am tired of the young fighting wars that were based on lies. I am tired of the news everyday. I just want a better place to live. If that means taking to the streets to show your displeasure, than good on you! Until people make their voices heard this will continue.

I am a staunch liberal and live in la la liberal land. One thing I do dislike is when everyone has to prostest over well just anything. I live near Santa Cruz and nothing makes my blood boil when I see "rich" college kids protesting for the sake of protesting than getting a job and contributing. This on the otherhand is a worthy cause.

Edited by kennyhel77 on 10/08/2011 18:09:14 MDT.

Tom Kirchner
(ouzel) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest/Sierra
Re: Re: Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 16:18:55 MDT Print View

"This on the otherhand is a worthy cause."

+1 your entire post. I sense that it is representative of a nation wide awakening that eventually will cut across all the petty lines that divide us. It can't be done by a liberal, or any other, elite, but must come from the bottom up. Hold onto your hats, folks, the times may finally be a changin'.

Interesting that one major source of inspiration is the Arab Spring, from a region that we have helped brutally suppress for decades. What goes around comes around. Karma-vipaka.

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
Re: Re: Re: Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 16:35:17 MDT Print View

Agree Tom.

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
Re: Occupy______protests on 10/08/2011 16:51:55 MDT Print View

James that was well written BTW

Justin Baker
(justin_baker) - F

Locale: Santa Rosa, CA
Re: Occupy _________ protests? on 10/08/2011 17:05:33 MDT Print View

It's a bunch angry people trying to push very generic liberal politics in a very powerful and unique way. That's the simplest way to put it.
They are upset with wall street controlling our government, but they want to force the government and give them more powerful to stop wall street. The same government that is so easily bought out by wall street. Doesn't seem very logical...
There are also a few "end the fed" guys walking around.

Jason Elsworth
(jephoto) - M

Locale: New Zealand
"Occupy _________ protests?" on 10/08/2011 17:08:21 MDT Print View

Interesting article and comments.

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/10/05/opinion/rushkoff-occupy-wall-street/

Jesse Glover
(hellbillylarry) - F

Locale: southern appalachians
Ows on 10/08/2011 17:49:33 MDT Print View

From what I can tell its a bunch of well intentioned misinformed kids.

They say they want to end corruption between government and banks/corporations but they want to give the government more power to legislate more regulations.

They talk about democracy (USA is not and never has been a democracy) but want to instill lots of communist/socialist things like a guaranteed living wage regardless of employment. Universal healthcare and put insurance companies out of business.

$20 an hour minimum wage? How much would a big Mac cost if the minimum wage was $20? Probably $10.

They complain about corporations on twitter with their iPads.

I agree that corruption has gone too far and some thing needs to be done. But these children if they are ever to be taken seriously need to find someone with a brain and organize their movement.

As far as the rich paying their fair share. What would you suggest? Most wealthy people pay ~50% of their income to various taxes. It's the corporations that don't pay taxes and that needs to be stopped the only way to do that is to abolish the IRS and instill a flat tax or a nationwide sales tax. This is the only way to insure that everyone pays their "fair share" IMO you should be taxed on what you spend not what you make.

And those college kids who can't find a job? They should have learned a skill before going to college. There is a shortage of skilled tradesmen in this country. Of course that would require actual hard work something that most young people these days know nothing about.

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
Re: Ows on 10/08/2011 18:07:16 MDT Print View

Jesse come live in the SF Bay Area... $20 does an hour does not get you very far. Though you'd be in punk rock heaven :)

Edited by kennyhel77 on 10/08/2011 18:10:57 MDT.

Jesse Glover
(hellbillylarry) - F

Locale: southern appalachians
Re: Re: Ows on 10/08/2011 18:14:43 MDT Print View

I'm sure as an auto mechanic I'd make more in the bay area. But the real question is why is the cost of living so high there? Could it be the ridiculous regulations you guys have to deal with? California is a great example of what happens when big government runs amok.

[OT]As a automobile hobbyist and auto mechanic the worthless regulations in the name of clean air would keep me away. Not that I'm against emissions regulations but a actual automotive engineer should be consulted on the regs instead of some suit and tie geek who knows nothing about how an engine produces emissions.[/OT]

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
Re: Re: Re: Ows on 10/08/2011 18:38:11 MDT Print View

Jesse you would make more, however it is not because we are heavily regulated, even though we are. The population centers of California are all centered on the coast, ie San Francisco, LA, and San Diego and those areas are the most desirable places to live. It is about jobs, climate, beauty, and the quality of life here that makes it desirable. You would mess (can't say words I want to say) pants if you knew what I payed for my home. Hey come to our BPL gathering Presidents Weekend you have a place to stay!