If 'quieter, warmer and less slippery' aren't worries for me, do you still recommend the Synmat over the NeoAir for it's shape (ie. slightly wider, larger tubes on the outside) or do you find this doesn't make much of difference. My primary concern is how comfortable I am.

Best sleep I have had in backcountry! I have owned Big Agnes ins. air cores, Neo Air, and sold off a Kooka Bay pad that was over-kill and overweight for my needs and I haven't regretted getting rid of any of them after using the Exped this summer.

Thanks Robert. I'll probably put one of these on my birthday list (or Christmas list if that doesn't work out).

I've been sleeping on my NeoAir small this summer, and I'm starting to think that the short pad thing is hurting my back and I need to go back to full length. I think what happens is that eventually at some point in the night I wind up sleeping on my back (because I roll around quite a bit) and when I sleep on my back with my legs dropping off over the end of the pad, it bends my back backwards a bit and then it gets sore and after that I'm sore and don't sleep well for the rest of the night. When I use the same pad to sleep in my car, I pile up clothes under my feet to raise them up and I always sleep great in the car....so I think it's the drop off that is hurting me, which is a big change from what I've been believing all along (that a short pad was working just as well).

Dan, No problem. The problem with all gear is how subjective it is to everyones experiences with it. Like you mentioned, for 3 season hiking, either one will work, but for me it was an easy choice. There have been some that have mentioned that they like the horizontal tubes of the Neoair as opposed to the vertical tubes of the UL7, but again that is a personal preference. Best of luck on whichever way you go!

Hi Folks,

I bought the Neoair to replace two Pads.

1. A Neoair Regular, userd for about 20 nights from summer in tents to winter in snow holes (with CCF) and was alway warm and comforable but I kept rolling off it and found it a bit too narrow.

2. Kookabay R 6 Mummy Pad, used a handul of time, very comfy but again a bit too narrow and my head and feet kept falling off the Pad.

I havent used the Synmat in the field yet so cannot comment on the wamth but I have test slept on it at at home and its far more comfortable than the Neoair or Kookabay mummy and I dont roll off.

Below this is how I plan to use it for both situatios.

1. 3 Season, I will use it with a 1/3 lengh of Z lite and the same size of Car Windscreen insulation (wieght about 40g)

2. Winter, Full lenght Z lite with 2/3 of Car Winscreen insulation (80g)

My new system will be slightly heavier and bulkier than my old one but allows more so for Pad damage or unexpected temperature decreases.

I always like to carry 1/3 CCF with me all year round to keep my backside warm at lunch time so thats no weight penalty.

Cheers,

Stephen

Edited by stephenm on 10/25/2011 04:04:46 MDT.

Former NeoAir user, shook all night at just above freezing on the AT w/ a 35F WM Caribou MF. Switched out for an Synmat UL7 and achieved some of my best backcountry rest yet.

Im a former neo user as well, exped is far more comfy for me. Just had a chance to do back to back testing in havasupai when my GF started complaining about not sleeping well on her neo. We traded pads the last night and she slept much better and I slept a little worse. The big baffles on the exped really do make it feel much wider. If they make a 25" short synmat I think it would be the perfect pad.

Wow a lot of people are stoked on the Exped....neat to hear for sure. It's almost like Exped is paying people to post here :)

Exped's okay. I wish it were wider. I used mine for the first time last weekend in CA. Got down to around 30-35 and I stayed nice and warm. Can't really say which I like better - NeoAir or Synmat UL7. Synmat certainly feels more substantial, that might be enough to tip the scales in its favor. But I'm not one of those who thinks it's far and away better than the NeoAir. I like my NeoAir.

I haven't used either very much but I have slept on both.

I used my UL7 for the first time last weekend at the same site Doug mentioned. I was warm and had no issues with sliding off.

The pad wasn't "OMG" comfortable but I did prefer it to the Neoair. One of the main differences for me was based on the fact that I prefer to sleep w/the pad slightly deflated. On the Neoair the pad seemed to bulge away from my pressure points and push up into some other part of my body. When sleeping on my back the pad caused me to arch uncomfortably. This didn't happen on the UL7. It seemed like maybe the fabric flexed/absorbed more of the pressure w/o distorting other areas? I'm not really sure but it did work better for me.

Keep your Neoair Doug, and I'll give you $50 for that worn out used UL 7.

"Keep your Neoair Doug, and I'll give you $50 for that worn out used UL 7."

Joe, you're too kind. I'll get it in the mail to you tomor........wait a second! You're good, man. You almost had me there...... ;-)

No 25" wide Exped. Too bad. Advantage Neoair. Has anyone tried the Nemo Cosmo Pads?

