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William Zila
(Ultralightwillinn.m) - MLife

Locale: Albuquerque
Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 04/19/2011 11:42:30 MDT Print View

I find both comfortable there both in my price range my
Questions is the r value on the exped is higher and from what I've heard the neoair is over rated on the r value anyway so which would you guys choose ?

Scott H.
(handyman439) - F
r-value on 04/19/2011 11:45:24 MDT Print View

I dont own a neo-air, but from what I have gathered the listed R-vaule for the pad seams to be pretty accurate. I know many people use then in conjunction to a thing foam pad for winter camping.

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 04/19/2011 11:50:24 MDT Print View

I had / have both. The NeoAir was good to about 38F and then I felt some conductive heat loss. The Exped has been used down to 26F and I was a little too hot using just silk weight underwear and a Golite quilt. The insulation makes a world of difference. One company is either overstating the R-value or one company is understating the R-value. Given that there is no international standard methodology for testing for R-value of sleeping pads (there should be - EN, are you listening?), we really can only compare real world use of both pads.

William Zila
(Ultralightwillinn.m) - MLife

Locale: Albuquerque
Pads on 04/19/2011 12:02:15 MDT Print View

From the reviews it's looking like the exped is a better bet for me seeing as i would like to be able to use the pad down to 20 without the bulk of a extra foam pad

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
r values on 04/19/2011 12:35:03 MDT Print View

I'd say the listed r values are very close for both, 2.5 for the neo and 3.1 for the exped

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 04/19/2011 12:52:52 MDT Print View

Close only counts in Horseshoes and shaking uncontrollably at 3 in the morning because your NeoAir's warmth is way overstated.

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
r values on 04/19/2011 13:02:50 MDT Print View

I would expect the Exped to be a little warmer w/ a slightly higher r value, that shouldn't surprise anyone

most folks (not all) are finding freezing pretty close to the comfort limit of the neo (myself and my relatively cold sleeping wife included), I'd say that's pretty darn close for a 2.5 r value- w/ the 3.1 of the exped I'd expect it to be comfortable closer to the low to mid 20's- w/ some variation based on sleep system, weather and individual metabolisms obviously

Daniel Goldenberg
(dag4643)

Locale: Pacific Northwet
Re: Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 04/19/2011 13:15:33 MDT Print View

Just bought one of these over the weekend with my REI dividend.

What are you synmaters doing for inflation? inflating by mouth? How about storage? The instructions say to store unrolled with the valves opened but the air does not really escape unless you roll the pad up to let air out and then you end up with the insulation a little compressed.

Thanks!

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
Exped synamat ul 7 on 04/19/2011 13:26:24 MDT Print View

I am using my mouth to inflate. I store mine under my bed with both valves open.

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 04/19/2011 13:59:25 MDT Print View

"most folks (not all) are finding freezing pretty close to the comfort limit of the neo (myself and my relatively cold sleeping wife included), I'd say that's pretty darn close for a 2.5 r value- w/ the 3.1 of the exped I'd expect it to be comfortable closer to the low to mid 20's- w/ some variation based on sleep system, weather and individual metabolisms obviously"

If you find the Neo Air that warm, then I would not be surprised that you find the Symat warm to 20F. My point is that there is not a 0.6 R-value difference between the two pads. I would not be surprised if it is closer to 1.5R in comparison testing.

Kyle Meyer
(kylemeyer) - M

Locale: Portland, OR
Neoair warmth on 04/19/2011 14:17:07 MDT Print View

I've been warm below freezing on a Neoair, and have slept warm on snow with it and a torso-length Ridgerest. I use an American Medical Kits emergency blanket as a groundcloth which may have something to do with it, though. If the difference between the Neoair and the Neoair trekker is R0.5, it's a fair bet that a second aluminized layer underneath likely helps in a similar capacity.

Dual use as a groundcloth and additional warmth. Cut down to 2' x 6', you're looking at roughly 1 ounce.

