I really enjoyed reading your report. Thanks for taking the time to share your experiences, and write them up so well.

I just downloaded your route. Its looks fine but my program Garmin training centre shows that your pace was 6 minutes per kilometer which would be 3,7 miles per hour. Thats a very impressive speed, running to me and to most people! What does your program say about the pace or are you former elite marathon runners making that pace a "leisurely pace".

I dont mean to sound offencive, if I do I blame it on me being Swedish.

Tord,
We created the track data by combining information from our trip (via SPOT device) with tracks we created using BikeRouteToaster and then filling in more information using google earth and its satellite imagery. The only relevant data in the file is the track location, not the track speed, and you should ignore any time-related data in the file!
We are not elite hikers. Our normal walking pace is 3-3.5 km per hour, 8-9 hours per day, for a total of ~28-30 km per day.
Amy

Thanks again for your prompt answers! If you were to choose one half of the lycian way which one would it be? The first half from Fethiye or the last half? I am asking since we only have time to walk half but it doesnt matter if we flight wise if we start from Fethyie or Antalaya.

I have tried to get the "picture" about the diffrences but Im not sure. The Fethyie half seems more touristic and populated and the last half seems the opposite. Am I right?

Any thoughts on this would be great!

Thanks

Tord,

I don't think I had a preference for one half or the other. Later today I'll ask my husband for his opinion.
See this post for these thoughts:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=51990&skip_to_post=439831#439831

I'll also add that we spent our last day hiking with French woman who was just finishing the entire walk. She said her favorite part was a sunrise hike to the top of Mount Olympus in a couple inches of fresh snow. We didn't take the Olympus alternate, opting to stay on the coast, because we knew we spend time in the interior while on the Saint Paul Trail. The coastal option included some beautiful stretches, but also included the dreadful town of Tekirova.

Amy

It is easy to pick up transport at many points along the Lycian Way. I would suggest considering doing several sections rather than choosing one half or the other.

My wife and I walked the whole Lycian Way over two autumn holidays using pensions to stay in and taxis to skip the boring road bits ( wife's style not mine! ). We preferred the eastern bit, and we started from a track off the main road at Camyuva, north of Phaselis, staying at Tekirova, Cirali, Adrassan and Karaoz. We then did Kapakli to Apollonia staying in Ucagiz. I think that route would give anyone a great week's walking. If you walk a bit faster, then double days and getting to Kas or beyond would be quite feasible.

In October most of the cisterns are dry, so camping and picking up water might be difficult.

Edited by jhansford on 02/02/2012 09:24:03 MST.

1. We were using written directions and Kate's map. It was not unusual to be "temporarily uncertain of position" after directions like " turn right after the second tree after the rock"' when the whole hillside is covered with rocks and trees! Hence I am greatly looking forward to joining the tech age for my next trip out there, probably with my son's cast off iPhone3. I am still a little unclear how to get the waypoints from the book to the phone. I saw your gpx files, but still need more clues. Once there, do they show up on the OpenCycleMaps, and are they named as per the book?

2. I will be UL camping , and am wondering what night temperatures you encountered? And was there much rain?

3. Do you think the SPT preferable to the Kackar as a hiking experience if going maybe a month later?

"1. We were using written directions and Kate's map. It was not unusual to be "temporarily uncertain of position" after directions like " turn right after the second tree after the rock"' when the whole hillside is covered with rocks and trees! Hence I am greatly looking forward to joining the tech age for my next trip out there, probably with my son's cast off iPhone3. I am still a little unclear how to get the waypoints from the book to the phone. I saw your gpx files, but still need more clues. Once there, do they show up on the OpenCycleMaps, and are they named as per the book?"

Follow the directions in our article in order to save battery power: http://adventurealan.com/iphone4gps.htm The iPhone 3 should be the same as the iPhone 4, excepting the duration of the battery life may not be the same, and I've heard that the GPS may not be quite as accurate (but have no real data about that).

Regarding my gpx and kml files of the trails, I have shared our track, but didn't include any waypoint data (except our campsites which undoubtedly won't be the same as your campsites). You can just download the file and open it in Google Earth in order to see what the file contains. (The kmz file opens directly; if you open the gpx format file in Google Earth it may pop a dialog, in which case say "Create KML LineStrings").

