I may have the opertunity to hike the tahoe-yosemite trail this summer in early august, I am not positive if I will have the time, but it looks good so far, anyway, It is a very little known trail, it is not even official, it only exists because of an out of date, guide book published in the 70s, I got one, but it was one of about 4 left for sale one the internet, used, and for $40, I have read that most of the time you are looking for the trail because it is not maintained or well used. It is in bear country, and stretches between lake tahoe and the center of yosemite national park, it is about 180 miles, and I will be doing it without resupply, It will take around 9 days because I am afraid to plan for more than 20 miles a day on terrain and elevation I am not used to. I made this gearlist, with my little knowledge of the sierra nevada mts. and hiking in grizzly country. Those experienced in this area or with this trail, help and advice would be greatly apreciated.
I hope to see some great veiws and great country, From pictures, I can tell this will be much more spectacular than any Appalachain Mtn. trip I have hiked. I am also looking forward to the unmapped portions of the trail, the of trail navigation will be a great experience

I planned based on an estimated 20-85 degree temp. I have read about for this time of year, as well as lots of rain and wind, and for the many stream crossings

CLOTHING WORN OR CARRIED
01.50 Nike Dri fit Visor
03.70 Under Armor Metal short sleeve shirt
04.10 Fitness gear running shorts
01.10 Wrightsock double layer coolmesh socks
31.40 Salomon XA pro 3Ds

OTHER ITEMS WORN OR CARRIED
15.50 Leki ultralight ti air ergo poles w/ duct tape
03.60 Garmin etrex Venture (on hipbelt)
01.50 spectra lanyard with photon light, whistle, swiss mini champ

PACKING SYSTEM
19.00 Golite Jam
01.10 stuff sacks for bag, essentials, & stakes
01.10 2.5 & 1 gallon ziplocks
00.90 4 liter sea to summit ultra sil dry sack

SLEEPING AND SHELTER SYSTEM
09.50 Golite poncho tarp
02.00 BMW hi vis tent stakes (8) & Air core spectra 2 guy lines
05.00 Torso sized ridgerest
15.50 Nunatak Arc Ghost
07.00 Titanium goat bivy w/ bug netting

COOKING AND HYDRATION SYSTEMS
00.20 Tuna can esbit stove
00.20 foil windscreen
02.50 snow peak 450 ti mug with foil lid
00.80 2 mini bic lighters
00.30 lexan soup spoon
01.80 platypus 1 liter bottles (2)
19.70 URSACK TKO hybrid

OTHER ESSENTIALS
02.50 Petzl tikka plus
01.00 homemade first aid kit essentials
02.00 finger tip toothbrush, tp, & Dr. bronners for washing & toothpaste
01.50 banana boat spf 30 sport tube and lip screen
01.00 cutter advanced bug repellent
06.60 (2) Kodak disposable digital camera

CLOTHING PACKED
08.50 Bozeman mountain works cocoon jacket
02.50 Golite wisp wind shirt
05.60 montbell stretch windpants
04.50 Under armor heat gear long sleeve shirt
01.10 wrightsock double layer coolmesh socks
01.50 Reebok fleece hat

worn or carried 3.8 lbs
in pack 7.8 lbs

Edited by ryanf on 06/04/2007 17:28:36 MDT.

Forget the bear spray and save 11 oz. Youv'e been listening to one too many Western tall tales.:-)> There are no Grizzlies in the Sierra or in any of the Pacific Coast states (except for occasional incursions in far NE WA). Just Black Bears including some very clever habituated bears in various hotspots like Yosemite, hence the use of mandatory bear canisters for Yosemite and many of the designated Wilderness areas in the Sierra.
Dr. Jordan will need spray up in the Brooks Range, I might carry it in Montana, but, you won't need it in the Sierra. Really. Now, you have a 8+ lb. pack. and a nice gearlist. Have fun.

Edited by kdesign on 06/03/2006 19:21:09 MDT.

Thanks Kevin,

I guess reading about yosemite bears, And of grizzlies out west made me misunderstand about the bear situation in the sierras. The dangerous bears must only roam up north. I guess I wont need the spray.

thanks

Edited by ryanf on 06/03/2006 19:37:04 MDT.

Again, Ryan---No Grizzlies in the Sierra---INCLUDING Yosemite. Those Yosemite bearrs you've been reading about? BLACK BEARS!!!
oh, you edited your post. good.