Daniel Goldenberg
(dag4643)

Locale: Pacific Northwet
Re: Exped synamat ul 7 on 04/19/2011 14:32:12 MDT Print View

Hi David,

Do you first try to get as much air out of the pad before storage?

Dave U
(FamilyGuy) - F

Locale: Rockies
Exped Synmat on 04/19/2011 15:25:17 MDT Print View

Hi Daniel - no, I simply open the valves and lay it flat. The air will work its way out but the insulation will remain uncompressed.

todd nichols
(foxnich) - F

Locale: North Georgia
Neo Air on 04/19/2011 16:13:11 MDT Print View

I hiked last weekend on the Art Loeb trail in Western NC. The second night it was 35 degrees, and my Neo Air did fine. I was a little chilly, but honestly I was cold on my Big Agnes IAC at that temp.

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
Re: Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 04/19/2011 16:36:31 MDT Print View

David said "If you find the Neo Air that warm, then I would not be surprised that you find the Symat warm to 20F. My point is that there is not a 0.6 R-value difference between the two pads. I would not be surprised if it is closer to 1.5R in comparison testing."

ahh- OK- we're on the same page now, no experience w/ the new synmat, so it's possible there is that much of a gap in r value

William Zila
(Ultralightwillinn.m) - MLife

Locale: Albuquerque
Synamat on 04/19/2011 19:27:54 MDT Print View

Well went to rei and pulled the trigger on a synimat :)

Dan Durston
(dandydan) - M

Locale: Cascadia
Re: Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 10/24/2011 22:06:31 MDT Print View

"If you find the Neo Air that warm, then I would not be surprised that you find the Symat warm to 20F. My point is that there is not a 0.6 R-value difference between the two pads. I would not be surprised if it is closer to 1.5R in comparison testing."

I happened across this older thread because I was researching the Synmat UL (which looks awesome....might get one - mostly to try vertical baffles and the wider outer tubes). Kinda fun to look back on these comments in light of the State of the Market article now out.

Depending on the level of inflation, the Synmat tested at R 2.7-3.8 (R 3.25 average) while the NeoAir tested at R 1.6 - 6.1 (R 3.85 average). We can see that at an average level of inflation, both mats are warmer than claimed, with the NeoAir being warmer than the Synmat UL. Perhaps David had the NeoAir under inflated, as that really drops the R-value. The NeoAir R-value does vary with inflation level quite a bit, which might actually be a good thing because you can top it off for cold nights, or let air out when it's warm.

Edited by dandydan on 10/24/2011 22:07:51 MDT.

Kevin Harper
(kevinharper2) - F

Locale: Southwest
Exped on 10/24/2011 22:15:20 MDT Print View

I own both and I notice that the Exped is noticeably warmer, in my opinion a much better pad. Living in the desert I deal with punctures and in my opinion the Exped holds up a little better. I like that it comes with a stuff sack and repair kit also.

Dan Durston
(dandydan) - M

Locale: Cascadia
Pads on 10/24/2011 22:25:38 MDT Print View

I guess the other question is 'does it really matter?', because both pads are clear 3-season pads (as opposed to 4-season pads or summer pads). I've used my NeoAir down to 20F many times and even slept on snow with it 2-3 times. I could tell I was losing some heat on the snow, but my bag kept me warm enough to sleep through the night. When not sleeping on snow, I've never really noticed losing a large amount of heat thru the pad. My point is that for normal 3 season use, either pad is going to be warm enough and there's probably more salient deciding factors.

I like that the Synmat supposedly measures a couple cm's wider in real life, and I like how it's got the larger tubes along the edges. Supposedly the material feels nicer too, which isn't a big deal but it's nice.

Robert Perkins
(rp3957)

Locale: The Sierras
Exped synamat ul 7 vs neoair on 10/24/2011 22:26:03 MDT Print View

Another former Neoair user that votes for the Exped, hands-down. The UL7 is quieter, warmer, easier to stay on due to the raised edges, and less slippery.