You can get Kate's GPX files instead of ours. IIRC Her files include waypoint names. http://trekkinginturkey.com/BooksAndMaps/maps.html

If you've never used any gps data before, then before trying to deal with my gpx or kml file, you should just experiment with your own small file. It's very easy to create a gpx file by using BikeRouteToaster.com - just make a short track near your home and use that simple track you created to learn how to use Gaia GPS on the iPhone.
Buy the app called "Gaia GPS" for your iPhone 3. Set the map layer to OpenCycleMap. WHEN YOU HAVE WIFI CONNECTION: Import the gpx file into Gaia (they give instructions for how to do that). Then go to your list of saved tracks in Gaia, select a track you just imported, in the upper right corner of the screen is a little arrow-like icon, click that, then choose Download Maps for Track. Then wait a while while it gets all the files.
Disclaimer - Gaia is not so good at handling waypoints. It puts all of your waypoints into one place, not organized into folders and not sortable. The app is very good at tracks, and it displays the waypoints but does not allow you to manage them easily.
Next, with Gaia. Go to Settings->Help->Add Topo Map Sources->ESRI World Imagery. That will allow you to download satellite imagery as well as OpenCycleMap. Repeat the same process to download the sat imagery that you followed to download the CycleMaps - be careful though as Gaia has a design flaw right now such that it gets an enormous amount of data when you download sat imagery for a track, so if you don't have much capacity on your phone you might run out of space. Play around with it and you'll find out.

"2. I will be UL camping , and am wondering what night temperatures you encountered? And was there much rain?"
We had some rain, but not extensive. I don't have any idea what the normal pattern is. We never had frost at night on the Lycian or SPT, low temps were probably in the 50s. But we did have damp cool weather in the Kackars.

"3. Do you think the SPT preferable to the Kackar as a hiking experience if going maybe a month later?"
No opinion about that. So much of the success of a trip is about weather and random acts of kindness or fortuitous wildlife encounters or whatnot. We THOROUGHLY enjoyed being in the Kackars in the snow, before anything was occupied - truly magical experience that I will never forget. And probably a completely different experience from being there when the mountain villages are occupied, which they would be a month later.

I hope this helps. Ask more questions if anything else comes up. Amy

Tord, I asked Jim last night and he also didn't have a preference for east vs west. Both were enjoyable.

Regarding hopping from section to section via bus - it's easy to do that. Combination of hitching, bus, and taxi would work fine. Jim and I prefer to stay on foot once we start a walk; part of the magic of a long hike is the flow and rhythm, and many of our best experiences were in completely unexpected places we would have missed if we had tried to stay in the "most scenic" sections. I don't think of the Lycian Way or SPT as scenic wonders (Southern Utah, California's Sierra Nevada, Wyoming's Wind River Range, Haute Route Pyrenees - all are substantially more scenic) -- the magic of the place is that the Turkish people are so extraordinarily gracious, and to best enjoy their hospitality I think it helps to get away from the tourist areas. For example, one of our most memorable campsites was in the river bed on the edge of the town of Demre - probably not on anybody's list of top destinations in Turkey :)

Amy,

You must be a fast typer! Thanks so much for all that information. I shall have a go ASAP, fingers crossed.

John.

Hi Amy,
Thanks a lot for your detailed information on the Saint Paul Trail. This made us “hungry” and we consider doing it ourselves. However, the following issues are bothering us, so your response is very welcome:
1) Do we have to bring a tent to walk the Saint Paul Trail or are there pensions / private accommodation available each day. Is there a daily possibility to buy food along the trail?
2) Dogs: we have read your responses regarding dogs in the forum on your web-page, but still would like to know, whether you have noticed shepherd-dogs / flocks of sheep on the Saint Paul Trail. What type of encounters with dog is to be expected on the trail? We are no "dog-heroes", therefore this information is essential for us and our decision to walk this trail. We probably would follow your suggestions to pass the dogs at the housing out of Kemerdamları by car.
3) As we already had bad experiences (20 years ago), would you expect problems for 2 (middle-aged) women to walk the path and to camp in the outside / in rural areas.

Thanks, Ulla

Typing on tiny iPhone keypad, so will be brief.

#3 is easy. I also have had bad experience traveling with just 2 women (35 years ago) so I appreciate the question. I felt completely safe there, even more so than in the U.S. I would not hesitate to travel with another woman and no man.

