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Tom Kirchner
(ouzel) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest/Sierra
Proposal for new forum on 10/29/2010 20:19:24 MDT Print View

This thread comes out of a discussion of the recent rescue of a woman lost near Ingalls Lake. Eric Chan suggested it would be useful to have a forum devoted specifically to discussing mishaps, accidents and other unfortunate situations that occur to hikers and backpackers. The idea would be to use the incidents as an opportunity to learn and reexamine our own hiking/backpacking practices in order to increase our margin of safety and minimize situations where we inadvertantly put others at risk, be it our companions or SAR personnel.

Anybody else think this is an idea worth pursuing with BPL staff?

Tim Cheek
(hikerfan4sure) - MLife
Proposal for new forum on 10/30/2010 10:25:48 MDT Print View

Yes, I'd agree.

eric chan
(bearbreeder) - F - M
thirded on 11/04/2010 14:43:40 MDT Print View

it would be useful to figure out what not to do ... just like climbing incident reports

of at least make those choices conscious of the risks

just get rid of the outdoor retailer 2005 forum ;)

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 15:17:19 MDT Print View

How would that help BPL at the bottom line?

BPL is obviously under financial stress right now (judging from product stocking). Adding another forum would just cost more.

--B.G.--

Ike Mouser
(isaac.mouser) - F
financial stress on 11/04/2010 15:25:48 MDT Print View

I dont know if they are under financial stress or not, but we shouldn"t assume they are because of product stocking. I seen them out of stock on alot of things for a LONG time now. Wouldn"t it be just a few hundred megs of space? ITs just text and the occasional image upload.

Edited by isaac.mouser on 11/04/2010 15:27:15 MDT.

Brian Senez
(bsenez) - MLife

Locale: New England
re: accident focused forum on 11/04/2010 15:29:46 MDT Print View

Have you seen this site: http://www.hikerhell.com/ it is focused on mistakes and analyzes them a little bit. The yearly publication 'Accidents in North American Mountaineering' is always a good read also.

Tom Kirchner
(ouzel) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest/Sierra
Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 16:17:47 MDT Print View

"Adding another forum would just cost more."

???

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 16:41:57 MDT Print View

Adding another forum would just cost BPL more money.

All web resources cost money. They cost machine cycles on the server. They cost coder salary. Storage costs money.

--B.G.--

Tom Kirchner
(ouzel) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest/Sierra
Re: Re: Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 16:50:28 MDT Print View

"All web resources cost money. They cost machine cycles on the server. They cost coder salary. Storage costs money."

Any idea how much money you think we're talking about here, Bob? I can say with a fair degree of certainty that machine cycles are a nit for any low volume commercial application; we're not simulating a nuclear explosion here. Similarly, storage is pretty darn cheap these days. So that leaves us with one time coder salary, probably using a standard forum design app. If BPL is running so close to the bone that they couldn't afford to add another forum to the website, I truly feel sorry for all you Mlifer's out there.

Would BPL staff care to comment on the affordability of adding a forum, thereby laying this particular objection to rest or validating it?

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 17:02:48 MDT Print View

Make them a deal they can't refuse.

Explain to BPL how this will aid its bottom line.

--B.G.--

Eric Lundquist
(cobberman) - F - M

Locale: Northern Colorado
Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 17:06:34 MDT Print View

I'm not sure that such a forum would specifically benefit the growth of their user base or paying members. The information would be useful, but as others have said, this information is already available elsewhere. I would rather have BPL concentrate their efforts on bringing quality information directly pertaining to lightweight/ultralight backpacking. Maybe the staff could get some input from SAR personnel and put together a series of articles about safety and some essential or recommended gear for the "surprise overnighter".

As for the rumor of BPL having financial difficulties as a result of items not being in stock, wouldn't they then begin pre-selling items until they were able to make the large purchase order with their suppliers?

Nick Gatel
(ngatel) - MLife

Locale: Southern California
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 17:50:28 MDT Print View

g bob,

u sund lik 1 dum dern capitolist tipes :).

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 18:07:00 MDT Print View

I'm much more the capitalistic type than the capitolistic type.

--B.G.--

Tom Kirchner
(ouzel) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest/Sierra
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 19:09:41 MDT Print View

"u sund lik 1 dum dern capitolist tipes"
wuz dat tipe or tripe? :-]

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: re: accident focused forum on 11/04/2010 19:27:18 MDT Print View

> http://www.hikerhell.com/
Costs a lot of effort, which means $$, to maintain something like this. Since hikerhell does a very good job already, why compete?

My 2c

Cheers

Lyan Jordan
(redmonk)

Locale: Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem
Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 19:34:36 MDT Print View

If we can have a forum for every Outdoor Retail .... I bet BPL has the ability to make a safety forum, and, stay within budget.

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 19:49:07 MDT Print View

Don't confuse ability with wherewithal.

--B.G.--

Tom Kirchner
(ouzel) - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest/Sierra
Re: Re: re: accident focused forum on 11/04/2010 20:03:47 MDT Print View

"Costs a lot of effort, which means $$, to maintain something like this."

NM

Edited by Ouzel 11/5

Edited by ouzel on 11/05/2010 19:28:45 MDT.

Brian UL
(MAYNARD76)

Locale: New England
Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/04/2010 20:36:10 MDT Print View

Having known people who have been in horrible tragedies in the outdoors I can say its pretty useless to talk about what a specific person(s) did wrong or right.
the fact is the media and even the rescuers/NFS themselves have very little knowledge of what actually transpired. They simply go on assumptions, and even if those are reasonable well thought out assumptions they can be dead wrong.
using real events as examples is usually just building a house of cards. There can be so much more than meets the eye. Yet in the minds of those involved it is a simple straight forward case.
It is better to simply state a problem and provide possible solutions than play armchair detective.

Justin McMinn
(akajut) - F

Locale: Central Oklahoma
Re: Proposal for new forum on 11/05/2010 08:10:46 MDT Print View

I understood the request differently than some. I didn't see the request as "Create a new web site" or even spend more money. I thought the request was asking for a new topic just like "Gear Swap", "The G Spot", or "Make Your Own Gear". A new forum listed on the "Forum Index" page. Maybe under the "Campfire" or "General Forums"?

Edited by akajut on 11/05/2010 13:04:38 MDT.