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Tough but light backpack?
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Kevin Sawchuk
(ksawchuk) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Northern California
New Pack on 05/04/2005 13:11:06 MDT Print View

PLEASE add double hip belt pockets--it makes such a difference. I'm definately in the market for a light, DURABLE pack in the 3000-4000 cu in range. Hip belt pockets are great for snacks/maps/compass/drink mix--all those things you use on the go and don't want to stop to get.

Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
packs with hip pockets on 05/04/2005 14:28:02 MDT Print View

ULA P1 and P2 have them and they sure are a nice addition to a pack.

Jim Colten
(jcolten) - M

Locale: MN
pack add-ons on 05/04/2005 14:41:55 MDT Print View

Two comments about this thread:

1) if all the improvements suggested here were made I think we'd have a pack weighing 3-4 lbs

2) but having said that, for my tastes, SMALL belt pockets add value that is worth their weight


Locale: Pacific Northwet
Belt pockets on 05/04/2005 15:49:39 MDT Print View

How about belt pockets that are attached with velcro?

You could then have various sized pockets, or you could leave them off if desired.

Daniel Chambo
(skyeward) - F
mesh hip pockets on 05/04/2005 17:46:57 MDT Print View

yeah I don't know why Osprey is using mesh for the hipbelt pockets. I've have a pack with hipblet pockets for about a year, and this is a part of the pack that gets a lot of impact: ground in the dirt, scrapped on rock, bush and limb. if my hip pockets were mesh they'd be shredded by now.

Jay Ham
(jham) - F - M

Locale: Southwest
Osprey's mesh hip pockets on 05/05/2005 07:43:38 MDT Print View

In case you haven't seen the pack up close and personal; Osprey uses an unusually heavy mesh for their hip pockets, much more than any side-panel water bottle pockets. I do agree with you though, but not on the basis of durability. I don't like all the dust (I live in the SW), and potentially water, that can freely pass through the mesh to threaten your camera and contaminate your half eaten snickers bar.


Stuart Bilby
(StuBilby) - MLife

Locale: New Zealand
Mesh pockets on 05/05/2005 22:03:52 MDT Print View

Macpac 35 Amp has tough mesh pockets. I Love them. Mounted on bungees on your belly they don't interfere with my thighs when stepping up like most hipbelt mounted pockets. Review to be published soon.

kevin davidson
(kdesign) - F

Locale: Mythical State of Jefferson
BMW Pack Update ? on 08/31/2005 14:19:54 MDT Print View

Ryan--do you have any new news on the Rapture
Pack and it's larger sibling ? Shipping dates ? Anxious minds need to know !

Douglas Meredith
(dougmeredith) - F
Bushwacking on 09/02/2005 05:17:18 MDT Print View

This pack looks really interesting. I was considering the Mariposa (really liked the design) but was worried about durrability when going off-trail.


Ken Helwig
(kennyhel77) - MLife

Locale: Scotts Valley CA via San Jose, CA
mariposa on 09/02/2005 06:54:02 MDT Print View

as long as you're above treeline, off trail is not a problme. You just need to be a little more careful with this pack. I love mine and the workmanship is superb.

Douglas Meredith
(dougmeredith) - F
Above tree line on 09/05/2005 18:31:18 MDT Print View

We don't have any above-tree line here.


Craig Shelley
(craig_shelley) - F

Locale: Rocky Mountains
Granite Gear Nimbus Ozone on 09/06/2005 22:46:31 MDT Print View

Hello Paul,

I use the Granite Gear Nimbus Ozone. I do a lot of scrambling with sandstone slickrock and off trail terrain (under juniper, between them, through thick brush, etc.). I hike and backpacking extensively in the Black Ridge Wilderness near the Utah Colorado border. The pack weighs about three pounds and takes a lot of abuse. I do have a Gossamer Gear Mariposa and GoLite Speed but I avoid taking them on these rough terrain trips. Sandstone really grinds materials fast! The Granite Gear pack can be used to carry 30lb loads with total comfort.

Edited by craig_shelley on 09/06/2005 22:48:56 MDT.

Ryan Faulkner
(ryanf) - F

Locale: Mid atlantic, No. Cal
Rapture update ? on 01/11/2006 12:31:43 MST Print View

what is the latest on the Rapture?

when Can I buy it and for how much?

also I am curious of the rapture weight with out the stays, the larger pack was pictured with a pad pocket, is it the same on the rapture?


Edited by ryanf on 01/11/2006 12:32:53 MST.

dan mchale
(wildlife) - MLife

Locale: Cascadia
Re: fabric on 01/12/2006 19:02:44 MST Print View

Hey Jon! Ryan may be the first company to actually fully copy my 13 year lead of using double buckles on a hip belt. Many companies have been beating around the bush on that and doing half A versions. As you know, I'm supposed to be flattered

It may help to add that we replaced that problematic spectra pack immediately.

