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Oh dear. Is it the economy?
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Craig W.
(xnomanx) - F - M
Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/20/2011 20:55:48 MDT Print View

Concurrent gun threads, machete arguments, and plans for electric bear fences at Rae Lakes...I guess we go in cycles here.

But it's not even winter yet. This does not bode well for future forum decorum.

Maybe soon we'll ALL be stressed, scared, and packin' heat in the hills, under our pillows, in our purses.

Unless we turn all the noise, all that paranoia, all the anger, and all the resentment off.

Who knows.

I just got back from a run, finished homework with the kids, and I'm off to practice guitar now. I've been working on singing "I Dreamed I Saw St. Augustine" by Bob Dylan. Sweet lyrics. I'll play it for my children a few times until I get the thumbs up or "You stink, dad!".

Am I becoming some sort of old hippie? At least I don't wear patchouli oil.

But hey, it's WAY less stressful than imagining myself electrocuting bears, shooting boogeymen, or arguing 9MM terminal ballistics on the internet on a Tuesday evening.

Cheers. I've got one cold Newcastle left.

Travis Leanna
(T.L.) - MLife

Locale: Wisconsin
Re: Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/20/2011 21:13:45 MDT Print View

My knee-jerk un-thought out answer?

The world is becoming a more hostile place. Whether we like it or not, people are ruder, wars and uprisings are commonplace, governments and financial institutions are making a mess and cannot be trusted, etc, etc, etc...

So we become more defensive. It makes us more critical of others. It makes us more critical of any viewpoint that doesn't mesh with our own. It makes us some level of paranoid, and everything is always someone else's fault. Personal responsibility is nearly extinct. Simply put? Social decline.

Joe Clement
(skinewmexico) - MLife

Locale: Southwest
Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/20/2011 21:35:04 MDT Print View

You're overthinking it. It's just new guys. Should steer them towards Whiteblaze or The High Road.

Ken T.
(kthompson) - MLife

Locale: All up in there
Re: Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/20/2011 21:41:40 MDT Print View

Joe is right. And we fall into their trap every time. Should learn... Don't reply.

a b
And yet.. on 09/20/2011 22:05:28 MDT Print View

Right below this thread is another dealing with "ultralight revolvers".
okay.. I am gonna go postal on this sh#t.
You are not gonna die!
I just walked over 7,900 miles through "Bear/ boogey man" country myself and the biggest threat was lightning. ticks, and mosquitos.
Every thru hiker i met was "armed" with exactlty the same thing.. = Don't cook and sleep where you eat.
There are no friggin' ravenous beast waiting in the dark woods, or upon mountain's summit to devour your soul.
They want your frucking candy bars... and that is it.
I shall invoke the Lord now..
"It is man that makes animals act unpredictably." - Edward Abbey.
You want to pis off Catcus Ed?!
I didn't think so..
Wipe your butt and hang your food or put it in a canister in campgrounds, or stealth camp far away from water or food preparation.
End Rant...
A fed bear is a dead bear.

David T
(DaveT) - F
hmmmm. on 09/20/2011 22:05:43 MDT Print View

Craig, your post is just what I was wondering today, after the last gun thread, and then two brand new gun threads from noob posters sitting at the top of my Recent Threads.

But yes, maybe it's just the heightened level of awareness about UL backpacking that is making web searches (unfortunately?) find the forums here, and then new posters can ask about rifles and electrified fences and how to stop a charging bull moose with a machete.

One can either ignore, educate, or try to ridicule them away. Dunno.

Edited by DaveT on 09/20/2011 22:14:11 MDT.

jennifer ross
(jenhifive) - F

Locale: Norcal
Set in fear on 09/20/2011 23:01:58 MDT Print View

Maybe it's the news or internet but every single time I tell co-workers, friends, or family members that I'll be in the wilderness and out of touch for a while I always get questions or shall I say ingnorant comments about safety. One of my friends really thought people kill people in tents because you can't deadbolt them. I've been told I should bring a gun to protect myself from bears many times. I just didn't think people were actually taking this advice or the people that hold this opinion would backpack.

