For Alpine use in rocky uneven terrain with possible high winds what would be the pros and cons of the Zpacks Hexamid vs the Gossamer Gear One. Is this realistic? Im currently using a Black Diamond Highlite and would like to reduce my tent weight and volume.

Roman

I'd go with the Hex. If you stake it down with the back into the wind, it has a better, more aerodynamic shape. Also, the back has many stake-down points. The One is a fine tent, but its less wind-worthy, IMO, and mine tends to be a bit noisier in the wind, as well.

I might add, if the ground is too rocky, both tents will need to be anchored using classic non-stake methods like the stick and rock technique. Under some circumstances, there are some real advantages to self-supporing tents that don't require tiedowns.

Stargazer

Edited by nerdboy52 on 09/12/2011 09:39:15 MDT.

FWIW I had a new GG TheOne on my Colorado Trail thru-hike this summer and mostly it was an unreliable PITA! It was prone to failure in high wind, rain or hail storms - of which there were many - during July & Aug this year. Worst of all was the many times the tent totally collapsed, which resulted in two holes created when my trekking poles pierced the vestibule fabric and mesh at the front apex.

And oh yeah, the fabric seeps through in heavy rain and the mesh at the bottom leaks so that the bathtub floor floods. I had a great time bailing it out in heavy rain!

Since I returned, I've e-mailed GG a few times to address the problems I had with the design. They have yet to reply. The only thing worse than expensive gear is expensive gear that doesn't work and manufacturers that don't respond to their customers.

Lessoned Learned.. I'm now considering the Z-Packs hex amid.

Between the two I would go with the Hexamid. It's much easier to get a taut pitch. Mine has weathered winds I measured at 35-40 mph on several nights. I have an early (taped) Hexamid. My one concern with the new ones is how stitching effects things. I have no experience with sewn cuben.

Using the hexamid for rain/sleet protection is more like using a small tarp than a tent. Very doable, but you need to be careful about placement your movement inside. It's not going to block the wind, so if you are using a quilt, you might want to use a ultralight bivy.

I wrote up a brief hexamid review though I should update it with additional experience.

If I was really expecting nasty weather, I would want shelter that gave me better protection and room to cook such as the MLD DuoMid.

--Mark

How did the Gossamer tent "fail"? Was it a stake pulling out or did it just fall apart? I have one and other than the noisy fabric, I love it. I think it was one of the last ones sold. As far as there website shows, they won't be making them any time soon. You have to seam seal it wich is true with almost any tent. The stitching around the netting looks very well done so if your tent leaked that bad, something was wrong. I have never used a zpacks tent, but I'm thinking the One would have a little more sit up room since it uses two poles.

I have had very good results with my GG The One. Used in storm conditions in the Oregon Wallowas at 8500 foot durring a storm with high wind gusts, hail and severe rain.

I definitely sat up wondering/hoping it would survive the wind storm. The tent performed exceptionaly well. I do have large Easton stakes for the two main guy lines.

I do ensure the tent is set up properly and adequately staked out every time though, even on those calm evenings.

Sorry so late in replying I've been traveling.

Anyway, by "failing," I mean completely collapsing with stakes pulling out and the poles coming down and the spinnaker fabric seeping through, not at the seams, but right through the fabric. plus the bathtub floor filling up with water during prolonged storms.

maybe as you say the shoddiness factor of the tent is because I have one of the last ones they made this year, but as the consumer, it still sucks that such a pricey piece of gear is sooooo bad!

Yes, I started with a pretty tight pitch in sheltered locations, but suffice to say this tent is just very fragile and finicky such that it is unreliable in inclement weather. When the weather comes in in a hurry, you need to pitch up fast and not spend an extended period of time looking for a perfect location or getting a good tight pitch, much less sitting up and babying the tent through a stormy night.

BTW - GG still has not returned any of my e-mails or phone calls over the past month. IMHO even the cottage guys should be more responsive to their customers.

For high winds? Absolutely neither. Honestly, you are asking for far too much of these 2 season shelters.

"Anyway, by "failing," I mean completely collapsing with stakes pulling out and the poles coming down and the spinnaker fabric seeping through, not at the seams, but right through the fabric. plus the bathtub floor filling up with water during prolonged storms."

Hmmm. The part about the fabric seeping through... that is strange.

The part about the bathtub floor filling up... that is a sign of good waterproof fabric in the floor, so it is doing correctly.

The part about the stakes pulling out... that is pure user error, not a fault of the tent.

