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7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt
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Michael Davis
(mad777) - F

Locale: South Florida
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-etc on 08/29/2006 13:58:47 MDT Print View

Bill,
The bear protection idea has got to work. It made me howl!

Ryan Jordan
(ryan) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Greater Yellowstone
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-etc on 08/29/2006 14:15:35 MDT Print View

Just an FYI - we will have some PGD overruns from our Spring 07 production runs of Cocoons. My guess is that it will be available this fall for everyone's MYOG winter projects :)

Christopher Plesko
(Pivvay) - F

Locale: Rocky Mountains
Re: Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-etc on 08/29/2006 15:52:24 MDT Print View

Figured that was the case. I was sort of planning on it for at least my hood if not stockpiling some for future projects...

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/29/2006 23:22:08 MDT Print View

I have settled on a prototype for my first real quilt. I even slept in it last night to see if it was going to be large enough. It fits OK and is about as small as I think would work for my size.





I even got out my Pertex Quantum and box of Polarguard Delta.



I had thought about dying the silk I am using for the liner but I think I will leave it white.

If I can stay focused on the quilt tomorrow I should get most or maybe all of it done.

Mark Larson
(mlarson) - MLife

Locale: Southeast USA
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/29/2006 23:48:34 MDT Print View

Nice, Bill. I like that you kept the small triangular portions at the base of the closures under your body. I'm not sure if those closures you're planning are snaps or velcro or what. I think those triangular bases should spread out the stress a bit better and perhaps be easier to manipulate at night. Thanks for the pics.

-Mark

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 01:21:25 MDT Print View

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the comments.

As for the triangular base things, yes I hope and how about when I wear the quilt as a garment?

If this works where do I count the weight?


Einstein X
(EinsteinX) - F

Locale: The Netherlands
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 02:19:42 MDT Print View

Bill,

Maybe you should call this your "skin-out-weight-only" hike instead of crazy light. Since you'll be waring most or all your gear all you need is add some pocket for some misc. items and off you go.

Good luck and i'll keep reading your amazing posts.

Eins

john Tier
(Peter_pan) - M

Locale: Co-Owner Jacks 'R' Better, LLC, VA
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 05:55:57 MDT Print View

BIll,

Like the look...seem as minimal as possible....How do you plan to close the "No Sniveller" style head hole...Recommend Omni tape over regular velcro...Holds great...less scratchy...won't pick up lint etc like the regular stuff...you can find it in sewing stores in 3/4 inch thickness... It will be called No Snag velcro and cost about $5 for a 36 inch length....Be sure to triple sew the ends as any velcro has a way of coming loose from one pass of regular stitching.

Pan

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 07:33:19 MDT Print View

Oh Jack,

To imply that every hole cut in a piece of fabric to allow your head to go through it is a "no sniveller" style head hole is a bit to much. Ponchos have been around longer than you have.

The rest of your comments bag to insult my intelligences.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 08:14:48 MDT Print View

Einstein X

This is a follow-up on a few ideas from several years ago. How to use a "Great Kilt" as a start point for several different things used for hiking. Those ideas and drawings have been waiting a long time for the right time and place to get made.

Since we divide what we "wear" from what we "pack" the fastest way to drop weight is to be able to "wear it" during the day and use it in a different form "at night". From the first piece of gear I made I have tried find a way to use it for more than one thing. I have talked for several years about moving my insulation from one item to another to save weight. I did this first with my home made Poly-Tube Down Air Mattress (DAM). I packed my Down in silk tubes that I refer to as baffles and could slide them in and out of the Poly-Tubes. That way I could use the Down baffles in other things when they were not being used for my DAM.

This is not an attempt to play games with weight as for a sub (what-ever) gear list, just a way to make every ounce count. We do divide our weight into different categories and I will list things that can be worn as just that. Most people don't sleep naked so some clothing is used to help keep us warm at night anyway.

And it is fun to push the envelop.

Daniel Goldenberg
(dag4643)

Locale: Pacific Northwet
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 08:41:19 MDT Print View

Hi Bill,

I've been enjoying seeing the pictures of your creations. I'm a quilt user myself and like your design, it looks very clever, especially its multi use aspect.

1. What is the width of your quilt?

2. I notice you are using some kind of white ribbon in place of cord at the head and foot ends. I think I recall seeing you use something similar in place of guylines for shelters. Are these possibly from cuben material? They appear like they are very light.

Cheers

Dan

john Tier
(Peter_pan) - M

Locale: Co-Owner Jacks 'R' Better, LLC, VA
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 09:37:08 MDT Print View

Bill,

No intent to insult...In fact, I believe you to be among the most, if not the most, forward thinking of the gear creators working on ultralight ideas.

