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Curtis B.
(rutilate) - MLife

Locale: New England
Now for the hard part-moving below 10 lbs for 6 days in Yellowstone, August 20 on 03/16/2011 22:19:39 MDT Print View

Folks,
I've moved from 22lbs to 9.9, and I've cut just about everything I can think of. And maybe a few more that I shouldn't have. Would you consider taking a look at this list and sharing your thoughts on what should be improved?

I'm especially concerned about warmth. Last year about a week later in the Tetons we had 15-20* overnight and snow. Since then I've cut my fleece top/bottom. Should I add them back? My rainpants were invaluable as an insulator. Will the Dryducks also serve as an insulator?

In the Tetons the trails were very clear-no need for gaiters. What about Yellowstone, esp. the Bechler River area? I don't have a repair kit for the NeoAir or the tent. What do you recommend?

My understanding is that there are a number of river crossings along the Bechler. Hence the Sockwa water shoes. I'm not quite ready to leave my boots behind in favor of thin socks and trail runners that can dry out on the trail. Perhaps next time I'll have a chance to give it a try.

Do I really need the foil emergency blanket? Is there a better option than a GU packet for the emergency kit?

I am trying to figure out a much lighter weight beltpack for the emergency kit.

I think I can shave the weight on my stove by shifting to a Caldera F keg which is 4.2 oz w/o the caddy.

Two options for you:
Either download the PDF here: http://www.backpackinglight.com/backpackinglight/forums/gear_lists/38c4bc92db80dd418e2402f816a3851c.pdf
or in my profile.