Robert Ebel
(poop) - F

Locale: Earth Orbit
Re: Re: fabric on 01/14/2006 15:34:00 MST Print View

The seriously ultralight folks, the real freaks, might just think that 2 buckles on a hip-belt are over the top. One would work just fine. An extra buckle is a buckle that needs to be cut off.

paul johnson
(pj) - F

Locale: LazyBoy in my Den - miss the forest
Re: Re: fabric on 01/14/2006 17:41:48 MST Print View

Mr. McHale,

can you please elaborate on precisely how the two-buckle arrangement functions as a component of the suspension? it seems that it provides some versatility related to how the hip-belt rides on the pelvis? i think i'm missing most of the "genius" of the idea however. or, is it like the old scotsman says, "it's better felt than telt"? can you describe the advantages of it over the traditional one-buckle system? if you decided to patent the idea, a patent number would suffice as the patent description and its claims would answer my questions also. thirteen yrs: if you did patent it, congrats and it still has another four yrs.

paul johnson
(pj) - F

Locale: LazyBoy in my Den - miss the forest
Re: Re: Re: fabric on 01/15/2006 02:08:22 MST Print View


i understand the point that you are making. remove whatever is unecessary or appears to be redundant as a weight savings measure.

from your post, i gather that you don't feel this way. it seems that you're just saying someone else might glance quickly at a two-buckle design and dismiss it as nothing but redundancy.

in this case, i believe that it is only an appearance of redundancy. a purpose is actually served by the twin buckles...

if anyone hasn't seen Dan McHale's fine packs (arguably the best made packs in the world from what i gather from reading the comments of true experts who own his packs), check them out at McHale Packs

i'm guessing here and am probably missing the most important aspects of the two-buckle design, they seem to provide a means of differentially tightening the belt's top vs. the belt's bottom. this would seem to provide, at the very least, a more secure "connection" of the belt with the wearer's pelvis, and more comfort. for the somewhat heavier (sometimes non-L/UL) loads that these packs are designed to carry. this would seem to be a very good idea.

i believe, i could be mistaken, i'm guessing here, that some mainstream non-L/UL pack Mfr's/designers, whose packs i've seen, have tried to copy Mr. McHale's idea by using two "runners" of lesser width grosgrain sewn on top of the main belt. these runners run back along the top of the main webbing from an area near the hip-belt's main large single buckle to their own additonal adjusting buckles located on the padded portion of the hip-belt. these tension adjustment buckles (they do NOT hold the hip-belt on the wearer) provide only a "poorer" means (as cp. to Dan's idea) of differentially adjusting the belt's tension. some other pack's i've seen sew at angles, starting much further away from the main buckle than the first method, shorter grosgrain to the main hip-belt webbing. these too return to tension adjusting buckles on the padded portion of the hip-belt. don't misunderstand my poor description, what i'm speaking of here are NOT the common forward pulling adjustments, generally found further towards the rear of the hip-belt, that pull the pack bag bottom towards the wearer's back - these "adjusters" are found on many mainstream non-L/UL packs. nor, am i speaking of the "Scherer" cinch design used by some Kelty packs.

to my largely uninformed mind, both of these arrangements seem, for a number of reasons that immediately come to mind, to be inferior to Dan's design.

i could also imagine that a hip-belt could be designed such that with proper (even equal) tensioning of the twin-buckles afixed to top and bottom of the hip-belt, would cause the center of the hip-belt to flex/bulge inward causing it to ride more securely on the iliac crest. not sure that this is how it's intended to function - just making wild guesses here. there has to be (a) good reason(s) for the design, or Mr. McHale would not have used it.

Mr. McHale, if i've misunderstood the intent of your two-buckle design or left out other advantages to it (undoubtedly), feel free to post and set me straight, and educate us about the nuances of your fine design - you'll get no argument from me.

also, one might argue that two smaller buckles and their associated webbing, actually weighs less than one larger buckle with wider webbing. while this, to my mind, is insignificant for the McHale packs, given their non-UL design parameters/goals and greater empty pack weight, it might be used together with a a number of other weight savings measures for a L/UL 15oz pack like BMW is bringing out. i've read that, in the L/UL world, webbing is one of the heavier materials used.

Edited by pj on 01/15/2006 03:54:32 MST.

Robert Ebel
(poop) - F

Locale: Earth Orbit
Re: Re: Re: Re: fabric on 01/16/2006 17:38:22 MST Print View

Paul - I was serious - not being sarcastic. 'freak' is a positive term these days - and, I guess I'm one. I think that for ultralight loads say 19 lbs or so, I wouldn't want the 2 straps because packs I have with single buckles work fine with light loads. Sometimes I like to get the pack off quick too.

paul johnson
(pj) - F

Locale: LazyBoy in my Den - miss the forest
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: fabric on 01/16/2006 17:57:21 MST Print View



dan mchale
(wildlife) - MLife

Locale: Cascadia
Re: Re: Re: fabric on 01/16/2006 18:50:49 MST Print View

If by what you mean by genius is the core premise, you got it pretty much in your long post here. It's pretty basic stuff. I pretty much forgot, but didn't Ryan drop the pack project?