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Diff. between canon g11 and s90
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Jeff McConnell
(Catalyst) - F
Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/09/2010 17:55:25 MDT Print View

From what I can tell the major ones are:

- zoom range
- max shutter speed
- aperture range (S90 a little faster)
- weight/size
- swivel LCD (G11)
- battery life
- hotshoe (G11)

Anything I'm missing as far as major differences are concerned? I'm considering both cameras right now and I'm trying to figure out which one will serve my needs best. They both look like great cameras. Anyone know how high ISO performance compares between the two?

Edited by Catalyst on 06/09/2010 18:40:04 MDT.

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/09/2010 21:12:54 MDT Print View

The BIG differences (imho) are

NO optical viewfinder
LCD display cannot be hinged
Battery life much reduced because you have to have the LCd display on to take a photo.

Otherwise the S90 is a simplified G11 as far as I know. Think of the S90 as a consumer Happy-Snaps version of the Prosumer G11.

Cheers

Franco Darioli
(Franco) - M

Locale: Melbourne
Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/09/2010 22:03:44 MDT Print View

"High ISO"
As far as I know they use the same Sony CCD and the same processing engine so the difference, if any, is in the lens
here is a comparison
http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canons90/page17.asp

BTW the "G" (I think...) stands for "grade up" , first used with the Canonet GIII 17 , a film camera .
That was the top of the range of the Canon compact cameras in the early 70'

Franco

Edited by Franco on 06/09/2010 22:19:13 MDT.

Jeff McConnell
(Catalyst) - F
Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 00:10:22 MDT Print View

When I was looking at the G11 I was having a bit of trouble seeing through the viewfinder. Have you had any problems using it?

Right now I'm kind of going back and forth. I really like how the S90 is a bit faster and smaller/lighter, but I don't like the reduced battery life and I would prefer to have a viewfinder. The hinged LCD display of the G11 isn't a really big deal for me. The camera will primarily be used when hiking and walking around town (when I don't want to bring the DSLR along).

Playing with each hasn't really helped me decide...

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 01:09:01 MDT Print View

I feel that the optical viewfinder on some cameras is an important feature, because if you have to use the rear display for lining up your shot, you will be using a lot more battery power. That equates to using up heavy batteries quicker, which means carrying more heavy batteries. That kind of goes against some UL ideas.

OTOH, I saw a friend with an S90 one week ago, and it did seem nice.

I've dragged a DSLR along on every backpack trip that I've done for the last eight years.

--B.G.--

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 03:56:07 MDT Print View

Hi jeff

At the left hand side of the OVF there is a small toothed wheel sticking out. This is the diopter adjustment. It isn't obvious. You twiddle it to get it into focus for your eyes. I found it did make a lot of difference.

Cheers

Rick Dreher
(halfturbo) - MLife

Locale: Northernish California
Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 10:37:52 MDT Print View

Yes, they use the same sensor and IIRC processor. The sensor is the reason neither does hi-def video.

Cheers,

Rick

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 10:56:08 MDT Print View

That is one reason why Canon makes their own CMOS sensors and their own DIGIC processors. They can plan their camera features (like hi-def video) in advance and not be dependent on Sony or somebody to manufacture some sensor or processor that may have compromises. In other words, Canon has a little more skin in the game.

--B.G.--

Jeff McConnell
(Catalyst) - F
Re: Re: Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 11:00:54 MDT Print View

- Roger

Thanks. I'll have to go back and fiddle with that. I think ultimately I really would prefer to have a camera with a viewfinder.

- Bob

I've been the same way up till recently. I'm hiking up Shasta next weekend and the thought of dragging my DSLR makes me a little nervous since we'll be glissading down. I'm hoping that I can get away with a P&S and still be happy. I tend to not print above 8x10 for hiking pictures, so I think it may work out.

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 11:12:12 MDT Print View

Jeff, I know what you mean about Shasta. I had to go through that same decision process many times for Shasta. What I ended up doing was to shoot a few good shots of the mountain from the trailhead, and then I left the good camera in the car. All I carried up the mountain was a small P&S camera in a padded pouch. It was small enough that I could keep it inside my sleeping bag at night, and I could keep it inside my Goretex shell during the day.

There are so many bad conditions up there that will really screw up a good camera. Cold, wet, ice, volcanic ash dust.