Or save the following as a .csv file and import into Excel:
System,Item,Notes,Tot wt,Lbs
Packing,,,25.9,1.6
,Backpack,Osprey Hornet 46,24,
,Stuff sack-Sleeping bag ,Mountainfitter Cuben CTF3 10x20 drybag,0.8,
,Stuff sack-Clothing,Mountainfitter Cuben CTF3 12x24 drybag,1.1,
Shelter,,,19.7,1.2
,Tent,Tarptent Sublite (Tyvek),18.5,
,Stakes,Titanium stakes ,1.2,
Sleeping,,,32.4,2
,Sleeping bag/quilt,Nunatak Arc Specialist 32 (overfilled to 15*) quilt,18,
,Sleeping pad,Thermarest NeoAir Regular 13.8 oz (manuf=14.6)||Large 19oz,13.8,
,Pillow,Pillow: Ultralight Designs FlexAir Ultralight Pillow,0.6,
Kitchen,,,14,0.9
,Pot,Evernew 0.9L Ti Ultralight,3.9,
,Stove,"Caldera Ti Tri Sidewinder (Cone + Inferno 2.4oz, 2 Ti stakes 0.4oz, 10-12 stove 0.5oz,
Mesh 0.6 oz, (esbit 1.9oz, stuffsack 0.6oz matches 0.1oz REMOVED) )",3.9,
,Bear bag,Mountainfitter Cuben CTF3 + 12x20 OpSak (2.75oz bag + 1.5oz OpSack),4.3,
,Spork,Titanium Spork,0.3,
,Cozy,Freezer Bag Cozy,1.2,
,Flame source,Mini Bic lighter,0.4,
Clothing Carried,,,41.7,2.6
,Underwear,EMS Techwick wicking,3.1,
,Base Layer top,"First Ascent Midweight crewneck top (sleeping, morning warmth)",5.1,
,Base Layer bottom,First Ascent Midweight pants,4.1,
,Windshirt/windbreaker,Marmot Ion windshirt,5.8,
,Hiking socks,"Smartwool Hiking (std = 3.2, exp = 3.8)",3.2,
,Rain Gear,Driducks rain suit,11.1,
,Hat,Lightweight beanie hat,1.1,
,Gloves,Lightweight liner gloves,1.1,
,Water shoes,Sockwa black amphibians (for river crossing),7.1,
Water & Purification,,,11,0.7
,Bladder/Bottle,Platypus 3L,5.8,
,Purification bottle,24 oz Gatorade bottle,1.5,
,Purification system,Steripen Adventurer opti 3.5oz (Remove neoprene case -0.8),3.7,
Toiletries,,,2.3,0.1
,Soap,Sea to Summit Pocket Shampoo (use for body as well),0,
,Toothbrush,Colgate Wisp,0.1,
,Toothpaste,Toothpaste dots (dehydrated paste in small baggy),0.3,
,Hand sanitizer,Repackaged,0.7,
,Cleanser,Baby wipes in baggy (1 per day for evening cleanup),1.2,
Misc,,,11.4,0.7
,Pack towel/face wipe/pot holder,MSR Packtowel nano (.3) or Packtowel personal,0.7,
,Regular glasses,,0.3,
,Sunglasses case,Homemade from Tenite Butyrate Tubing,1,
,Headlamp ,Petzl Tikka XP,3.2,
,Sunscreen,Repackaged into microdropper bottles,1,
,Knife,Single-edge razor blade in paper sheath,0.1,
,Camera,Camera (Canon Powershot sd1400 IS),4.7,
,Map,Printed onto 4 sheets paper or torn out of heavier map,0.4,
,,Total Base Weight,158.2,9.9
Food,,,122,7.6
,Actual food weight ,Roughly 20oz/day,100,
,Electrolyte/energy,"Clif Shot Bloks (2 servings/pkg, 2 pkg/day)",22,
Fuel,,,3.9,0.2
,Denatured alcohol,~.5 oz per meal/1oz/day*6 days,3.9,
Water,,,70.6,4.4
,Water @ 35.28 oz/liter,,70.6,
,,Subtotal of Fuel & Water,196.4,12.3
,,Pack Total Weight:,354.6,22.2
Emergency Kit-Carried ,,,14.3,0.9
,Fire source,Firesteel (Firesteel.com Pup and scraper),0.5,
,Tinder,Cotton balls (coat with lip balm for tinder,0.1,
,Emergency epinephrine,"Epipen single use (no case, tape on lid)",0,
,Whistle,Fox 40 micro,0.1,
,Emergency ties,Zip Ties,0.2,
,Emergency calories/electrolytes,GU packet (is there a better option?),1.1,
,Emergency shelter,Foil emergency blanket (do I really need this?),0,
,Basic first aid kit,"Moleskin, bandages, antiseptic,Benadryl tabs, Ivy cleanse, 3 latex gloves, 2 antacid, tylenol, ibuprofen, imodium tablets, prilosec, Potable Aqua (10 tabs),3 alcohol wipes,3 single-use neosporin packets, lg safety pin",3.7,
,Inhaler,Albuterol puffer,1.1,
,Lip balm,Vaseline lip balm in squeeze container (doubles as tinder on cotton balls),0.4,
,Insect repellant,"Repel 100, in mini dropper container",0.4,
,Toilet paper,"In ziploc bag, amount varies by length of trip",1.5,
,Emergency cord,Kelty TripTease line 50',1,
,Emergency kit container,Belt pack with buckles,4.2,
Gear Carried & Worn,,,80.3,5
,Hiking poles,REI Peak UL Carbon,12.5,
,Boots,SalomonQuest 4d GTX size 10 @49.0oz,49,
,Compass,Silva Polaris base plate compass,1,
,Sunglasses,Prescription,1,
,Shirt,ArcTeryx T-shirt blue,4.1,
,Shorts,Brooks lightweight ,5.1,
,Hiking socks,Smartwool hiking,3.2,
,Hat,Need wide brim?,3.1,
,Bandanna,Bandanna/Buff,1.3,
,,Subtotal Carried & Worn,94.6,5.9
,,Total Trail Weight:,449.2,28.07625

Comments greatly appreciated.

Kronos Master of Fate
(kthompson) - MLife

Locale: Behind the Redwood Curtain
. on 03/16/2011 22:29:43 MDT Print View

.