I love backpackers. Every single person you encounter on a back trail smiles and says hi. Dayhikes not so much.
You smile while passing someone in the grocery store and you get a dirty look then later they cut you in line while the other person they're with is still shopping putting more stuff on the belt.

Hk Newman
(hknewman) - MLife

Locale: Western US
Re: Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/21/2011 08:50:57 MDT Print View

Despite the worsening economy, crime decreased last year by almost 8% (FBI stats for 2010 if ye care to be a'Googlin), as most wealth is in the form of electrons.  What is someone going to steal?  A credit card  monitored by a bank and shut off for any deviation in purchasing patterns?  

More in the case of Joe C, think its new people but with an important caveat. With more handguns being purchased since the election, IMO either people are more curious combining UL with "survivalism" (yeah, that military spec stuff weighs a ton) or these posts are trial balloons floated to attract new buyers (like all bizness, gotta keep that inventory flowing). Honestly the calibers floated are better suited for a bridge game gone bad at the senior center.

Annoying but maybe our gear makers and apparel makers could offer more options in gray-green or modern camo pattern, helping our cottage gear makers (plus our own stealth campers).

K ....
(Kat_P) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Coast
Re: Re: Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/21/2011 09:05:31 MDT Print View

Hk :
"Annoying but maybe our gear makers and apparel makers could offer more options in gray-green or modern camo pattern, helping our cottage gear makers (plus our own stealth campers)."

Like this?


Haven't sold many, though.

Ben Crocker
(alexdrewreed) - M

Locale: Kentucky
Fear on 09/21/2011 09:15:18 MDT Print View

There really does seem to be a lot of fear going around right now. I think its even worse here in the southeast. Maybe its always been here and I just didn't notice it before. Is it ok to be a little afraid of all this fear? FDR thought so.

Eugene Smith
(Eugeneius) - MLife

Locale: Nuevo Mexico
sign of the times? on 09/21/2011 10:00:43 MDT Print View

Sign of the times?

While there is still positive and encouraging content being shared, it is waning it seems.

BPL is running thin, content has dropped, administrative involvement is seemingly nonexistent, the vision and focus of this website is murky, people are buying their way into 5lb. baseweights in a matter of a week. It doesn't surprise me one bit that so much energy and time is wasted on discussions as menial as gun ownership, politics, and the latest greatest pro shell offering.

USA Duane Hall
(hikerduane) - F

Locale: Extreme northern Sierra Nevada
Fear at work of the outdoors on 09/21/2011 11:30:13 MDT Print View

I mostly solo bp, either on weekends or week+ trips. Always asked, "aren't you scared of bears"? :) No, have not seen a bear while bping since Pooch passed away 8 years ago. My feeling is people who bp are mostly from the city, they can deal with news about another killing or rape, burglary. They cannot deal with one bear or lion attack, it is unfamiliar to them. Spoken by a small town, country living, single guy.

Dale Wambaugh
(dwambaugh) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Re: Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/21/2011 12:09:05 MDT Print View

I think it was the artist Anne Truitt who noticed that art became smaller and more portable in times of war and political strife. The last decade has been much, much too "interesting," as in the old Chinese curse, "May you live in interesting times." Terrorism, war, economic collapse, climate change and all the rest have had a toll on our psyche. There is a lot of keyboard bravado and discussions that would get us in trouble at work or in the local bar. That and the shock that there are more fruitcakes running loose than you imagined :)

David T
(DaveT) - F
bang goes the machete. on 09/21/2011 13:38:00 MDT Print View

"BPL is running thin, content has dropped, administrative involvement is seemingly nonexistent, the vision and focus of this website is murky..."

Yes. BPL proper has been declining for a long time. I, for one, was not remotely swayed or slightly convinced by Ryan Jordan's post a while back about his blog vs. BPL vs. whatever. The vision and focus is indeed murky, involvement of the "leadership" seems about non-existent, and the forums seem to reflect it.

