Here is my sul gear list for a 2 day, 1 night outing this coming weekend. The high is going to be in the upper 60's & the low is going to be in the lower 40's. There is no chance of rain & no insects.

1. Soloman raid revo 20 (10 oz)
2. Granite gear airbag #1- for clothes (0.375 oz)
3. 3 micro zip-lock bags- for first-aid, survival & miscellany (0.1 oz)
4. Cocoon silk mummy liner (4.375 oz)
5. bubble wrap sleeping pad- hardcore! (0.875 oz)
6. Titanium goat bivy (4.75 oz)
7. Starbuck's double shot can stove (0.1 oz)
8. Foster's beer can cookpot (0.8 oz)
9. Popeye's plastic spork (0.1 oz)
10. strike-on-box matches (0.3 oz)
11. 1L platypus bottle- for purifiying (0.8 oz)
12. 2L platypus bottle- for drinking (1.0 oz)
13. bleach in small dropper bottle- water treatment (0.75 oz)
14. razor blade (0.05 oz)
15. plastic emergency whistle (0.125 oz)
16. homemade minor wounds/meds kit (1.0 oz)
17. Charmin travel roll tp (0.5 oz)
18. alcohol hand sanitizer in small dropper bottle (0.375 oz)
19. 3' duct tape- for repairs (0.25 oz)
20. 100' accessory cord, sparklite tender kit (3 tenders, lighter) (0.31 oz)
21. Micro photon LED light (0.2 oz)
22. trash bag (0.25 oz)
23. bandanna (0.75 oz)
24. Nike l/s shirt (5.5 oz)
25. Mountain hardwear phantom down coat (16.0 oz)
26. Smartwool crew socks (3.125 oz)
27. Mountain hardwear powerstretch gloves (1.25 oz)
28. Smartwool beanie (1.75 oz)
29. plastic hooded emergency poncho- just in case (1.375 oz)

Total Base Pack Weight: 57.135 oz (3.5 lbs)

Will I be warm enough with just a l/s shirt, beanie, gloves and a down coat, without a sleeping bag at night down to the low 40's? I'm taking a silk mummy liner for added warmth inside my bivy.
Any suggestions?

Edited by ShortmanCal on 11/21/2006 20:18:25 MST.

I did mid 40s and rain in just a bivy and Micropuff pullover + wool hat. 8 hours sleep was cold. I was fine for 4 hours and 4 hours was restless and cold without the bivy closed up pretty tight. Nothing insulation wise on the legs gets chilly.

Why not trade the jacket and silk liner for a real bag unless you're just getting a feel for your limits?

Edited by Pivvay on 11/21/2006 21:02:32 MST.

What parts of the pack did you cut off to lose 5 oz from it? I predict you will get cold.

Edited by jshann on 11/22/2006 07:35:02 MST.

I agree with Christopher. In my case I would use my No Sniveller Quilt rather than the jacket and mummy liner. You didn't ask about this but I would use AquaMira or Micropur over bleach.

Christopher, thats exactly what I'm trying to do...I'm trying to get a feel for my limits and what temperature I can sleep in relative comfort so I can adjust my gear list accordingly.
John, I purchased my Soloman Raid Revo 20 not that long ago, I think in the summer...I guess its a new version that weighs less than older models.
Eric, would Katadyn micropur tablets be more effective than bleach? If so, the tablets are lighter so I would swap the bleach out.
Overall, do you think, with the mummy liner, bivy sack and down coat, that I can stay warm enough to get at least 6 hours of sleep?

I'm guessing you will sleep but the later part of the morning will be chilly. In that case just get up and make breakfast if you aren't sleeping anymore anyway. You certainly won't freeze to death at that temp and just pay attention to your body and hole up in that bivy if you need more warmth. Good exercise and I'm personally glad that I did mine. I'll be pushing my MB#7 on a sub 30deg night here soon to see how that works. As long as you have bail out/back up plans it's not all that dangerous.

