I was wondering if anyone knows anything about the long term usage of the flexible plastic water containers made by Platypus, Evernew, Nalgene, etc? I have a few but have only been using them a few years. Do they start breaking down of yellowing after a period of time? Do they become more brittle?

I have several Platypus containers. When empty, I fold them up, so they get folded in the same places many times. After several years of that, the folded spot is weak, and a leak will develop. On my very oldest Platypus, the whole thing delaminated. The outside layer of the plastic peeled off and left the inside layers intact, so it is still functional.

I look on the bright side. Without that outside layer, it is lighter by a tenth of an ounce or so.

--B.G.--

While I believe those containers mentioned to be pretty durable I would definitely take the time to inspect them before each use. Fill it up and check for leaks, you do not want to be on the trail and find out your leaving a trail of water behind you.

I am on my 3rd 96oz Nalgene water container. They are made of polyester film, which, although strong, breaks down after repeated crinkling. Simple (two-plane)folds are fine, but intersecting folds, that form a little peak in the film, eventually produce a leak. I have found that multiple pinholes begin to appear at the corners and along the creases after one season of regular use.

The polyurethane bladders that are used in hydration packs weigh about twice as much as polyester waterbags but the material is intrinsically much more durable. A water bag made of 70d heat-sealable nylon fabric would be an ideal combination of toughness and light weight, but I haven't seen it yet.

I roll my Platy container when packing. So far so good. I roll it opposite side in each time.

Thanks everyone. I am still trying to be SUL/UL/Lightweight but I am also trying to use items and materials that are going to last a lot longer. I don't want something that will last next season or the one after that but for 10 years down the road. I think I can still be lightweight while also having my items be durable. I just maybe add a few pounds onto my pack weight but I think I will feel better about it.

I think for the hydration system I am going to go with some 2L or 3L hydration bladder that is a bit beefier than the two sheets of plastic laminated together, an inline gravity filter and either a Nalgene type 1L everyday bottle or a stainless steel bottle.

Brett, after having to replace a number of Platys and Nalgene Canteens over the years, I recently made a similar decision. My bladder is now a 4 liter Dromlite (4.2 oz.) and my drinking bottle is a .5 liter HDPE Nalgene(2.5 oz.) that I use on the trail for gathering and treating water with my Steripen.

+1 on the 1/2 liter Nalgene and Dromlite combo. Love the spigot tap on the Dromlite.

You're not going to get close to SUL with that paradigm. SUL stuff is perfectly usable gear, but it isn't bombproof. It stands to reason that the thinner fabrics are going to need a little MORE caution and will rip easier than heavier options. If you don't get most the items in your kit down to lighter options, you might get to a "light" stage, but not to a 12-14 pound UL base weight, or a 5-8 pound SUL base weight (my figures are my arbitrary estimates).

It's your hike, but don't kit yourself about getting a UL kit and doing things like hauling a heavy duty 2-3 liter bladder AND a stainless steel water bottle. Taking a tough MSR Dromedary 2 liter bladder at 6.3oz and a 40oz Klean Kanteen at 9.4 oz, you have added 15.7 ounces to your kit. A 2 liter Platypus is 1oz. The difference represents 18% of a 5 pound SUL kit or 9.5% of a 14 pound kit! Read up in the gear list forums and throw your own list up for critique. Expect brutal frankness :)

Use recycled drinking water bottles for a SUL, sustainable and cheap method of hauling water. Platypus bladders will last a long time and there's no need to fold them. If I'm using 1 liter bladders, they are riding in the outside pockets of my pack and I hang them in my laundry room with a clothespin to dry. I store them flat when dry. A Platy will last several years, but I think expecting a 10 year working life for an active hiker isn't realistic.

Items like knives and titanium pots will last a long time, but some things just wear out. Your shoes and clothing will be subjected to dirt, sweat, bug repellent, sharp branches, etc. Tent floors get ground into the dirt and rocks. Some things can be repaired, DWR coatings can be replaced, etc. Even "bombproof" stuff gets broken and worn.

Ultimately, light options will arrive and some of your gear will get rotated out for higher performance items. That should be done responsibly and sustainably, just like we (should) do with cars, electronics and other technical gear.

Edited by dwambaugh on 08/29/2010 09:49:12 MDT.

Well Dave, I come from a different perspective. I try to be as environmental as possible so when I buy something I try to buy something that will last a long time. I have been using my LCD monitor for the last 5 years, my computer is newer but the one I had before that was 6 years old and is now my mother's and still doing good. My car is over ten years old (Honda) and probably has a good ten or more years left in it. Personally I just hate buying things that I know I am going to have to buy again in the next year or two. That is why I do not do buy high lofting synthetic insulation.

As for the whole SUL/UL/L thing, I just treat that as a mindset and as a general category and not very specific distinctions. I am already at 8 pounds and figure with a few changes I will probably bring it up to 10-11 which is quite fine by me. And I do expect 10 years out of the stuff I am buying now or I just don't buy it. I have already got that out of my Chacos and a few other pieces I use. But like I said, I don't mind carrying the extra 2-3 pounds of gear on something if I know it will last the 10 years and I am only buying it once. I also try to use as much of my camping gear in my real life so that I am not doubling up on things. I usually use my cookware, clothes and a few other things to do dual duty.