But the latest round of guns, machetes, electrified fences, etc. seems freshly ridiculous. It also seems like you can see a post, predictably decide it's a noob, click on their profile, and find that it's their first (or fourth) post that they decided to ask about rifles for their overnight hike. Back in the day seems like folks lurked and read and learned and asked intelligent questions based on doing some research and thinking of their own.

Oh well.

Travis Leanna
(T.L.) - MLife

Locale: Wisconsin
Re: bang goes the machete. on 09/21/2011 13:41:46 MDT Print View

"...and thinking of their own."

Now, well, there's the problem. FAR too many people can't or won't think for themselves anymore. When I hear a grown man at the gas station asking for change and get confused as to how many quarters are in a dollar, I start to lose hope.

"It also seems like you can see a post, predictably decide it's a noob..."

And often you can predict how the thread will turn out. How many "oh boy, here we go again" posts end up near the beginning of those types of threads?

Edited by T.L. on 09/21/2011 15:56:02 MDT.

Sarah Kirkconnell
(sarbar) - F

Locale: In the shadow of Mt. Rainier
Re: Oh dear. Is it the economy? on 09/21/2011 16:08:59 MDT Print View

While I am one of the 2nd Amendment supporters here on BPL I stay out of most threads on guns and whatnot. I know what I like and am just fine with that. (And there is nothing wrong with carrying in a purse if you have the right purse - a carry purse. I know, I own one).

But as for those worried about an apparent decline in civility I say look a bit wider around you. Open your eyes more.

I say this because if there is one thing I have noticed about my second son is his ability to make the most sourpuss person smile. He lights up a room with just his smile. We go out daily to run errands for my business. As he toddles next to me in the post office men open the door for him, he looks up and smiles then runs inside. We stand in line and his giggling has people smiling. I believe in the power of smiling. Negativity breeds just that - it brings one down. I believe that our world will survive and that is why I have had kids - that is why I hike, why I get up every morning - that each day has the potential to be the best you have had. And when life sucks look around - maybe you will find a reason to smile.

In the summer of 2006 I lost my Mom 3 summers after losing my Dad. I went on trip on the PCT a couple days after she passed away. I had the worst trip of my life, I spent 50 miles crying miserably and hating life. I mean, how much worse could life get? I sat down on my last day to eat a snack on a rock. When suddenly a group of mt. goats came out of the tiny trees. They went about doing goat stuff. It washed over me that life goes on and life can get better. I didn't cry the rest of the trip, I felt healed watching the goats. And I felt that I had made peace with myself.

Sometimes you have to not watch the news, not read about gloom. Just walk outside and watch the squirrels if you will - and watch how most of the world keeps humming no matter what the "experts" have to say.

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: PNW
Re: Re: bang goes the machete. on 09/21/2011 17:00:43 MDT Print View

"How many "oh boy, here we go again" posts end up near the beginning of those types of threads?"

And yet, most often, the thread goes on......

Stephen B Elder Jr
(selder) - M

Locale: Front range CO
Re: Re: Re: bang goes the machete. on 09/21/2011 19:29:24 MDT Print View

A well fed TROLL gets larger, ignored they die... it does get tedious when every third post is about something I'm not interested in when really they should all be about things I AM interested in...there should be censors, by golly...or at least folks should take their machete threads and gun threads to some forum I don't follow...

noneur business
(that_one_dude) - F
Re on 09/21/2011 19:39:15 MDT Print View

I don't know. Its pretty easy to not click on a thread knowing you aren't interested. Save yourself the frustration and BPL the bandwidth and just don't read the thread. Its not hard.

I'm sure there are countless other threads you don't bother with.

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
Re: Re on 09/21/2011 19:43:08 MDT Print View

@Jennifer Ross....I agree with you 100% on your post. I get the same questions and yes, when hiking in the backcountry most backpackers are pretty darn cool. Though some seem to be a tad evasive in where they are going...(I have never been mistaken as a serial killer BTW...) :)