If you carry a plb I’d like to know where you have it while hiking?

I’m thinking of using a “holster” kind of thing to carry a plb while solo hiking this summer/fall. Most of the route will be cross country in the high sierra.

Some concerns are if its in my pack and hit the fan, say while crossing a river and I end up loosing my pack, a plb wont do me much good at that point.

Also I’d like to hear what else you carry on yourself for just that instance. (lighter, compass, knife)

I have a McMurdo FastFind.

When I'm out solo I have it on my right pack strap, just below my collar bone, in a slip case that has a velcro closure over the top. I can get it out easily with just my left hand.

It is there for just the scenario you imagined. On a dark:thirty stream crossing I slipped, fell, and for a moment was wedged between two good sized rocks, with my left side and hipbelt pocket under water. I got away with only a well scraped shin and some wet parts, but was otherwise ok. So it was a cheap "lesson learned".

All my other gear is buried in my pack.

I use a front pack and that is where the PLB stays.

I figure I can reach it if I'm conscious, even if I'm hurt badly.

Say during a major river crossing, most people would argue that you should have your pack's waist belt unbuckled because if you end up in the river your pack could weight you down perhaps preventing you from being able to reach the shore. So if your plb is in your pack and you had to ditch it to prevent drowning you now have no gear and no plb. As I read through survival stories many people end up with out their packs/gear and now must make do with what ever they have in their pockets and the knowledge in their head. Doesn’t it make sense that a tool that is designed to initiate rescue to be carried on one’s self? Am I missing something?

What good is PLB going to do you if you end up like my brother and slip and fall by accident into fast moving river and end up side down with your foot wedged between to large boulders with your head under water. If I was not for me being there and I dove in to the water dislodged his foot he would have drowned. The only thing PLB be would good for is so search and rescue can find your dead body.

I really think electronics like PLB, GPS,Cell phones are making more and more people stupid. Who lack the wilderness skills and training to be out in the wild who do stupid costly things they see on TV,movies, you tube and read about.
Any action sport has it risk and you need to know the risks involved and accept the risk or should not be out there doing it. IMHO

My favorite quote from Clint Eastwood from Dirty Harry 2 quote to live by is “A man's gotta know his limitations.” a good motto to live by in life and in the wild.

Edited by socal-nomad on 02/11/2011 12:03:40 MST.

Both logic and common sense dictate that all "survival" and most "emergency" gear should never leave your person while you are awake.

The finest equipment is utterly useless if you can't get to it when you need it.

and has been pointed out earlier, knowledge, skill, and experience each weigh nothing.

Terry,

I agree a plb wouldn’t do you any good if ‘end up side down with your foot wedged between to large boulders with your head under water’, luckily he had you save his butt. The reasoning behind my question was because I will be solo, so no one besides myself to help, and if I had to ditch my pack in the event of an unplanned swim having a plb in a pocket would then allow me send for help if self rescue was not an option.

As far as electronics go I don’t carry a GPS or Cell phone. The reasoning for bringing a plb is I will be hiking solo from Sept 1st to mid October north bound from the Whitney area to Lake Tahoe and most of this will be cross country following routes similar to Ropers HSR. I would also agree that many people start relying electronics’ to navigate for them and perhaps aren’t as familiar with map and compass as they should be.

‘Who lack the wilderness skills and training to be out in the wild who do stupid costly things they see on TV,movies, you tube and read about.’
I’m not sure if this is directed at me, but just like you brothers slip, anytime anywhere to anyone any skill level, accidents happen…yes you can take precautionary measures to help prevent accidents but $#!? happens.

‘Any action sport has it risk and you need to know the risks involved and accept the risk or should not be out there doing it.
I would think that most people on this board understand this including I. Sorry for stirring up the pot of emotions on this one.

I started this thread in an attempt to find out where other hikers are carrying a plb and the reasoning behind it.
I’m thankful to have a resource as valuable as BPL and look forward to hearing from more posters on this topic.

Joel,
This was not a hit piece at you just in general people have lost the knowledge how to do a simple thing like orienting and topo map reading have become to reliant on electronic aids like GPS.

Some people they can't find their way to a store in the next city over. Because they don't know how to read a map anymore because of electronic aids in their cars. Our kids can't find their way around town because their so plugged in to gameboys and video watching in cars these days instead of watching the view and learning where the road and place they are going to. They are not taught how to read simple paper road maps. Novice hiker have done the same thing depending on electronic aids.

The older I get my limitations have gotten less adventurous and personally I would stay on the trail I do a lot of solo hiking and backpacking.

I think for your trip you should carry your PLB in some thing like a waterproof passport wallet or design a harness that fits around your neck and chest that fits under your shirt to carry the PLB in small pelican case.
Since your doing water crossings Also I think I would buy the mountain laurel "the thing" as a make shift flotation device as backup if you need it in emergency if the river crossing goes wrong.
http://www.mountainlaureldesigns.com/shop/product_info.php?cPath=37&products_id=141

What I would do:
The larger river crossings send your pack wrapped in your sleeping pad and in a inflated dry bag with cord attached to the dry bag till it reaches the other side. So you don''t have your pack weigh you down in deep and rough water.