I do like the idea of the 4L Dromlite and 1/2L Nalgene but would have to convert that cap into something I can use with a tube for the Sawyer inline. I also like the fact that with Nalgene I can do my normal microwave cooking in it at home and freeze things in it also.

Of course, it's up to you, but 10 years seems like a long time to expect an item to last and still function well. Have you ever stayed at a hotel that hasn't been updated in ten years? It's a pretty grim experience. Obviously, some items should be able to last, even when used daily.

For instance, a nice pocket knife should be able to last decades with proper care, but it's a hunk of steel. A water bottle lasting time years?? No thanks. I actually had two, 10-year-old nalgene bottles and they were WAY past due to be recycled.

All my UL stuff has been durable at this point. When I have replaced items in my pack, it's because my tastes and preferences have changed slightly as I learn more over time. Most of the items in my pack get changed on a 3 to 5 year cycle.

At this point, there are only a few items that I've been using for 14+ years. I have 4 old REI brand PolyPro tops, two long sleeves and two short, that are still in great shape after 14 years of 4-season use. It's actually pretty amazing, but I have no plans to replace them anytime soon. Otherwise, everything else I carry and wear has been cycled out for newer items.

Personally, I'd be happy to get 3 or 4 years out of any type of water container before it was time to change it out.

Edited by vinovampire on 08/29/2010 10:21:43 MDT.

Sorry, I don't stay in motels, I usually just sleep in my car. Much cheaper and you know where you are when you wake up. Granted, 10 years may be a bit on the much side but I would rather be recycling something because it is starting to get nasty after 6 years rather than having to check something every time before I go out to see if it has sprung a leak or degraded since the last time. But I do get where some of you are coming from and I do still want to reduce my weight but I think I need to tip toe back to that line a little bit.

And just an FYI, I looked at my collapsible Platy bottles and they have no recycling symbol on them anywhere.

Actually the 3L Hydromedary by MSR would allow me to cut a gravity filter in. That is probably what I will go with unless someone else has a better suggestion. It is only about an ounce more in weight than my Platy Big Zip II 3L and it should be much easier to put water into.

I am wondering why some people are using a .5L bottle instead of a 1L bottle? Wouldn't the weight be better on your hip or lower back by the hip belt in a bottle than in a big bag on the middle of your back? Or is it just a weight of the item thing?

I carry my 1/2 liter bottle on my shoulder strap. So much water up here I rarely carry more than that.

"I don't want something that will last next season or the one after that but for 10 years down the road."

The platypus bags will last several seasons if treated well: don't crease, etc. I have and original Hoser system from like 5 years ago.

I also support re-using empty pop bottles: it's not a new plastics purchase and usually a 1 or 1.5 liter Smartwater or other simple bottle weighs only 2 oz. If it breaks, you're not that bummed about it and you then recycle it.

There will always be a tradeoff of durability, weight and environmental sensitivity. A KleanKanteen is probably good for life, but it's 3/4 pounds to store 2 pounds of water...

I've had mine (two 3-liters, one with a hose) for three years with no trouble whatsoever. Whether they cause cancer or not, I don't know. ;-)

Stargazer

More out of curiosity than anything else but why are you worried about a single water bladder so much? Do you not throw away or recycle any water or soda bottles in a year? Is replacing a water bladder in 2 or 3 or 4 years going to double the amount of plastic waste you generate for that year or something? Would it be more responsible for you to quite drinking sodas and bottled water?

To answer your question though I've been using a 2 liter platy for a year with no real signs of wear. I store it flat and where it won't be exposed to UV light and carry it sheltered inside my pack. I expect it to last quite a while this way.

Another great option I've found, that's also promoted by many others, is to save the really tall and skinny Gatorade bottles with the strange looking orange and green twist top. I use one when I need to carry extra water or if I want to use Gatorade powder or the like on a hike. I clip it to one of my pack straps with a micro biner I've tied onto it and just don't worry about it much.

No, I actually don't drink bottled water or soda at pretty much anytime. The water we have here is pretty good and you can use it in brewing. And I try my best not to ingest any high frutose corn syrup or corn syrup in general. I really only drink liquor, beer, water, milk and lemonade made by the regional dairy and maybe tea once in awhile. I am not really a health nut but I am just trying to get away from all of the sugar and sugar like substances. And orange or apple juice in the mornings sometimes.

Gday Brett,

I have had several Platypus containers crack where the hard plastic neck is bonded to the soft plastic sides. When you are using them a crease forms at this point (on both sides) as you use up the water. This crease becomes permanent and a therefore is a weak spot and eventually fails. It has happened during walks and I had to resort to a duct tape repair to get me through. It's one reason I always carry two smaller bottles rather than one big one.

I also had a rat chew through the side wall once. I left it sitting on a table overnight in a mountain hut and when I came in to make my breakfast next morning was dismayed to see all my treated water drained out on the floor. Duct tape to the rescue once more.

That rat's name is Muldoon and he is famous around the Snowy Mountains for his destructive antics. First time (far as I know) that he has added platys to his list though.

Dave,

I know exactly what you mean re. the Platy neck creases.

Just use heavy duty duct tape (like Gorilla tape) on the areas near the Platy neck when it's new in order to mitigate the sharpness of the creases and reinforce the area. No heavy duty tape? Use two layers of regular duct tape or get the tough tape race crews use to patch car bodies during a race.