"Has anyone tried the Nemo Cosmo Pads?"

No...I've never looked at this pad seriously. I just checked and it's 29oz....tough to justify that when you could get a large NeoAir for way less weight.

Oh that's a pig isn't it?

Well it's the same as two NeoAir's plus a 1oz Kookabay Pillow...so yeah it's sort of a pig. In other words, that's a little bit more than my current sleeping pad (9oz NeoAir Small), pack (5oz Zpacks Zero w options) and sleeping quilt (14oz custom M55/900fp) all added together.

I always hate gaining weight, which is why this sleeping pad decision is so tough for me. I want to sleep better, but I also want to avoid 'feature creep' where I slowly add in weight over time thinking each small gain is a good idea, but then it 5 years I look back at the end result and realize I'm right back where I started. For me, a 7oz gain is huge. I mean, I just paid $400 to save 5oz (replace sleeping quilt with one made of lighter fabrics and better down). Other options would be a Klymit X Frame (no weight gain, but really only a summer pad) or a regular NeoAir (+ 5oz) or maybe find some better way to support my feet (fill pack under my feet with platy's?)

Edited by dandydan on 10/25/2011 22:07:31 MDT.

Well it looks like I'm in the Synmat UL club now. I came across a used Synmat UL 7 (medium) on eBay that has 'two small patches' on it from the Exped warranty department. $75 seemed like a pretty good deal to me. The 'two small patches' appear to be just to the left of the Exped logo....they are indeed very small if I'm seeing the picture correctly (it's larger on my screen, BPL drops the size):



One thing that seems a bit off is the MSRP of the Synmat UL. The Synmat UL is the same basic design as the regular Synmat, but with the Synmat UL you don't get the internal pump, you get less of the same type of insulation but it uses a lighter nylon shell so the price goes up 30% ($119 vs. $155)? I understand the lighter weight nylon might cost Exped a little more since it's a new fabric, but surely the deletion of the entire internal pump mechanism along with using significantly less insulation (R. 3.1 vs. R 4.9) is enough to offset this. Exped also sells the Synmat Basic with is just a regular Synmat with no pump, less insulation and different baffle construction and it's $80.

It seems that the NeoAir might be the more durable pad, despite initial impressions here. I trust that the Synmat UL uses nicer fabric (ie. not as loud and plastic feeling) and I do look forward to that, but it's thinner nylon (20 denier vs. 30 denier) so the NeoAir should have the tougher shell of the two. I've also found one report of the baffles coming apart in the Synmat UL, which I've never yet heard of for the NeoAir despite it's tremendous popularity.

"Another former Neoair user...The UL7 is...less slippery."

I'm a little suspicious about the 'less slippery' thing. The BPL measured the NeoAir as a lot more grippy, and on REI.com there are 23 reviews for the Synmat, of which 4 people (17 %) mention 'slips easy' is somewhat of a problem. With the NeoAir there are 131 reviews and 9 (7%) say it slips, which is a far lower percentage.
http://www.rei.com/product/811907/exped-synmat-ul-7-air-pad

"I store mine under my bed with both valves open."
When stored with the valves open, does the mattress puff up a little due to the insulation? Or is the insulation too weak to actually inflate the mattress at all. If it did puff up the mattress a bit, that would really help with drying it out and it might make the mattress a bit easier to inflate on the trail because you could leave it to inflate a bit on it's own before puffing it up the rest of the way.

Edited by dandydan on 10/26/2011 22:13:05 MDT.

http://www.thegearcaster.com/the_gearcaster/2011/07/therm-a-rest-neoair-gets-warmer-and-lighter.html

What about the Neoair XTherm or Neoair XLite that'll be available in January?

The XTherm is 15.2oz and R5.7… there won't be any reason for the Synmat UL 7 to exist in two months. The XTherm will be 1oz lighter and R2.6 warmer. Alternatively, the XLite is R3.2 and 12oz.

Either way, nobody should be buying the existing crop of mats right now unless you need a pad now.

Look around on the web....when resaerching pads a year ago, I read multiple reviews of neoair pad separating baffles and creating big pillows in the middle of the pad. I distinctly remember one man bought 4 NA's for his family and 2 had this problem. I believe that review was on REI.

As for the Exped being slippery, I've had mine more than a year now and have never chased my pad and I'm in a mummy bag with a slippery bottom unlike a quilt.

"The XTherm is 15.2oz and R5.7"

I will wait until the pad is tested by BPL. Given I (and many others) have difficulty in using the regular NeoAir to freezing, I believe that the R5.7 will be unattainable without insulation.

Oh, and it will be $200.