MP1 is way better than bleach in my opinion. I weighed 10 of them one time in the package and it was like .2 ounces or something small like that. I can look it up if anyone really cares.

In order to meet the efficacy of Micropur you would have to add so much bleach that the water would hardly be drinkable. I've never used bleach. My info comes from a report by the WHO and the fact that Micropur is certified for its purpose.

Did you do the test Jordan? How did it go?

Heres a link to my 40* setup.
http://www.backpackinglight.com/backpackinglight/forums/gear_lists/2fb5360fcf0f418e41c248e45ae5d729.pdf

It has room to be trimmed here and there, but its sub 3 lbs and comfortable to sleep in to 40* (no cold sleep at 40* for me, but thats the limit). a 1300 or so CI silnylon sack would do you well and cut half a pound. I would definatley trade out the down jacket for a JRB shenandoah universal blanket or simlar homemade system. I have 2.5 oz silk liners I made, they would save a few ounces. I'm really diggin the emergency poncho though. that combined with the trashbag would make a good VB liner for your whole body and get you a few degrees colder. I use bleach too, it tastes like a swimming pool when used to clorox's reccomended levels for water treatment (2 drops per liter or something). I decided to let let my immune system do most of the work. I haven't gotten sick.... yet. I would also highly reccomend a light my fire spork. it is the single greatest invention ever. Good luck not freezing!

Sorry, I've been busy studying for exams... the trip went fairly well. The micropur tablets worked great & they were lighter than the dropper of bleach & didn't leave a chlorine taste. As for the sleeping setup, I stayed warm for 3 or so hours with just a down coat, a silk mummy liner & a bivy in 40 degrees. However, after those 3 hours, my legs started to get cold which caused the rest of my body to get cold. To solve this problem, I moved by the fire & had to keep it going all night to stay comfortable (which was a pain in the butt). Overall, I could have slept warmly most of the night if I had brought some kind of leg insulation, either insulated or tights. I think it would be lighter, however, just to carry a 40 degree bag & wear light insulating clothing to boost it's temp rating.

For those of you who predicted that I would get cold, you were dead-on, but now I know my limitations & can adjust my gear list accordingly.

Edited by ShortmanCal on 12/11/2006 08:28:24 MST.

I have done the "jacket and bivy sack" thing many many times. Usually to get some shuteye after coming off an alpine climb, or to grab a few zz's right before starting one.

These "mountaineers" systems are generally not suitable for a long night's rest, because the whole concept is based on the mountaineer's mentality of a "bivy" camp, which is not a long sleep.

One memorable moment: Alan Dixon and I climbed (oh wait, I mean attempted) the Middle Teton, we opted to ditch overnight gear. We both had GoLite Coal jackets and bivy sacks. I used an Ortovox "Bivvy-Poncho" and Alan used an ID Endurance, I think. We started at Billy's Giant Hamburgers (calorie loading), sorted our gear on the lawn outside the Jackson Hole Visitors Center, then hit the trailhead around 11pm, after a long day of travel.

So, being able to hike for a few hours and then sleep on the trail for a few hours was a nice option, because the alternative was to sleep in town in a motel, which as you know are not very appealing because of the warm bedding, access to hot tubs, and fresh pastries in the mornings.

Anyway, the temp was around 33F and needless to say, our nap systems were dialed in so perfectly that the cold woke us up exactly at the right time so we could continue hiking and reach the base of the climb at dawn.

Yep, the bivy-jacket thing is the way to go sometimes.

I've climbed Gannett Peak (WY) and Mt. Olympus (WA) in this style as well - using a jacket and bivy combo. The approach is around 18 miles, then a climb, then the hike out. On both climbs, I started at around 9 pm, hit the base of the climbs at dawn, climbed and descended by noon, napped in the "warm" (relatively) hours on the way out, and finished back at the car around midnight.

It's actually a really fun way to climb a remote peak, or just visit a remote lake or place even, without having to plan a weeks vacation around the event.