i found this rather amuzing, hope you will too.

from "A complete guide to hiking and backpacking in missouri, 1974"

in the section about clothing
"The use of layers of clothing allows the hiker to adjust to intermediate temperature ranges rather than just cold or warm. Cotton t-shirts, cotton turtle necked shirts, thermal underwear shirts, vests, sleeveless sweaters, sweaters and windbreakers make excellent combinations."

then-

"Long underwear pants are not necessary unless the temperature is below freezing. Trousers should be loose enough for you to lift your legs for climbing. Loose pants are usually warmer in winter and cooler in summer, since they allow air space which acts as a good thermal insulator. Baggy cotton pants are probably the most functional, but blue jeans rate a close second as they are much more fashionable on the trail. Bib overalls are a good compromise as they are loose fitting and rugged, and the many pockets are quite useful."

so....look for me out on the trail, I'll be the one with the cotton turtleneck, sleeveless sweater, and bib overalls.

>but blue jeans rate a close second as they are much more fashionable on the trail.

I'll be the one with a new pair of Armani blue jeans. Gotta look good on the trail!

Can't defend the comment on fashion...
But there weren't as many fabric choices in '74 as there are now.
I generally wore cotton in summer and wool/down in winter.

amazing that all those old geezers didnt go kaput the moment they wore cotton ...

or maybe it aint so much the gear that makes the difference, but the person

what a horrifying though !!! .... tell me it ain't so .... i have my dead bird and patagucci and my spot .... i MUST be prepared for the wild outdoors?

Back in '74 when I was still a novice backpacker in cool weather I wore a cotton string vest with a thin lambswool sweater over it and then, as necessary, a wool/acrylic shirt, a thick wool sweater, a double layer cotton windproof and a neoprene coated waterproof jacket (kept out all water, kept in all condensation). In warm weather I wore a cotton T-shirt. On my legs I wore cotton whipcord breeches in summer and Tweed breeches the rest of the year.

However in '78 when I did my first long distance walk (1250 miles from Land's End to John O'Groats) I had a synthetic base layer (Damart), a pile jacket (Helly Hansen), a polyester-cotton windproof jacket (Rohan Pampas), stretch nylon breeches (Rohan Striders - essentially softshell) and Gore-Tex rain jacket and trousers (Berghaus). That was a spring walk.

"amazing that all those old geezers didnt go kaput the moment they wore cotton ..."

Good one Eric!

As mentioned above, there weren't a lot of options available in 1974. The techniques were the same as today though... as long as you were warm, the wet cotton wasn't an issue. You just carried more weight because you had to have a spare set of clothes. You always had to allow for the fact that the wet stuff wouldn't dry out for quite a while and "wearing it dry" was just a bit more painful than it is with quick-dry gear we have today.

I also think that our expectations were lower than they are today. I knew my tent would leak, I knew I'd be hiking wet and I knew my pack would be heavy.

Edited by skopeo on 12/06/2010 13:54:38 MST.

I wore Eddie Bauer wool fishnet long johns for Nordic ski patrolling in NW Pennsylvania. Best choice at that time for high activity winter sports.

That quote was way out of date in 1974! Whoever wrote it was stuck back about 1950.

In 1974 most jeans (at least those I bought for my children) and slacks (for myself and hubby) were cotton/polyester blend, usually 60% polyester, which dried far. far faster than standard cotton jeans, almost as fast as 100% polyester. Most shirts were also 60/40 polyester cotton blend. (They didn't have to be ironed, which for me was a Godsend.) There were also a lot of polyester and acrylic knits around then, although not exactly wicking. These fabrics were cheaper than cotton or wool, too! In 1974 I was buying and laundering clothing for two teenage boys, a grade-school boy and a pre-school girl on a very low budget because hubby was unemployed. Our tents and sleeping bag shells were nylon, although not lightweight like we have today. Our whole family was very active outdoors, and nobody was allowed to wear all-cotton anything.

Edited by hikinggranny on 12/06/2010 15:00:58 MST.

"I knew my tent would leak, I knew I'd be hiking wet and I knew my pack would be heavy"

The last was partly true for me but not the first two. In 1974 I had a Robert Saunders two skin nylon tent that was just as waterproof as any tent today. It weighed 4.5lbs and was designed for 2 people (I've always liked roomy shelters). I only hiked wet in continuous heavy rain when condensation began to soak back through my inner layers. Rain jackets were 100% waterproof but not breathable.

