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1 oz. grill
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Terry Boldt
(TeeDee) - F
Grill on 12/10/2006 15:28:28 MST Print View

Made 2 versions of the grill.

Both use the BPL TI rods cut in half. 20 12" rods for the grill.

For one used 12" of 6061-T6 AL, 0.5" OD, 0.035" wall thickness.

The other used 12" of 6061-T6 AL, 0.5 inch OD, 0.028" wall thickness.

The TI rods store in one AL tube. either the 0.035" or 0.028" wall depending on which I'm going to use. The later is the lightest of course. Using plastic end caps to seal end of storage tube. Would prefer an AL on end cap, but have been unable to find one to fit the 0.5" tubing.

With 2 0.035" wall tubes, the total weight comes in at about 3.5 oz for a 12" x 12" grill.

The grill is great - great idea.

Joshua Mitchell
(jdmitch) - F

Locale: Kansas
Use both size tubing? on 12/10/2006 18:54:49 MST Print View

TB... it seems to me you out to be able to find two similar bits of al tubing that would nest into each other if you looked...

Terry Boldt
(TeeDee) - F
nesting grill tubing on 12/11/2006 15:53:02 MST Print View

Most likely I could find a tube to nest inside the 0.5" OD tube. The only problem with that is the fact that the TI rods already fill the inside of the tube. Trying to get the rods into a smaller OD (and hence ID) AL tube that would fit inside the 0.5" OD tube, just will not work. The rods fill the inside of the 0.5" OD tube as it is. One reason for this is that I bent the rods approximately 3/16" from one end about 30 to 40 degrees. I did this so that one end of the rods would not slide through the AL tube. I found that trying to get all of the rods through one tube and then get them through the second tube takes patience and a lot of it as they tend to slide out of the first tube while working on the second tube. By bending one end of the rods, I don't have to worry about the rods sliding out of the first tube while getting them into the second tube. Hence setup is much, much quicker by this simple expedient. Now I understand why the Grilliput grill slots the rods into their tubes instead of sliding them through. Much simpler. Requires a lot more extensive machining though. If you look at the Grilliput specs, they use one tube with almost a 1" OD. They needed to do that so that the second, smaller tube that fits inside the larger tube, is also large enough for the rods to fit inside that tube. To get nesting tubes, I would have to do as Grilliput does and use a tube of probably about 0.85" OD. Then things start getting bigger and heavier. I think it better to just use the two 0.5" tubes and strap them together. Adds slightly to the bulk, but only slightly and keeps the weight down.

It would seem that there are some options here:

1. Do as Grilliput does and use a larger and smaller tube and retain the grill size. This option increase weight for a given grill size.
2. Do as in option 1, but decrease grill size. This cuts the weight since you are using fewer rods and can maybe use smaller OD tubes. What size grill do you need? I arbitrarily decided on 12" x 12" since the BPL rods are 24" and yield 12" when cut in half. Now that I have the grill in hand, I think that size ia about right for me and I would not want to decrease size.
3.Retain grill size and use 2 tubes of equal OD and strap together or just place in pack where convenient and not even bother with strapping them together. For given grill size, this option is lighter than either 1. or 2.

I have decided to use high temperature (tops out at 600F I believe) silicone rubber end caps. They are light, seal the ends of the tubes to capture the rods and are less expensive and lighter than AL end caps. Also, with the high temperature rating I may not have to remove while using and hence reduce the risk of losing the end caps. To practically eliminate the risk of loss, AL end caps would be best, but again heavier and more expensive. Also I'm not too sure that AL end caps would work since threading the thin wall AL tubes may not be practical.

