Having a short term memory and being the middle of the summer, I'm having trouble gauging how low my JRB Sierra Stealth 40F quilt (http://www.jacksrbetter.com/Wearable%20Quilts.htm#SierraStealth) will go with the addition of certain insulation layer in the Spring/Fall.

Here are the extra items I have at my disposal, or have considered purchasing:

- JRB down sleeves (5oz): http://www.jacksrbetter.com/Sleeves.htm
(can be worn as sleeves or worn as downbooties/leg warmers)

- JRB down hood (2oz): http://www.jacksrbetter.com/Hood.htm
(worn as a hood duh)

- WM Flash Vest (3.5oz): http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Down-Garments&cat=Jackets-and-Vests
(worn under to quilt to supplement core warmth)

- WM Flash Pants (6.5oz): http://www.westernmountaineering.com/index.cfm?section=products&page=Down-Garments&cat=Pants
(worn under quilt to supplement leg warmth)

- NeoAir Short (9oz, 2.5 R value): http://cascadedesigns.com/therm-a-rest/mattresses/fast-and-light/neoair/product
(I sleep on it)

For those of you who have pushed summer bags before, if I wore this stuff (any combo welcome, leave out stuff if ya like), how low could you COMFORTABLY push this quilt if it were true to it's rating?

(I don't carry a bivy, but I can pitch three sides of my Bear Paw Cub Den 1.5 straight to the ground to block most wind)

Thanks!

Its all a personal. I can push my ultra 20 (some say its a 30 degree) easily down to 0-5 degrees with a full suit of cocoon clothing, integral hot socks in a vapr bivy. on a torsolite pad, and a foam pad in my pack.

But i sleep hot and just am always hot in general.

Edited by rcowman on 07/08/2011 18:17:55 MDT.

I think it might be worth looking into what you already have rather than intend to buy. For example, the Flash vest doesn't have much down for your core versus the sleeves, pants, and probably even the hood. Looking at your setup, your core is very much underdressed compared to the rest of your gear.

Easiest way to ballpark this is to get a loft (or better, clo) measurement and use that.

The major issues you're going to have with that setup are three fold:


1) The width of the quilt, doesn't lend itself to really blocking drafts, it'll be difficult to get really effective and consistent tuck, especially with all the down gear adding bulk to your profile. (don't get me wrong, a 52" wide quilt with a half-taper should be sufficient for most people without the down gear making you a marshmallow)

2) The quilt is unbaffled, and as such, is highly susceptible to another form of drafting, even if tucking isn't an issue; seam-draft. It's not really drafting per say, it's a thinned cross-section of marginal or no-insulation where the thru-stitching separates the down chambers. Not really an issue with down gear, but when stationary at resting rates, it's a big issue.

3) The lack of using a bivy; if you did use a bivy, you'd go a long way to eliminate those drafting concerns, but since you're not, you've no protection from this issue. It may seem like I'm overstating the drafting concern, but once you spend some time in bonechilling temps with high winds, you'll know what I'm talking about.





Personally, I'd say your summer quilt would be a great addition to any other bag or quilt (on top of it) to augment temperature, but with no baffled gear in the mix, you're going to have a very hard time pushing the numbers. That's why I prefer to make even summer quilts (40+ deg) baffled, the weight difference is marginal (0.5oz or less when linear shrinkage is factored), and even though the manufacturing difficulty is increased, the versatility is infinitely higher.


Pushing an unbaffled summer quilt just isn't ideal IMHO, better to push a 3-season quilt or bag.

imo, at some point the weight you are adding on to keep warm will well outweigh a lower temperature sleeping bag or quilt. If you are anything like me (while not being a cheap person), you don't want to purchase MORE superfluous amounts of gear for only a few weeks a year.

I use the hammockgear burrow (20 degree). I try to get nearly a full 3-seasons out of this quilt and have to supplement it with a silk mummy liner to compensate for drafts. The liner really really seems to help on those chilly windy nights.

Like Robert said, it's all personal. Many people said I'd need a balaclava to push my old style Ultra 20 (the one that's closer to a 30 degree bag) into the high teens. Then one night we were higher than planned in Arizona and made camp unprepared for anything below about 25F and I was slightly cool at 17 degrees with just a bandanna and the hood on my windshirt. My legs did get a bit cool but my head was fine.

For me that setup consisted of:
Golite Ultra 20
Ridgerest Regular (torso length)
Neoair Short
Pack under legs
Tigoat Bivy
T-shirt
Pants
Possum Down Socks
Milsurp wool glove liners
Polartech Buff

I contribute my ability to do this to sleeping warm and the huge R value that was underneath me on top of being a side sleeper.

Edited by veriest1 on 07/08/2011 22:42:14 MDT.

I guess giving my height n weight would help. 5-9 n 190 athletic build. It's funny, on my last trip I was in my bag thinking "hey this is pretty roomy!" N perhaps I could add some layers underneath. The shockcord was awesome in keeping things cinched.

If adding a bivy was the best warmth/weight option, I'd consider one of the suluk46 3oz jobbers.

I know its lighter / ounce to go for a warmer bag, n that is an option too.

I guess I am worried about my legs staying warm around camp too. The JRB quilt warn around camp comes down to about my knees in serape mode, but prob not good enough coverage.

It's that whole....minimizing weight while being warm while sleeping ~and~ while in camp that I am fighting with.

Is there link to illustrations on baffle designs?

Edited by bster13 on 07/09/2011 05:14:35 MDT.