I could be wrong, but I don't think that there are that many photo opportunities high on the mountain that would make it a worthwhile risk for a good camera. For one thing, you are typically walking around with skis or snowshoes or ice axes and you don't have a lot of extra hands for a good camera. For another thing, you have so much overexposed white snow and underexposed dark rock that it is easy to have strange exposures on all shots.

--B.G.--

Jeff McConnell
(Catalyst) - F
G11 on 06/10/2010 14:15:25 MDT Print View

So I went with the G11. I found a deal on one and after some more consideration the lack of viewfinder was a deal killer for me on the S90. Thanks for all the help. :)

Jack H.
(Found) - F

Locale: Sacramento, CA
Re: G11 on 06/10/2010 14:17:59 MDT Print View

Mind telling what price you got it at? And from where?

Jeff McConnell
(Catalyst) - F
Re: Re: G11 on 06/10/2010 15:23:10 MDT Print View

Not at all. $395. It's brand new and unused. It was a gift for someone who doesn't need it. Found it on Photography on the net forums. They have a good buy/sell forum that I frequent when looking for camera gear.

Edited by Catalyst on 06/10/2010 15:23:48 MDT.

Rick Dreher
(halfturbo) - MLife

Locale: Northernish California
Re:G11 on 06/10/2010 15:58:48 MDT Print View

For anyone within driving distance of a Fry's, they frequently have sales on the S90 and G11. I'll caution I see little correlation between their Web site and newspaper ads, so don't rely on the Web pricing.

Cheers,

Rick

p.s. They also have had sales on the Oly E-PL1, which any G11 shopper should be considering instead ;-)

Roger Caffin
(rcaffin) - BPL Staff - MLife

Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
Re: Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 16:56:41 MDT Print View

Hi Bob

> Canon makes their own CMOS sensors and their own DIGIC processors
Strictly speaking I don't think this is correct. I am sure Canon specify the chips, but I have serious reservations as to whether Canon would actually make their own. A fab line of that quality would cost billions (I jest not), and be massively under-utilised (and under-skilled) for Canon. Not realistic under any assumptions imho.

As far as I know, Canon have been using Sony sensors for quite some time. I know the canon A95 I just had repaired has a Sony sensor in it. Package sealing problem led to sensor failure after 6 years, so Canon/Sony replaced the sensor for free, despite the camera being >6 years old. Very impressive support.

Cheers

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 17:04:27 MDT Print View

Let me rephrase that. Canon has their own CMOS sensors custom manufactured. They may purchase off-the-shelf CCD sensors for the small cameras, but the CMOS sensors used in their DSLR cameras are only used by Canon and not sold to anyone else. When they first started that years ago, it was quite radical, and it cost them more than if they used CCD sensors like everybody else. But that allowed them to control the sensor technology better, and that allowed them to reduce the color noise better than anybody else.

--B.G.--

Franco Darioli
(Franco) - M

Locale: Melbourne
Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 17:19:22 MDT Print View

Canon has two plants in the Kanagawa Prefecture ,near Tokyo , each producing about 3 million CMOS sensors per year.
The second plant was built in 2008 at a cost of US $451 million, specifically to make sensors for compact cameras. The other makes the APS and 35mm sized versions.
All of the "Canon" CCD (S90 and G11 for example) came from Sony.
Franco
for Bob...
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUST14022720070716

Edited by Franco on 06/11/2010 03:15:54 MDT.

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 17:41:50 MDT Print View

Only three million times two plants? That's interesting.

A half billion or one billion dollars for a fab is about right.

--B.G.--

Bob Gross
(--B.G.--) - F

Locale: Silicon Valley
Re: Re: Diff. between canon g11 and s90 on 06/10/2010 22:17:01 MDT Print View

For the big DSLR sensors by Canon, you can get only about 50 per semiconductor wafer, and a good fab might be able to knock out 30,000 wafers per month maximum. That would be 1,500,000 sensors per month maximum, or 18,000,000 per year, assuming that the fab was running perfectly and constantly (which they don't).

--B.G.--

Jeff McConnell
(Catalyst) - F
shoulder strap case for G11 on 06/11/2010 00:34:49 MDT Print View

Any suggestions for a shoulder strap case for the G11 (case that clips onto the pack). It looks like Gossamer Gear's is just a tad too small for it. I'm not really interested in a hip belt pocket.

Edited by Catalyst on 06/11/2010 00:47:49 MDT.