It sounds like you were pitching the tent rapidly and therefore you didn't get it tight in the first place.

--B.G.--

I was under the belief that spinnaker fabric has a hydrostatic head that is under 1000mm. Is this the case? It would explain leaking in high rain pressure situations.

To the OP - look at a mid design, perhaps a cuben Duomid.

Spinnaker usually is about 1 PSI, but GG's spinnaker is about 2 PSI, higher than silnylon. I've never had any leakage problems in the torrential rains here in Japan in either my SpinnShelter or my The One. I have had problems with stake pull out with The One, though. The stress of the tension in the two apex guylines pulling the shelter apart to stand up is very high. You need long, grippy stakes. The regular 6-inch ones won't do.

Edited by butuki on 10/09/2011 06:24:28 MDT.

You may also want to consider the GG Spinnshelter if you want a more 4 season shelter.

I combine mine with an SMD Meteor bivy. The combination can withstand all kinds of adverse conditions and is roomy and comfortable.

If all tie-outs are used the Spinnslelter really handles the wind, rain and snow, but it can also be pitched lean-to or a-frame style for hot summer conditions.

The UL Bivy acts as a ground cloth and bug protection. It also adds warmth and protection from drips and sprays if they should occur.

I often just use the bivy alone on hot buggy nights, but have the Spinnshelter handy in case I get a downpour in the middle of the night.

To me, this system always seemed more bombproof and flexible than The One and even the Hexamid.

Edited by brooklynkayak on 10/09/2011 11:10:04 MDT.

Interesting Miguel - can you provide the testing results of this? Since spinnaker is being phased out of the market, I would be interested in finding out why. I know the tear strength is poor and that may be one of the reasons (I have ripped through spinn stuff sacks several time without much trouble) but I am curious to know if some batches did not live up to the waterproof claim. This would be consistent with what Ron @ MLD had mentioned in previous threads, although ominiously so - he was having trouble finding suitable spinn fabric. As was GG, come to think of it.

In a heavy, hard rainstorm, 1 psi will permit wetting through (and misting if the pressure is high enough). 2psi should be sufficient, however.

Brian at Outdoor Equipment Supplier told me the same thing in an e-mail exchange not too long ago; he said he'd been through several batches of SpinnUL, but even with all the effort of trying to get the coating right, they weren't waterproof enough for his standards.

Just get a TT Sublite Sil or a TT Moment and be done with it.

I painted a thin (5:1 mineral spirits to silicone caulk) coat of sealer on the top 1/2 of my Moment so I wouldn't have to be concerned with "misting" in a downpour. Hasn't failed yet in the worst of storms.

Edited by Danepacker on 10/09/2011 18:05:58 MDT.

Dave,

I agree, the GG is really only a 2-season tent. The problem is that GG advertises it as a 3-season tent and even touts it's capabilities in snow and storms, which is definitely misleading at best. Mind you I was very excited when I received this tent in the mail and I really wanted to love it, but alas, if just doesn't live up to it's hype. I'm sure others may have one and love it, but my experience with it in inclement weather has proven that it is an inferior piece of gear that is also dangerous if you rely on it to hold up in a prolonged storm, you could end up with hypothermia. I wouldn't want someone else to go through what I went through with TheOne.

Similarly, I know there are a lot of GG fans on this site that rave about theri gear, which is why I felt confident ordering from them in the first place, but I can't believe how they've ducked my e-mails and phone calls.

Shame, shame GG!

Miguel,

I think you're correct about the apex tension. I use two Easton 8" stakes for these guys and 6" stakes for the corners. I used the GG LT4 trekking poles and one problem of note was the fact that the inside diameter of the apex grommets is too small to insert the tips of the trekking poles far enough in to get a good bite, rather as a result the tips end up just balancing inside the grommets and rely on the heavy tension to keep them in place.

In 20+ years of backpacking, I've never had stakes pull out so often in any type of weather or terrain as with this tent.

Also, I really don't think a bathtub floor is actually supposed to be a bathtub. IMHO the purpose of WPB is to keep water out, not in.

But, on the bright side, when you and your gear are adrift in 3+" of water you could just surrender to it, strip down, grab your soap and bathe!
Woohoooo!

All that aside, CS, I highly recommend the Colorado Trail!!!

"Also, I really don't think a bathtub floor is actually supposed to be a bathtub. IMHO the purpose of WPB is to keep water out, not in."

None of the fabrics discussed in this thread are WPB. Bathtub floors are designed to keep water out, but once it's in it won't go anywhere. They're supposed to be waterproof and nothing more.