Edited by kthompson on 03/16/2011 22:30:22 MDT.

Andrew F
(andrew.f) - F - M

Locale: San Francisco Bay Area
Re: List on 03/16/2011 22:53:51 MDT Print View

You will probably need a warmer sleeping pad at 15-20F than just a NeoAir. I would bring the NeoAir regular instead of the large, and take the extra 5 oz in the form of a 1/4" or 3/8" Thinlight. The extra warmth will add more comfort than the bigger pad. Also, you could try blowing it up all the way for more insulation even if it's a little less comfortable.

Hat - Is a 1.1 oz hat warm enough for you in a quilt at 15F? My 200 weight polartec hat is closer to 2 oz and is what I would want in those temps.

Underwear - I would nix the extra pair and just sleep in your base layer bottoms. The pair you wore during the day will be dry by morning.

Emergency blanket - If you are worried about being cold, it adds a big safety margin. It would be very effective under your quilt both as a radiant barrier and a VBL. It would make the difference between being truly miserable and only somewhat uncomfortable if it was significantly colder than you expected one night.

Overall your list is great. And miles away from 22 lbs! You are in the realm of "fine tuning" now.

Andrew

todd harper
(funnymoney) - MLife

Locale: Sunshine State
Re: Now for the hard part-moving below 10 lbs for 6 days in Yellowstone, August 20 on 03/17/2011 08:16:52 MDT Print View

+1 on Andrew's advice regarding the pad, base layer sleeping, and hat. I'm 6'1"+ and use a medium Neo with the Montbell pillow at the end and sleep well. When on my side (I toss&turn a lot) I can move the pillow on top of the pad and curl up slightly. Perfect comfort - your setup should be similar, so definitely skip the Large Neo unless the width is a necessity.

I carry one patch from the Neo repair kit "just in case". Don't wanna be without my Neo!

The Foster's setup is definitely lighter, but the TiTri sure is sweet. If lightness is THE goal, then buy the Foster's and make me a deal on the TiTri. :) However, if the rest of your kit makes you happy, then don't part with the TiTri's versatility. Not to mention the Evernew pot is great, too.

ULA's CDT is a great, lighter option to your pack, given your low base weight.

Hat: I now wear a Tilley AirFlo and like the wide brim. Prior to that I was happy w/my light Nike "baseball" style hat and my bandanna underneath (hanging out the back) to protect my neck & ears from the sun. Soaking the bandanna in a stream provides great cooling when it's hot.

Steofan The Apostate
(simaulius) - F

Locale: Bohemian Alps
Now for the hard part-moving below 10 lbs for 6 days in Yellowstone, August 20 on 03/17/2011 09:09:28 MDT Print View

Think cold & damp with wind (flavored with smoke from local wildfires) and chances of patchy sunlight. You will have rain and lots of water to slog through. Perfect neighborhood for the Douglas firs. If you are very lucky the weather could be mild & dry but don't bet on that lasting for more than half a day.
Take trail runners, gaiters and thin socks: they will dry out faster than boots.
Keep the emergency blanket.
Line your pack with a trash compactor bag.
Beanie/stocking cap? You'll need it at night and will most likely end up wearing it during the day.
Will be worthwhile to learn more about animal tracks and droppings because you will see lots of both.
Speaking of droppings: carry more than a few anti-diarrheal pills.
Take lots of pictures!

Mike Clelland
(mikeclelland) - MLife

Locale: The Tetons (via Idaho)
August is magical! on 03/17/2011 12:41:18 MDT Print View

I live right near yellowstone, and I've spent a LOT of time there. And August is magical!

====

Stuff sack for Sleeping bag --- NIX ---

Stuff sack-Clothing --- NIX ---

Bear bag --- NIX --- all the established campsites in YELLOWSTONE have bear hang bars. Just take string and a stuff sack for the food. Easy.

Underwear (carried) --- NIX --- No need, just wear on pair for the whole trip.