I wish you a safe trip it sound like fun I have backpacked in some the area you will cross in your journey it is beautiful country.
Terry

"This was not a hit piece at you just in general people..."

And a pretty good hijack.

Now, "How do you carry?..."

Some backpackers use trousers that have large cargo pockets on the thighs. Maybe that wouldn't be such a bad place to stick the critical electronics.

Some of us old fogies are glad that we had to learn traditional land navigation way back in the old days. You can go a long way with a map, a compass, and the sun.

I generally carry a GPS receiver, and I hardly ever turn it on except during bad visibility.

--B.G.--

I carry my SPOT in my pack because I don't worry about things too much.

Spot because my wife makes me, especially solo. Just a piece of mind thing for her.

For those that travel offtrail in the Sierra's you know how crossing a Col and be dangerous at times. Scree, talus, snow, etc. I just want to also have the ability to be safe. Though the best way to be safe is using your brain.


Ohh and mine is tucked away somewhere in my pack. Maybe not the best place??

Edited by kennyhel77 on 02/11/2011 18:26:34 MST.

"I carry my SPOT in my pack because I don't worry about things too much."

Same idea for me. My McMurdo Fastfind is in the bottom of the right side pocket of my Ohm. That will suffice for just about any contingency I can imagine. Like Jack said, "I don't worry about things too much". If I did come to a heinous stream crossing or other situation where I might be separated from my pack, I might reconsider and put it on my person. OTOH, I might choose to look for a less heinous place to cross said stream, or even turn back. A PLB doesn't do you much good if you're dead.

I've never carried a plb but I would suggest that if possible attach a neck lanyard to use when water crossings will be required. If you end up needing to ditch your pack the plb stays with you. Hey you'll be wet and have no gear or food but SAR will no where to look for your ..., look for you. :)

This gets kind of complicated, because you have to imagine the most statistically plausible ways of getting killed, and then figure out how the PLB will help you.

One pretty plausible way of getting killed is at a stream crossing. You drown. I don't really see how a PLB helps you here.

Another pretty high-probability scenario is slipping on ice, sliding down a steep slope, and getting major injuries. Here you have a pretty high chance of being instantly dead, but I think there's also a pretty good chance of getting injured badly enough that you can't hike out, but you're still able to stay alive for several days or a week. I think this is a good example of how a PLB could be helpful.

Another way people die is that they're crossing a high pass, it's getting late in the day, and a storm comes in. They die of hypothermia. I don't think a PLB helps here.

the fatality rate as a % of SAR incidents is very low in general ... even YOSAR during the 10 year 1990-1999 period had a fatality rate of < 5% ... and that includes all those dirtbag climbers going up el capitan ...

the most common issues in yosemite were ...





different parks have different issues naturally ... but overall i think its safe to say that most SAR incidents could be speeded up by a PLB or similar device ... saves time and money, and reduces the risk to responders ....

im sure someone can go research the numbers for other areas ... i, however, am busy researching hawt girls on TV ;)

"and that includes all those dirtbag climbers going up el capitan ..."

Another old story. I was walking around on the top of El Capitan one evening, and I was camped about a mile away. As I am standing there near the edge, these two dirtbag climbers came dragging up from the face. They each had huge haul bags, I am guessing 70 pounds each. One guy's hand was all gashed open with dried blood all over him.

I'm kind of standing there and staring, and they dragged up and slumped down on the ground to talk. They hadn't talked to anybody for five or six days that they had been on the face. The one guy had cut his own hand with his own knife, and it was so bad that explained why they were a day or two late to top out. All of my first aid kit was back in my camp, so I couldn't offer them anything except for clean water. It was about 8:30 p.m.

Then they asked me which way the trail was to head back down into Yosemite Valley. I pointed them in the right direction [What if I hadn't been there?] and told them where they would find the next stream that way. The guy with the cut hand felt like he had an infection going in the cut hand, so his buddy got to carry more than the lion's share of the heavy haul bags. I couldn't figure out where they were heading to by starting at that hour of the evening. They said that they had to hoof it down to the Valley that night, because their ride home was leaving there first thing in the morning.

I asked them if they had headlamps. They said they did, but that they had used up the batteries while on the face. So, off they went.

Dirtbag climbers shooting for the Darwin Award?

--B.G.--

I want to apologies to you all for Hijack of the thread or hit. I had a family member back about a few months ago get in a really bad traffic accident. Because she did not know how to get back home from a place she drove too was using a GPS for navigation hit a center divider at full speed on a freeway.

I am truly sorry I made my fears of a electronic aided dependent navigation society out on Joel thread.
I should have made my own thread on the subject in a different section of the board.
Sorry agian,
Terry

Attach things around my neck when I'm about to do significant water crossings? No thanks.

if the water is deep enough that you are thinking about taking off the hip belt, it is deep enough to strap your t-rest around your chest so that when you go for a nice swim, the volume of the pack (which floats with a vengence) will not roll you head under water (and it can keep it there)
one might consider that having the belt in place keeps the pack up higher, and thusly extends the depth one can ford before it's bouyantcy unloads the weight off your feet.

it's just a thought.
your mileage may vary.

cheers,
v.