Benjamin Tomsky
(btomsky) - F

Locale: San Francisco Bay Area
Re: 1 oz grill on 12/11/2006 18:11:25 MST Print View

Hey Terry, I experimented tonight and confirmed my suspicion that with my grill (8 rods evenly spaced over 5 inches), the Ti rods are easily capable of supporting the weight of a solo cookpot + 1 pint of water. The cookpot rested on 5 of the rods and bent them slightly. How's it work with your grill, given the rods are spaced a little further apart?

b d
(bdavis) - F

Locale: Mt. Lassen - Shasta, N. Cal.
Cookie cooling grill on 12/11/2006 19:03:43 MST Print View

I use a cheap, sold all over cookie cooling, metal "kitchen cooling rack" for a cooking grill over wood fires. It is a commercial product that is intended to cool cookies on. I cut off half, it is about 8" - 10" by 16" - 20" in the store. Cutting half off gives a square, works great in small stone ring fires. Weighs 2.5 oz. and is 5" x 10".

Update: Here is a picture of the grill, uncut w/ an MSR Titan Kettle on the upper quarter of the 10" x 10" grill, weighs 5 oz.cookie grill

Edited by bdavis on 12/16/2006 09:22:16 MST.

david fausnight
(rckjnky) - F
Titanium grill on 12/11/2006 20:01:18 MST Print View

Does anyone know if there are any health concerns about use titanium as a grill? Does it become more reactive when it is this hot?

Joshua Mitchell
(jdmitch) - F

Locale: Kansas
Ti Reactivity... on 12/11/2006 21:20:43 MST Print View

It's not reactive. It's just about the most chemically inert metal you can get.

Terry Boldt
(TeeDee) - F
Re: Cookie cooling grill on 12/12/2006 18:12:59 MST Print View

That is a good solution also.

One reason I went with the AL/TI grill is volume in the pack. 2 0.5" AL tubes are trival to insert in the pack. Just find a crevice and push. Putting in a square metal rack isn't nearly as easy and would require a lot more rearranging of items to get into the pack.

Weight isn't always my only concern - volume is also.

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
titanium spokes on 09/10/2009 20:31:45 MDT Print View

great thread :)

as BPL no longer sells the Ti rods I starting looking elsewhere- turns out most Ti bicycle spokes are 14 gauge which is equivalent to 1/16"

you can find them for ~ $2 a spoke w/ asst lengths

I've got a bunch of buddies that are archery hunters- I'm going to see if an aluminum arrow shaft might be a possibility for the frame portion- nesting would be nice, but two small aluminum tubes aren't going to be a problem to pack

I can smell the trout already!

Jason Klass
(jasonklass) - F

Locale: Parker, CO
Grill on 09/11/2009 08:38:07 MDT Print View

AWESOME design! I also have a Jam and a Stowaway so you picture of your pack looks just like mine. I use an Orvis CFO reel though.

Jared Cook
(rooinater) - F

Locale: Northwet
Re: titanium spokes on 09/11/2009 12:34:03 MDT Print View

definitely would like to hear any updates with arrow shaft experimentation and the Ti bike spokes. What's the chemical make up of the spokes though? Similar to the cookpots or a different alloy?

/A .
(biointegra) - MLife

Locale: Puget Sound
Re: Grill on 09/11/2009 14:56:12 MDT Print View

I wonder about drilling holes in two AL/Ti trekking poles sections for side tubes. Obviously you'd have to clean off any paint or graphic superfluity before grilling. Most poles are already multi-use, but many shelter set-ups only require one, leaving the other free for...grilling perhaps.

I've also been curious about making + trying out some longer versions (~8" instead of 4") of the ultra-thin 1 or 2g Ti Skewer stakes. You could potentially use these for the cross supports and presumably functional stakes, if a more stout nail-style stake was used to "pre-drill" in harder ground.

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
ti spokes on 09/11/2009 20:00:57 MDT Print View

not sure the composition- I did order the "raw" ones- they have painted ones which wouldn't be a great choice (the paint might burn quickly off though?)