Edited by kdesign on 06/03/2006 19:38:39 MDT.

Aaaaahhhh yes, old maps and guide books ... the source of untold amounts of trouble. (in this contect "trouble" can be a synonym for "memorable experience")

Sounds like a great trip, although 20 miles/day sounds like a bit on an unmaintained trail. I'm not saying that'll you'll have trouble covering 20 miles, just that some of them might be off course and not making progress towards the physical destination.

Looking forward to a trip report.

What is your normal hiking terrain?

Some areas of the Sierra are pretty tough - especially as I come from sea level to the standard 10,000' passes in Yosemite. Covering 20 miles on an unmaintained trail in mountainous terrain with that much elevation gain would wear me out.

YMMV, of course...just something to consider.

No water treatment, compass, maps, guidebook? And 180 miles on one disposable camera? You've got more discipline than I do, my friend!

One more thought - How much can you comfortably carry in that pack? 9 lb base + ~18 lb food + 2L water + a bit for fuel may be pretty close to discomfort for a few days. (At 2lb/day for 9 days of food...I'm sure you could cut a few pounds from that with a more strict menu, though.)

Hope you have a great trip!

You will, however, likely need a bear canister. The BearVault is a good choice, but if you can get a hold of a Bearikade, you'll save some additional ounces.

Edited by slnsf on 06/03/2006 23:15:21 MDT.

Ryan,

Can you elaborate on the route? The "official" Tahoe-Yosemite trail is a well-established and well-maintained route. How does your proposed route differ?

So far as I know there are no canister requirements north of Yosemite (and I'm not sure whether they're required in the northern portions of the park) so you might be able to dispense with the canister most of the way by picking one up along the way (southbound) or dropping it off once out of the park (northbound). Perhaps at Sonora Pass?

Jeff,

I am an Appalachain hiker, If you have ever hiked out east, you know that, it is very rocky, and even though it is not as high, here you can still have elevation gain/loss of 2,000-3,000 feet daily

out here I can hike 25-30 miles a day, but I think even with elevation, heavy pack, and terrain of the sierras, I could hike 20 miles a day. But I will probably train over the summer on day hikes with a heavy pack to get used to it.

I consider my water purifacation tabs as a consumable, and my dad will probably carry maps, and compass and guide book, because he is an expert in all things navagation. But I will have a garmin GPS with a load of waypoints to keep me on track

My Golite jam carries 30lbs pretty well, so I am not concerned about comfort. I will be posting a mock meal plan later for you guys to help with

Rick,

I am not positive on the trails ccondition, I read someones trail journal an the internet and they said it was very easy to get off course, and they hiked half the time off trail.


Here is something I got off the comp.
The Tahoe-Yosemite Trail does not have the same type of pedigree as the Muir Trail, which was publicly established and constructed early in the twentieth century. The Sierra Club and the U.S. Forest Service discussed the Tahoe-Yosemite Trail around 1916 and worked on the trail around Meeks Bay and around Echo Lake, but they did not formally establish it. The Tahoe-Yosemite Trail evolved informally and unofficially in hiking and conservation circles. Outdoor author Thomas Winnett eventually brought the trail before the public in 1970 after he and others personally walked, measured, and researched the route. His guidebook contains maps, measurements, history, and advice, so backpackers and hikers can enjoy the trail.

and another description
The Tahoe-Yosemite Trail winds its way along the crest of the Sierras, sometimes paralleling the PCT, and sometimes sharing the trailway for short distances. The trail passes many of the High Sierra's lakes, and passes through the Desolation, Mokelumne, Carson-Iceberg, and Emigrant Wilderness areas. Highlights of the trail include Emigrant Meadow, the "Benson Riviera", and the northern Yosemite high country, along with many other attractions. The trail also includes route finding over St Mary's Pass through high alpine meadows, and sometimes difficult trail routing along Lost City Creek.

one more
The Tahoe Yosemite trail isn't an official trail such as the Pacific Crest Trail or the Appalachian Trail. Its existence is due to a book written to describe a route in the Sierras. The Tahoe Yosemite Trail book is written by Thomas Winnett and is available at hiking stores or over the internet. The trail receives no funding for maintenance except what any other trail would receive.

and here is a link to that trail journal
longtrails.com

Edited by ryanf on 06/04/2006 11:36:34 MDT.