About no tent... There are not always formal accommodations. But we were invited many times per day for tea, and very often asked ( via hand gestures) if we needed a place to sleep. So I think it is likely you could find something, but it may not be predictable. I can't overstate the generosity of the Turks. We recently spent 5 weeks hiking In Australia and received only one offer of tea. We are now on day 12 of hike in Spain and have had only one offer of tea. In Turkey many times per day people invited us for tea or food or a bed. It may be best to take a sleeping bag and pad though, as your invitation may come from a shepherd who only has a crude hut to offer; I wouldn't count on a proper bed with bedding.

As to dogs, that's harder to answer. We did encounter shepherd dogs, but only those I mentioned were scary. The dogs in other countries have been at least as bad. I just don't know what to say.

And one final thing. I finished the first five lessons of Pimsleur Audio Language Lessons and it helped A LOT, just being able to say my nationality and a few very basic phrases made it easier to interact.

Good luck - amy

Updated addition from Jim. He said he wouldn't hike St Paul trail with no tent. There are some long stretches between towns and you just can't predict when you'll find a generous person.

Hi

We made the trip and it was great, we did not get as far as expected but is was a really nice trip. Thanks alot for the gps track, it is so much more useful compared to the original from the book which does not have as many points. We used hammocks and in the eastern part at least made us have a huge selection of camp sites compared to tent. Quite nice hanging at a bay by the mediterrenian :-)

Mr T,
We're glad you had a good trip in Turkey. If you have photos or a trip report, please add a link on this thread so I don't miss it.
Thanks, Amy&Jim

Wow! Thank you very much for the detailed report!

My wife and I are planning to hike the Lycian Way for 7 to 10 days starting from Ovacik. Our initial plan is to start our hike on October 23, 2012 but we now realized that the very important festival Kurban Bayramı start on October 24 until October 28 then followed by the Republic day on Monday the 29. We are not planning on camping so we will rely on accommodations in the villages. We will carry light sleeping bags so we can sleep outside once in a while if the weather is nice. I know you went in spring but could you (or other hikers reading this forum) comment on these questions:

1.How accommodations would be affected? (closed? Fully booked?)

2.Could we have problems finding food?

3. If we delay our start until November 1st
a. Will the weather get really worse?
b. Will most of the accommodations in the small villages be closed for winter?

4. You describe very well the use of an iPhone 4 as a GPS. Do you have an idea if it would work with an iPad or a tablet?

Thank you,

Benoit

Benoit, my wife and I live in the south of Turkey (opposite end of Mediterranean from the Lycian Way) and we've section hiked a few sections of the LW. The first time was 2 years ago during Kurban Bayramı, which fell in the second half of November, from the start at Ovacık to Kalkan and staying at village pansiyonlar (guest houses).
1. We had no problems with accommodation, in spite of not booking in advance. Each evening, we would phone ahead to where we intended to stay the next night to make a provisional booking, and then phone to confirm the next day when we were sure we would make it. The day before the start of Bayram, we stayed with the local imam, and spent the evening with the watching the TV coverage of the coming holiday. There wry comments on the TV commentary was ironic and funny in the circumstances. Some accommodations are very small, though, so you could have problems if you are unlucky (regardless of the Bayram).
2. We had no problems with food.
3. a. There will be no noticeable difference in the weather due to such a short delay.
b. Village accommodation shouldn't be affected, except in mountain villages which are only occupied in summer. They will probably be closed at the end of August, too.
You should be aware that the clocks change on the last Sunday in October. You will lose an hour of daylight in the evening but gain it in the morning. However, if you are having breakfast provided, you may be limited in how early you can eat and so use the extra morning light.
You should also know that some water sources will be dry (whichever start date you choose). Demre to Finike could be especially problematic.
Weather-wise, late October and November are the best time for the Lycian Way, in my opinion.
If you have any questions on where we stayed, etc, pm me. The Ovacık to Kalkan section is the only one where we stayed in local accommodation. Other times we camped.

Benoit wrote "You describe very well the use of an iPhone 4 as a GPS. Do you have an idea if it would work with an iPad or a tablet?"

The iPad WITH Cellular service includes a GPS chip and should work for navigation just like the iPhone does.
The Wi-Fi only iPad does not include a GPS chip and will not work for navigation.

Thank you, the information you sent pointed me in the good direction to do some research. I found that the Google Nexus 7 has an integrated "real GPS", no need to have connectivity if I preload the maps. Seems like a good solution at half the price of an iPad.

I'm not sure yet if I'll go technological. I'm still considering printing paper maps from opencyclemap.org in addition to Kate's book and map. I know I would get lost once in a while as in the old days...