Loads didn't have to be heavy. 1974 was the year that Hamish Brown did the first continous walk over all the 3,000' Munros in the wet and windy Scottish Highlands (his book on this walk, Hamish's Mountain Walk, is one of the best backpacking stories I have read). He was out for 112 days and hiked 1640 miles. He had a single skin tent with tray groundsheet attached with elastic tabs so condensation could run into the ground that weighed "a bit over 3lbs" and a pack with no frame, padding, hipbelt or pockets. His average pack weight with food was 23lbs. Only twice did it exceed 30lbs and that was with over 6 days food and fuel.

>> His average pack weight with food was 23lbs <<

Chris - I'd be interested to hear what clothing Hamish was carrying that allowed him to pack so light. As discussed in this thread, there wasn't much to choose from back then.

The rain gear I used was 100% waterproof/non-breathable as well, which is why I travelled wet all the time. Unless it was absolutely pouring rain, I wouldn't use my rain gear (too clammy)... which when you consider the dense vegetation in the areas I hike, you get wet.

Interestingly, we did have ponchos that were very light weight and waterproof but they weren't much use in the windy/rainy weather as the design was pretty basic.

Edited by skopeo on 12/06/2010 16:14:56 MST.

Mike, Hamish had a "long-sleeved Damart vest which doubled as a pullover" (Damart was a wicking synthetic), "plus a good shirt with sleeves long enough to cover hands in place of gloves" (Hamish doesn't say but I guess the shirt was cotton), "non-nylon underpants and flannels did the nether regions" (the flannel trousers were probably a wool mix, "when hot the trousers rolled up, otherwise they tucked into good, soft wool stockings". "Waterproofs: I started with my ordinary set till I realised how heavy they were, so soon swapped to lightweight ones". These would be non-breathable PU coated jacket and pants. "Spare clothes were a Shetland wool pullover; a sun/rain hat; long johns to start" (the walk was from early April to July), then nylon swimming shorts; and a pair of thin nylon socks - the last purely for decency in hotels when the stocking were hanging out the window drying".

Hamish doesn't give the weight of any clothing.

Because rain gear was non-breathable I only wore it when raining steadily. In windy or showery weather I wore a cotton windproof, a garment Hamish omitted. Of course wool clothing did absorb some of the condensation when rain gear was worn. The Scottish hills are open with little in the way of dense vegetation so you don't get wet pushing through it (I got soaked many times in wet vegetation on the PNT last summer) but the climate is wet so you are often walking in rain and wet mist.

Edited by Christownsend on 12/06/2010 16:34:51 MST.

hey, i was born in '74. maybe it was dads bib overalls & turtleneck sweater that caught mums eye on the trail. next thing you knows, hes cooking her up a dehydrated breakfast... i dont think i want to know.

its probably cuben tarps & carbon hiking poles these days that help to pull when you're on the trail, who knows?

Chris,

Your book was one of my inspirations when I started. I was seven years old in 1974 so I don't remember my pack weight at that time.

I still use cotton though. I've yet to shrivel up and die simply because I've packed a pair of cotton sweats for camp warmth or because I have a cotton t-shirt.

Kevin, glad to hear my book was of use!

I don't use cotton anymore and haven't for years except when something cotton comes in for test. The last item was a Ventile cotton smock with a Paramo style liner. It was waterproof but heavy compared to Paramo.

Chris,

It was more than of use. I think it was the Yukon trip that I read first and after that I was planning a long hike.

You have cost me a lot of money and productivity but have increased my quality of life so I guess it all balances out on the scale.

Wow this is making me feel very nostalgic. I still have a Robert Saunders backpacker GC2 plus out in the garage. It was a great tent. I converted the fly into my first tarp.

Rohan used to be a very innovative company and I still have two of their poly cotton wind proofs. My favourites were the Rohan Super Strider breeches, as the soft shell fabric was excellent in cold, wet weather. I had to replace them with some from Craghoppers which were hopeless.

It was certainly possible to travel quite light back in the day. In fact a lot of stuff just seemed to get heavier for no real benefit.

Chris has also be a great source of advice and inspiration to me over the years.