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Gary Pikovsky
(gosha007) - F - M

Locale: New Hampshire White Mountains
hiking w/ comfort in ULTRALIGHT? on 04/30/2005 14:32:46 MDT Print View

Hello All,
I'd love to get everyone's opinion on this early spring/summer?/ early winter kit for NE White Mountains and NE Mt. Washington (7000feet) list. The list is a bit unusual in that it's requirements are a freestanding 2-person 4-season tent, xenon headlamp for night photography, SLR camera and favorite Polish Kielbasa for food, and a plush sleeping pad. I'm a diehard ultralighter and based my gear on Ryan Jordan's recommendations to be the lightest stuff possible with above requirements. If anyone sees an opportunity to cut even a half ounce (hopefully pounds) please let me know ANY suggestions you may have. Thanks a bunch. Anxious to see what everyone thinks.

W O R N
7.8 - Base layer top (Smartwool lightweight zip-t)
2.9 - Windshirt (Montane Aero Smock (alt. featherlite smock forwider use range 3.0oz))
2.0 - Underwear (Patagonia Capilene)
7.0 - Midweight long johns (Patagonia Capilene midweight)
12.1 - Rain pants) (EMS GTX Paclite (full zips open) (alt. Montane Air Event 7.0oz - side zips / Wild Things Epic 6oz / GoLite Reed 4 oz - no sidezip / Montbell Versalite 7oz))
0.9 - Glove liners (Normal liners)
1.0 - Sock liners (FoxRiver)
1.9 - Socks (Smartwool Adrenaline 3/4 crew socks)
32.0 - Boots (North Face Fury XCR for summer / for other seasons - Millet GTX Trek 53.25oz))
1.6 - Bandana (Bandana with printed map)
10.6 - Trekking poles (REI Peak UL Compact Trekking Poles (includes custom bolt for camera tripod)
-------------------------
WEIGHT WORN - 5 LBS



C L O T H I N G
5.5 - Vest (PossumDown Vest (alt Patagonia R2 8.0oz))
10.0 - Insulation Pullover (Patagonia Micro Puff Pullover (alt. Possudown sweater for summer 8.875oz / In winter - Millet Rescue Down parka 15.75oz))
9.5 - Rain Jacket (Montane Event Air Jacket)
7.5- Insualtion pants (Patagonia R1 bottoms (alt. In winter - Patagonia Micro Puff Pants 13.50oz))
2.9 - Shorts (Patagonia Long Haul Runners (alt. Sahara conv pants 12.5oz))
2.8 - Hat (Favorite oldschool ski hat)
1.5 - Balaclava, light (REI Balaclava liner)
1.4 - Mittens (Possumdown Mitts (alt. For winter - REI switchback primaloft mitt liners 4.125oz))
4.8 - Shell Mitts (REI Switchback mitt Large (thinking about OR Talus Mitts Large 2.9oz))
1.0 - Sock liners (FoxRiver)
2.9 - Socks (Smartwool hiking socks (used as extra in cold weather and for sleeping))
0.6 - Stuff sack for clothing (Bozeman Mountain stuff sack)

S L E E P + S H E L T E R
26.5 - Sleeping bag (WM Ultralite 6.0ft 20F)
1.6 - Stuff sack, sleeping bag (WM stuff sack)
21.6 - Pad (Insul Max Thermo Polarguard-lined 20 x 72 x 2.5"" high pad (the only pad I could sleep on for some reason))
1.9 - Foam pad, light (Gossamer Gear Thinlight 19.5 x 57 x 1/8"" (add when cold))
38.6 - Tent + stuff sack (Black Diamond Firstlight with custom Fibraplex poles)
1.0 - Stakes + guyline (Bozeman Mountain Lazr Hi-Vis Titanium Stakes / Guyline - Spectra 200, 4 strips pre-tied to tent stakes)
2.9 - Ground cloth (Gossamer Gear SpinnSheet cut to tent size)

M I S C
2.0 - Pack Rain cover (Adventurelite Pack Cover)
34.9 - Backpack (Internal Frame Osprey Aether 45 2800cu (with custom-made bungee cord attachments) prefer internal frame
36.5 - Camera (Canon Digital Rebel XT (28mm-300mm Sigma lens))
0.8 - Water bottle (Platypus 1L flexible bottle (rounded corners)
5.5 - Headlamp (Petzl Myolite 3 xenon/led headlamp with 3 Lithium batteries (warm xenon light used for night photography)
1.6 - Essentials (First Aid, duct tape, UPF lotion + Dr. Bronner's + Aqua Mira in mini dropper bottle, mini toothbrush, TP, vitamins, mini pot cleaner)