I thought about stakes as well- I found some 12" ones, but they are quite a bit heavier than the spokes (larger gauge)- of course you could subtract some weight from the ones your already carrying- so that's definitely a viable option

the trekking pole idea has merit as well- carbon fiber wouldn't work so well :) but aluminum or Ti sure would

I was thinking the spokes could also do double duty for a wind screen setup

Josh Leavitt
(Joshleavitt) - F

Locale: Ruta Locura
1oz grill on 09/11/2009 21:15:50 MDT Print View

Bike spokes are not going to be the same alloy as Ti pots. The pots are CP grades 1 through 4 and the spokes are going to be alloyed with aluminum and vanadium, grades 5+. If you use the Ti spokes, they can become brittle, and possibly break if exposed to direct flames and or hot coals repeatedly. If you cook "over" the coals, and avoid excessive heat, this should not be too much of a problem though.

My grill, 1.5oz, 4"X10", welded CP wire.


Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
nice grill on 09/11/2009 21:55:32 MDT Print View

what exactly is cp? gauge? source?

nice looking grill :)

the spokes are grade 5 6A1-4V- I think this is the same as the BPL rods- can't find the link for it now

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
aluminum arrow update on 09/16/2009 18:37:31 MDT Print View

the aluminum arrow works quite nicely- I cut two 12" pieces and drilled holes for the ti spokes- w/ eight 9.5" spokes and the two arrow pieces it's right at 1.4 oz, the ti spokes are ~ 2.5 grams each, 12" section of aluminum arrow shaft is ~ 9 grams

the aluminum arrow shafts are a thin walled aluminum ~ .020" and ~ .35" in diameter- all eight ti rods fit into one arrow shaft

while I'm satisfied w/ the grill I think I may have stumbled onto something better- I was poking around my local Ace Hardware store and they had 12" sections of aluminum tubing- I bought two 1/4" pieces (also thin walled .014) they weigh 5 grams each. each 1/4" rod easily holds four Ti spokes- this grill would weigh ~ 1.1 oz

what I found is all of their aluminum tubing fits into the next size up- they didn't have any 9/32" tube in, but ordered some more- what I'm thinking is also getting some 5/16" (it's the largest they make in the tin wall). if the eight rods would happen to fit into the 9/32" tube, then I could slide it into the 5/16" one and have everything in a single tube- this would weigh a little more, but by calculations just a tenth or two of an oz

the aluminum tubing is easily sourced- it's found at many hardware stores and made by K&S Engineering- they hardware and hobby stores pre-setup displays w/ different tubing, metal sheeting, etc

it's also readily had online- just google K&S aluminum tubing and you'll come up w/ 100's of hits

also they carry (in the same K&S display) very small aluminum tubing- again in 12" lengths- 1/16"- possibly smaller- cheaper than Ti rod or spokes- and appears to be very light- not sure on strength though- they also sell 1/16" aluminum rod- would the tubing possibly be stronger than the same diameter rod?

todd h
(funnymoney) - MLife

Locale: SE
Re: aluminum arrow update on 09/16/2009 19:37:23 MDT Print View

Thanks Mike. I'm gonna make onefor next yr's trip out West.

Jesse H.
(tacedeous) - MLife

Locale: East Bay, CA
Re: 1 oz. grill on 09/21/2009 01:47:36 MDT Print View

That's awesome! I've gotta make one of these...

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
Re: Re: aluminum arrow update on 09/21/2009 19:33:02 MDT Print View

another short update:

I just got a 12" 9/32" aluminum tube, it will hold 7 of the Ti spokes (rather tightly), but not the 8th

they carry 5/16" thin wall (it only comes in 3' sections)- I can either use a 9/32" nested into a 5/16" tube w/ seven spokes OR store the 5/16" tube in the aluminum arrow shaft (11/32") w/ all eight spokes

either way I'll order a section of the 5/16" tube (only $3.50 at ACE)

Mike M
(mtwarden) - MLife

Locale: Montana
finally on 09/27/2009 14:58:45 MDT Print View

well finally got everything together :)

the arrow section worked perfectly as the outer piece w/ the 5/16" section

the 5/16" stores all eight ti rods

had to cut the inner (5/16") section a little shorter to make room for the nylon end caps

weighs in at exactly 1.5 oz

assembled w/ remaining arrow (I mistakenly thought that the camo was paint and wanted it removed- turns out it was anodizing which I should have just left as it was a big pita removing it!)




on the scale