Rain Gear - Driducks rain suit - Take the jacket, NIX the pants. This is an awesome raincoat, but be careful, it tares easy!

Platypus 3L --- NIX --- THere is water EVERYWHERE in yellowstone, you'll NEVER need this much capacity.

Purification bottle - what is this????

Are you solo camping?, if so a 0.9 liter pot is too big for just one, get a smaller pot. Are you planning to cook with wood under the Caldera Ti Tri Sidewinder? Or use alcohol?

Headlamp - 3.2 oz is too much, a petzl e+lite is plenty.

Single-edge razor blade in paper sheath - You wrote this just to warm my heart!

Electrolyte/energy - Clif Shot Bloks (2 servings/pkg, 2 pkg/day) - this is part of your food, so no need to call it something separate.

Fire source / tinder - You have alcohol, so no need. --- NIX ---

Toilet paper --- NIX ---

Boots - 49 oz??? Good grief, those are TRADITIONAL hiking boots!! Get some nylon running shoes!!!

Water shoes --- NIX --- Just walk thru the water with your shoes (your new light shoes, DON"T take 49 oz footwear!!!) Ducks have wet feet all the time, and they do fine.

Emergency ZIP ties --- NIX ---

Emergency calories/electrolytes --- No need for "emergency" food, just add this to the food collumn in the spreadsheet.

Emergency shelter - --- NIX ---

Emergency kit container - What is this?


Bandanna - you have a pack towel AND a bandana, WHY??? Take the lighter option, or cut your bandana down.

.

ADD :
===============

A) BEAR SPRAY WITH A HOLSTER! Don't carry this on your back or inside your pack!

B) Waterproof the pack with a 2.2 oz hefty trash COMPACTOR bag. 1 is all you need.

Edited by mikeclelland on 03/17/2011 19:39:41 MDT.

Mike Clelland
(mikeclelland) - MLife

Locale: The Tetons (via Idaho)
ditch your big boots! on 03/17/2011 12:48:17 MDT Print View

Curtis wrote:
==========
"I'm not quite ready to leave my boots behind in favor of thin socks and trail runners that can dry out on the trail."

.

Mike replies:
=========
What? Sure you are! This is the easiest thing imaginable. You won't be in the east coat. Almost all of Yellowstone is well above 9,000 feet and august is magically dry, with like 0% humidity. You'll be fie. Just walk right thru those beautiful (and often warm) creeks! Trust me. Really. Ditch your big boots.

The whole reason I enjoy hiking is because I do it WITHOUT BIG BOOTS!

Chad Miller
(chadnsc)

Locale: Duluth, Minnesota
Re: ditch your big boots! on 03/17/2011 12:51:21 MDT Print View

Actually you've said that you enjoy hiking because you do it with a light pack. :P


He could also use lighter weight mids for shoes. That or he could do his own thing and as long as that's not bothering him have fun.

David Chenault
(DaveC) - BPL Staff - F

Locale: Crown of the Continent
ditch the boots on 03/17/2011 13:12:11 MDT Print View

I echo most of Mike's feedback, especially insofar as footwear is concerned. Changing shoes back and forth is such a hassle.

With your shelter and sleeping bag I think the space blanket is pretty pointless. And from a cal/oz standpoint Gu is a pretty inefficient source for food. Just bring one more Snickers.

I'd want a more substantial puffy layer, with a hood.

The trails in the Bechler area are mostly very well maintained and trodden. Gaiters are definitely optional.

You could ditch the Sublite for a tarp.

If you go in early August, you might want a headnet. The skeeters were still out in Yellowstone that time last year.

If you're going to the Bechler, I'd highly recommend some fly fishing gear. Excellent fishing.

Curtis B.
(rutilate) - MLife

Locale: New England
Re: August is magical! on 03/17/2011 19:54:39 MDT Print View

Thank you all for your time spent reviewing--this really helps!
Andrew:
I think I'm going to get a heavier hat just in case, the extra underwear is now gone, and the Reg NeoAir is in the bag.