K I T C H E N
0.3 - Spoon (Lexan spoon)
3.0 - Stove, windscreen (Snow Peak Giga Power titanium w/ piezo canister stove (for windy conditions, like canister stoves)
3.9 - Pot with foil lid/pan (Open Country Aluminium Pot 3.785 32oz (alt. Snow Peak Trek 700 Titanium)
0.9 - Stuff sack, kitchen (Snow Peak sack)

F O O D + F U E L
0.8 - Electrolytes (Emer'gen-C Lite, 2 packets)
5.4 - Energy Bars, 3 (500-690calories)
15.0 - Food (Backpackers Pantry Pad Thai + greens + Polish Kielbasa 1500calories)
16.0 - Water (Fill-in halfway usually - lots of sources on trail)
7.0 - Fuel (MSR IsoPro Butane/Propane mix)
-------------------------
-------------------------
PACK WEIGHT (w/o perishables) - 14.5 LBS
FULL PACK WEIGHT - 17.5 LBS



OPTIONAL
19.0 - Crampons (Grivel Air Tech Classic Lite w/ antibott)
6.5 - Crampon bag (Petzl Fakir / Ragged Mountain Deluxe Crampon bag 4oz)
8.9 - Ice axe (CAMP USA XLA 210 Ice Axe 60cm)
4.0 - Ski Mask (Scott Split Six in pouch)
1.8 - Face mask (Seirus Combo Scarf Large)
1.5 - Glasses + Case (Glasses in a hard case)
0.5 - Towel (Lightload Towels)
2.3 - Gaiters (Integral Designs Event Shortie Gaiters)
4.4 - Water bottle insualtion (OR Water bottle parka)

kevin davidson
(kdesign) - F

Locale: Mythical State of Jefferson
some areas of (en)lightenment for Gary Pikovsky on 04/30/2005 18:15:15 MDT Print View

That's a nice gear list, but there are a couple of areas you could lighten up.
You could save upwards of 10 oz.of weight in the pack dept. with packs like the ULA P-1 (24 oz.),Six Moons Designs Starlite (23 oz) or packs by Gossomer Gear( even lighter). All of which would carry as well if not better than your Aether
( as much as I respect Osprey Packs).
There must be a way for you to sleep comfortably
with a lighter pad--and with less than a full-length pad. I use a Thermarest UL 3/4 pad (16 oz.) but soon to be replaced by BMW's 10 oz. inflateable pad and use clothes to form pillow and and my pack to insulate/cushion my legs and feet. Or I use a cut down Z-rest pad ( 8 oz.) and a supplemental 1/4"
evasote pad (1.5 oz.) when using frameless packs
(works better for creating "virtual frame") and really
fast and light trips. I don't exactly sleep spartan either,I like my nightime comfort.
So, that's a potential saving in those 2 areas of upwards of 21 oz.
I won't begin to try to pry you away from your photo equipment.
If you feel you need to use a 4 season tent,year round as opposed to having a tarp system or one of Shire's Tarptents for at least summer use-- there is not much of a way to save weight there.
But if you lose the kielbasa... heh, i gave up lox and bagels-- then we're talking serious UL.

Edited by kdesign on 04/30/2005 19:25:20 MDT.

Gary Pikovsky
(gosha007) - F - M

Locale: New Hampshire White Mountains
Some thoughts on the tips on 04/30/2005 23:50:20 MDT Print View

Kevin thanks for the enlightenment tips. I actually bought Gossamer Gear Mariposa as recommended by BPL. Its a combo internal frame (pad as frame w/ carbon stays)and frameless pack when you are carrying very little. Psyched when it finally arrived, I put it on with all the gear and was happy to lose almost a POUND. But... Gossamer folks are great and so is the service, but the pack was quite uncomfortable. I fitted it precisely and got the right size but I found my shoulders to be slowly losing blood flow and getting numb. Maybe its just me. Wandering if anyone else had anything like that happen. Also, the pack seems to hang far from your back since it has a very basic compression system. Others seemed to have that issue as well (backpackgeartest.org) And finally, it seemed almost that my back gave back that that pound in sweat that the padded Mariposa generated. The foam sleeping pad did its job and made the pack stiffer, but it also did a fine job of insulating my back, which caused a lot of sweat. Thus, after researching more, I just bought Osprey Atmos 25 (1500ci) and was able to pack all my winter gear for overnight trips (w/ tent) into the pack! It has a superb floating mesh backing like older Deuter bags and does a fine job of carrying weight. Even though Osprey underweighs their packs (it weighs not 31oz, but 36), it rides and feels lighter on my back than the 16oz pack. Which brings me to an interesting point I would like to throw out there to anyone: If after a long day of hiking you continuously hike farther and feel better with an airier, closer fitting backpack then is the weight difference worth it. Right now it seems like it is.

