I've just noted the new range at www.kimmlite.com, and there is some really interesting stuff (Note: I haven't seen any of the new gear and it doesn't seem to be in the shops yet).

For the majority of you who are North American(!), Kimmlite is an established UK brand (with which I have no affiliation, BTW). From a UK perspective, Mike Parsons of Kimmlite is regarded as the father of mountain marathons AKA 'adventure races', and spawned much of the equipment for them - most of it is relevant to lightweight backpackers!

In particular, note the PA1 sleeping bag - a 360g (> 13 oz) bag with NO insulation in the upper body, but a full mummy shell!

The idea is that you wear a duvet jacket (sorry, = 'down parka'!) or a synthetic insulated jacket, such as their own 'Pumasillo P' inside.

This is an interesting take on the old 'pied d'elephant' (='half bag'), in that it helps you keep your arms in to your chest, where they remain warm as well as providing draft-proofing.

Intuitively, this seems 'right' to me. The half bag is one of the oldest weight saving ideas out there (it was mentioned in my climbing reference book when I was a kid in the mid-seventies!) but when I've used one, I've always found it difficult to know what to do with my hands (OK, get the cheap jokes out of the way now!). If you can put them inside your jacket then the jacket is too big to be affective, and I for one can not get comfortable with then tucked inside the top of the bag.

Ive got a design being dewn up now which shares many features of this Kimmlite bag... actually more like the Kimmlite PA2.

Since this Kimmlite bag has no insulation in the top, its upperbody warmth retention would be in the same neighborhood as a very light bivy sack - not much if it gets nippy - and so you still have to worry about what to do with your hands. Personally, I never had a problem with what to do with my hands. I wore gloves and put my hands in my pockets....

But theres just something psychologically soothing about totally zipping up into a full length bag.

Can you somehow deduce what size this bag can accomodate, and how much it costs?

Hi Joe,

You're right about the lack of any upper body warmth retention - this has to be a part of an integrated system that includes an insulated jacket (which offers much more flexibility than the top half of any sleeping bag!).

I don't see this necessarily as a weight saver (at least in three season conditions) as I wouldn't ordinarily carry the weight of a fully insulated jacket - but I might do that rather than have to crawl into my sleeping bag early, rather than watching the sun go down!

I agree about gloves and that there is something "psychologically soothing about totally zipping up into a full length bag". I wish that I could sleep comfortably with my hands in my pockets, but I'm a foetal (that's another one! = fetal) sleeper and my hands naturally fall crossed at the wrists at chest height (and have done for the last AGE + about 8 months, so it's a hard habit to break!).

Hi Kevin

I don't know any more than is available from the website at the moment, but you might get some idea from this link:

http://www.fieldandtrek.com/cat_id/EQUISLEEDWN1/cid/GVU7SPRPUN9XSOG77MV5G2IYPDDSK5K0/product-KIMMLite-Q490-35120.htm
which is for one of last years bags (see also the link for the Q700 in the menu on the left.

I'll be keeping an eye open and can let you know. (Of course the exchange rate is a little in my favour at the moment as the dollar always used to be about 1.5 to the pound but is now 1.9 ... !)