...and the bear canister will be required in Yosemite Nat'l Park.
See---
http://www.nps.gov/yose/wilderness/bfoodstorage.htm

I think for peace of mind (and your 1st backpack in the Sierra) you should have and use a canister the whole route. You could arrange a drop at Sonora Pass to p/u a canister before you continue on into the Park but what I said...

Edited by kdesign on 06/04/2006 11:57:02 MDT.

Hi Ryan,

Thanks for the link, I've got a much better idea of your route now. You can probably get a good idea of the various trail stretch conditions by following a couple of of the Sierra hiking web groups and perhaps contacting relevant Forest Service offices, especially once all that snow melts! Other than outright crosscountry in brush, navigating the high Sierra is usually pretty straightforward. A lot of your trip is near or above treeline, where forest undergrowth isn't much of an issue.

Trails can be rough and rocky, especially where frequented by commercial packers. Sometimes that means a lot of slipping and sliding (and dreaming of horse stew).

Creek and river crossings will probably still be high, and bring the DEET!

Persuming the N-S option, I'll speculate you can do this trip withough a canister at all, presuming you can do the big push to the Valley on the last day. [Famous last words] I've never had a problem hanging my food north of Yosemite, and only carry a canister when headed to very popular areas, which this route seems to avoid.

Thanks rick and KD,
I was suprised to see the URSAK aproved, I am glad to hear that canisters are not required out of yosemite, because I wasent sure I could fit 9 days of food in 700cu. in. canister.

I think for this trip I could use a ursack with aluminum liner and a regular bear bag. for yosemite aproval and lightweight

good I wasent looking forward to hauling that 2.5lb canister

Edited by ryanf on 06/04/2006 12:10:11 MDT.

I live in the Sierra Nevada and have hiked and backpacked the area of the Tahoe-Yosemite Trail for over 40 years.
The first 50 miles of the trail ( Meeks Bay to Summit City Creek) are on very good trails (PCT, Tahoe Rim Trail, etc.) and is very popular with day hikers and backpackers. Expect hordes of people in early August.
The last 72 miles of the Tahoe-Yosemite Trail is also on very good trail (mostly the PCT), but with far fewer people.
The middle 64 miles consists of lower country, some very bad to non-existant trails, and over 12 miles of road walking. My advice would be to skip this section and take the PCT instead. You would have much better trail, higher elevation, and much better scenery.
In early August, you will probably have temperatures no lower than 30 degrees, if that, no difficult stream crossings, no rain, and few bear problems until Northern Yosemite. Due to this being a big snow year in this part of the Sierra, you will still have lots of mosquitos.
Although this is very nice mountain country, it is not the "High Sierra" and is not as spectacular as those areas south of Tuolumne Meadows.

Ryan don't worry about the bears. They usually will run away from you as soon as they see you. Think "overgrown' dogs in a sense. If I were you, I would bring an Ursack but not with the cylinder. I have been backpacking along time in the areas from Tahoe to Emmigrant and I have never had a bear problem,....not once. I was up in Emmigrant this weekend and the snowline is at 8000ft. So I hope that most of the snow would be gone by the time you go.

Thanks Thomas, for the info. If temps will only be down to 30, I may not need the cocoon, instead mabey a vest.

Thanks for all the bear information, I am glad I posted. I think I will get a ursack with the liner, because it is required in yosemite, I am not concerned about the bears, but it would be nice just to tie something to a tree instead of raising a bear bag every night.

that seems impossible really - unless just on sunny side of slopes

i was on west side of Desolation last weekend and it was snowing at 5000 ft - actually was accumulating above about 6500 feet, where I found about 1-2 feet on the ground on sunny side and 2-3+ feet or so in the shade.

just looked at the snow sensor data and it shows about 5 inches on snow at Caples (8000 ft) and 32.5 inches at Blue Lakes (also 8000 ft) so it looks like quite an extreme variation depending on where you are (what are Caples and Blue Lakes, maybe 30 miles apart?). Squaw Valley at 8200 feet has 57 inches of snow, while Heavenly Valley at 8800 feet has only 1 inch. So looks like in the general area at 8000 feet or so, you can go from snowline to almost 5 feet of snow!

Ryan, you cannot tie the Ursack to trees no longer. Part of the agreement to getting the Ursack authorized in the Yosemite and Seki was that the Ursack is to be laid on the ground. I would use the odor proof liner to help. Again the only place that "COULD" be a problem is Yosemite, and that tends to be around heavy traffic areas. Northeast Yosemite is not as heavily traveled so the chance of a bear encounter northeast part of the park is much less than Tuolumne, Yosemite Valley.