If anyone has any thoughts on this or any suggestions to the above gear list, please share your thoughts.
I wish the heavy camera equipment unfortunately cannot be swapped. Rebel XT is already the lightest hi-quality DSLR out there and from what I have used it is superb at capturing real-life color, white balance and correct lighting. It makes the aftertrip conversations worth the weight. (an Ultralight happy soul is the result.) I wish there was a better option for the sleep pad though. As far as Polish Kielbasa, it cannot be beaten for the taste and smell during a sunset ridgetop dinner. :-) Love it!

David Lisak
(davelisak)

Locale: Grand Canyon hiker
On pack wt. vs. comfort on 05/01/2005 05:07:39 MDT Print View

Gary,

I too have been exploring pack alternatives down the same pathways. I currently use an Osprey Aether 60, which I have trimmed about 6 oz. off by snipping off unused straps and buckles. Still, it's a 3 lb. plus pack. Trouble is, it's extremely comfortable. I too ordered and tried out (on my treadmill) the Mariposa. I love the pack -- its design, simplicity, etc. Unfortunately, the fit just wasn't quite right. I'm 6'2" and it didn't sit right on my hips. As the excellent folks at Gossamer explained to me, part of the lightweight tradeoff is a limited capacity to adjust to torso length. If I could take out one of my vertabrae I think it would fit very nicely, but alas there would be other adverse consequences.

Like you, I was also a little concerned about the heat-sweat issue as a result of the pad in the back. I hike almost exclusively in the Grand Canyon, where sweating is a way of life.

So, for now, I am content with the Osprey, and still searching.

David

David Lisak
(davelisak)

Locale: Grand Canyon hiker
On pack wt. vs. comfort on 05/01/2005 07:35:41 MDT Print View

Gary,

I too have been exploring pack alternatives down the same pathways. I currently use an Osprey Aether 60, which I have trimmed about 6 oz. off by snipping off unused straps and buckles. Still, it's a 3 lb. plus pack. Trouble is, it's extremely comfortable. I too ordered and tried out (on my treadmill) the Mariposa. I love the pack -- its design, simplicity, etc. Unfortunately, the fit just wasn't quite right. I'm 6'2" and it didn't sit right on my hips. As the excellent folks at Gossamer explained to me, part of the lightweight tradeoff is a limited capacity to adjust to torso length. If I could take out one of my vertabrae I think it would fit very nicely, but alas there would be other adverse consequences.

Like you, I was also a little concerned about the heat-sweat issue as a result of the pad in the back. I hike almost exclusively in the Grand Canyon, where sweating is a way of life.

So, for now, I am content with the Osprey, and still searching.

David

Gary Pikovsky
(gosha007) - F - M

Locale: New Hampshire White Mountains
Osprey on 05/01/2005 10:09:29 MDT Print View

David, definitely check the Atmos series. The most comfortable, ventilated, durable and useful pack I've ever seen in this class range. And it has a great frame. You'll sweat 75% less

Eduardo Lartigau
(Eduardo)
One question for Gary? on 05/03/2005 08:10:35 MDT Print View

Gary:I live in Brazil, sory my poor english. I need your advice, I would like to by a BD Firsthlight, but I'm 5.11 tall and I afraid abouth the lenght of this tent to me. Please if possible tell me if this tent have suficiently space for my WM Ultralite dont brush the tent panels in the head and foot areas.And if possible tell me abouth the condensation factor, inside this tent. Tanks your atention.

paul johnson
(pj) - F

Locale: LazyBoy in my Den - miss the forest
BD Firstlight on 05/03/2005 09:16:22 MDT Print View

Until Gary replies to you, perhaps the following info will be useful to you if you haven't already read these reviews.

Review of Single-Wall Tents

Review of BD Firstlight

Edited by pj on 05/03/2005 09:16:56 MDT.