While serapes have certainly been around for centuries, I don't know of an insulated quilt or bag that incorporated the resealable head hole in the middle before the No Sniveller... Which, FTR, was a design request by Sgt Rock in a survey on under qulit designs almost 3 years ago on Whiteblaze.net.

Also while I recognise that you are probably fully aware of the nomenclature, location and costs of "no snag velcro", I am also aware that frequently this forum generates second and third order questions by monitoring readers on the sounces, cost etc. This data was include for general info as I've found that it heads off extra questions/posts.

Good luck on your project...it is interesting work

Pan

Michael Davis
(mad777) - F

Locale: South Florida
Re: Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 11:16:02 MDT Print View

Jack,

Speaking as one who is just getting his feet wet in MYOG, I for one, appreciate any and all details on materials that are effective as well as where to procure them.

While we may address our posts to a particular person, sometimes for clarity of following "branching" threads, this is a public forum and I view it as an open classroom where I am being educated!

Thanks for including the details.

Also, your JRB inovations have made me a happier camper.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 12:19:52 MDT Print View

Daniel asked:
Q - 1. What is the width of your quilt?

Q - 2. I notice you are using some kind of white ribbon in place of cord at the head and foot ends.

Hi Daniel:
A - 1. I don't have a CAD program but I really like what they are doing on the Tarp Design Thread. This might work.


A 18" B 18" C

10"

D 20" E 20" F

24"

G 24" H 24" I

38"

J 17" K 17" L

This didn't work very well. The 10" needs to be under "B". The 24" needs to be under "E". The number 38" needs to be under "H".

B to E to H to K is the Quilt center line and 72" total.

A - 2. The white cord you see is a shoe lace that I used for the Prototype. The real Quilt will be some kind of light cord. I have a bunch of different kinds and will pick what ever is lightest and the color goes with the Gold-Yellow of the Pertex Quantum.

Edited by bfornshell on 08/30/2006 12:24:19 MDT.

mark henley
(flash582) - F
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 15:14:19 MDT Print View

You mean something like this?blanket

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-the fun begins on 08/30/2006 17:41:54 MDT Print View

Mark, Thanks but in looking at your work I see that I listed one or more? numbers wrong. I did this drawing and scanned it.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-Cutting "My Precious" on 08/30/2006 17:49:20 MDT Print View

Cutting "My Precious" :

Well that part went easy.



Brian Emanuel
(bemanuel) - F
Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-etc on 08/30/2006 19:45:27 MDT Print View

Very interesting thread regarding Climashield XP and Polarguard Delta. I am the Sales Director for both Polarguard and Climashield. Beyond a doubt XP is lighter than Delta. Standard testing protocol for basis weight is to weigh a piece 36" x 36". This weight in ounces gives the ounces per square yard of the batting. Regarding temperature ratings, for a given ounce per square yard XP will have a better temperature rating than Delta (~7%). The advantage is you can get a given temperature rating at a lower weight with XP versus Delta. However, Delta will have a higher loft than XP for a given basis weight. We could discuss theory throughout eternity in regards to the impact of loft on temperature rating. Bottom line is that this is a multi-variant optimization in terms of thermodynamic mechanisms (conductive, convective and radiative heat transfer mechanisms). Also, the true temperature rating is highly contingent upon bag/quilt/garment construction as well as shell and lining materials. There's a lot of science involved but it's still mainly an art. Both products, XP and Delta, are exceptional synthetic insualations and from my perspective the best two on the market today. Both are continuous filament so the durability is unsurpassed and even after numerous uses, launderings or prolonged storage they will recover and perform as well as the first time! If you are looking for ultralight weight synthetics we are currently working on a new product, Climashield Combat, that will become available in weights as low as 2.0 ounces per square yard. Good luck with all your efforts!

Sam Haraldson
(sharalds) - MLife

Locale: Gallatin Range
Re: Re: 7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt-etc on 08/30/2006 19:57:17 MDT Print View

An insulating fabric weighing in at 2 oz/sq.yd. could bring quilts down into the sub 6 oz. range.

And we heard it straight from the horses mouth. It's good to know we represent a slice of the community worthy of personal announcements and descriptions of a product from the (major) manufacturers themselves. The cottage manufactures walk amongst us daily of course.

Bill Fornshell
(bfornshell) - MLife

Locale: Southern Texas
7 ounce Polarguard-Delta Quilt on 08/30/2006 20:58:18 MDT Print View

It sure was nice seeing Brian's comments. I have talked to Brian on the phone several times. He was very nice and took a lot of his time explaining the merits of both types of insulation. I hope to make a number of insulated items out of both the PG-Delta and the Climashield XP.

The best part of all this is that Climashield XP is available in amounts of a yard or more from Thru-Hiker.com. It also is nice to see that Ryan thinks he will have some Polarguard Delta available for MYOG folks this fall.