Todd:
I hate having my arms on the ground, but as I think about it, I toss and turn and sleep on my side as well, so I never really use the full extent of the NeoAir regular. I wonder if I could even go smaller?

I forgot that the Keg doesn't do the multi-fuel. In the Teton's there weren't any fires allowed but that's not the case in Yellowstone. The 900ml pot is the smallest Sidewinder setup available that fits completely inside the pot--anything else and you need a caddy that adds unnecessary weight. I've wondered if they could make a Tyvek sleeve instead of the caddy.

I'll take a look at the CDT.


Mike C wrote:
>>Single-edge razor blade in paper sheath - You wrote this just to warm my heart!
You caught me! Actually it was your gear list I stole it from!


I love your ruthlessness with the gear lists. Brutal, but spot on the mark.

Regarding stuff sacks--I'm at 1.9 oz and my bag and clothing are dry, the rest I don't really care if it gets a bit wet, and I save .3 oz over a full-on trash compactor bag liner. Or is that flawed reasoning?

Just found the e+lite today--that is one of my next purchases.

The emergency kit container is the belt pack that contains all the crap I carry. It weighs too much and I'm hopeless when it comes to sewing what should be a really simple replacement...

Adding the bearspray back!

With the shoes, I just hate the thought of squishing around and blistering in soggy shoes. Ugh. Perhaps a topic in and of itself. Maybe I'll try it locally before committing fully this summer!

David:
Can you recommend a light headnet?
I'd love nothing more than to fish along the way and am certainly willing to release, but One of the things I've wrestled with is with alcohol stoves and titanium pots, how in the world can I cook fish?

Thank you all again for the recommendations!

Edited by rutilate on 03/17/2011 20:21:44 MDT.

Mike Clelland
(mikeclelland) - MLife

Locale: The Tetons (via Idaho)
DO NOT take boots! on 03/17/2011 22:05:32 MDT Print View

I teach ultra-light hiking, and I have for over 6 years. When I get to the first wet stream crossing, I just walk into the water, and invite EVERY team-member to walk in with me. We all stand in the water, and I explain how this simplifies EVERYTHING.

No body changes shoes, and everyone has wet nylon lightweight hikers.

Then, at the next crossing, everyone excitedly walks into the water, they learn to enjoy it.

The ONLY people who get bad blisters are people in BIG BOOTS. From my experience (and I'm serious) hiking in wet shoes is a PREVENTION TOOL as blister prevention.

And if it's raining, your feet will be wet anyway.

DO NOT take boots, DO NOT take river crossing slippers! You will LOVE IT!

-

Yes - Bear spray is no joke in yellowstone. Wear it in a holster at your hip.

I still dont't get what an "emergency kit container" is. Why can't you put your items in a ziploc baggie? (or, better yet, a USED ziploc baggie)

August has minimal bugs, don't worry. Take a head-net and you might use it at dusk. Maybe. It makes a nice stuff sack.

The full trash COMPACTOR bag makes everything VERY simple. It is much easier to get stuff in and out of your pack if nothing (except food and cook-gear) is in a stuff sack.

David Chenault
(DaveC) - BPL Staff - F

Locale: Crown of the Continent
nets, shoes, and fish on 03/18/2011 08:19:31 MDT Print View

Curtis, most of the sites in the Bechler region allow wood burning, some do not. Worth checking against your plan.

The shoe issue is psychological. Having wet feet really isn't a big deal.

The BPL headnet is excellent, but it is often out of stock. Sea to Summit makes a headnet that looks like it'd do just fine. REI sells it.

You can always cut fish into chunks, poach them, and then flake the meat out onto your rice, tortilla, etc. Or roast them over your fire on a stick or in foil w/ olive oil. The bearanoid worry that this will bring about undue ursine attention. I do it anyway, and the Bechler has the smallest GRIZ population of any part of Yellowstone.

You'll need a YNP fishing license, and to read the particular rules about catch and release in different drainages in the park.