Thanks Ken I knew in yosemite you could not tie it to a tree, and I plan on using an OP liner. I do plan on tying it outside of yosemite though. and I am still debating whether or not to bring the aluminum liner or not, it is required in yosemite, But I doubt I will be spending a night in the park. I think I will be fine without it Hmm. im just a tad concerned about my food being crushed. Or being stopped by a ranger and having to pay a $150 fine because I have no liner.

Edited by ryanf on 06/05/2006 18:11:29 MDT.

>still debating whether or not to bring the aluminum liner or not[...]m just a tad concerned about my food being crushed.


I think the other purpose of the liner is to keep Mr. Bear from getting his mouth around it and walking off with it.

If you are not camped in the park...it is highly unlikely a ranger would give out a ticket if you explained you were going to keep moving. You would most likely only encounter a backcountry ranger and they seem to be more realistic about the rules. A front country ranger would be a different story probably.

I still do not see how an untied sack would prevent a bear from walking off with your food unless its girth was bigger than the bears jaw.

Keep in mind also, if you plan to walk late into the day...your highest probability of encountering a bear is on trail in the early to late evening. My buddy got a late start one trip to catch us north of the Hetch Hetchy and was very surprised to come around the bend in the trail at about 1 AM and find a large male on his hind legs marking a tree or scratching or something. They both yelled at each other and ran the other way!!!

>I still do not see how an untied sack would prevent a bear from walking off with your food unless its girth was bigger than the bears jaw.


Exactly. The Ursack Hybrid (with liner) is 8"x13". A quick survey of hard bear canisters yields dimensions of: 8.8x12; 9x14; 8.7x8.3; 8.7x12.7; and 9x10.

Since the Ursack isn't truly rigid and smooth, and has a drawstring and the opening, it's hard to imagine a bear couldn't snag it and saunter off.

I would anchor the thing.

Yeah,

I thought the same thing, it is only in yosemite you cant anchor it to a tree.

I think, I have decided to bring the ursack with liner. sure the liner adds 14oz, but for peace of mind, of my parents and myself, I think it is worth it. besides, it is still 21oz lighter than a bearvault

Shame on me, thats not the SUL way :-)

Edited by ryanf on 06/06/2006 14:11:59 MDT.

that is great!!!!

I used to have an Ursack. The bears (or marmots) will definitely run off with an Ursack if it's not secured to something. You think they put that God-awful spectra cordage on the thing just to frustrate you the user?

Yosemite NP is crazy to think otherwise. Why do you suppose bear cannisters don't have carrying cases, handles, or other projections and are 9 inches in diameter? It's so a bear's jaws can't get around it and pick it up.

You want to risk losing your food, use an Ursack in YNP. Me, I'll stick to my Bearikade. Yoggy and Boo-Boo may roll it around a bit, but they can't take it home with them.

Edited by wandering_bob on 06/06/2006 20:28:29 MDT.

I hiked most of the TYT last July, based upon a plan to complete it in 11 days. Unfortunately, due to hiking companions' injuries I had to bail at Lake Alpine, 72 miles from Meeks Bay. Later in the summer, I hiked the 40 miles from Lake Alpine to Kennedy Meadows.

Based upon my experience, I would recommend you allocate extra time for the stretch through the Mokelumne Wilderness (between hwy 88 and hwy 4), since the trails there were often extremely faint. Thomas's advice to skip this section of the TYT and choose the PCT instead would definitely increase your efficiency. However, I really enjoyed this part of the TYT, esp through the Mokelumne canyon.

Wayfinding elsewhere was more or less straightforward, and would permit 20+ mile days.

Your gearlist looks pretty solid. I would say you can skip the rain pants, since rain is pretty infrequent in the Sierra at that time of year. In my eighteen days hiking there last summer, I never experienced rain. Afternoon thunderstorms can get u wet, but in my opinion it's hardly worth it to bring and put on rain pants just for this. I would personally bring warmer tights for the nights, but I have no idea how warm those 1.5 oz Sahalie tights are. Don't forget the DEET...

We used an Ursack (sans liner, always tied to a tree) and Bear Vault, neither of which were disturbed.

I recommend you have a look at this trip report, which I found very useful for trip planning: http://www.longtrails.com/tyt/

Best of luck on your hike.

Thanks Ben T,

I was thinking about changing the rain pants to wind pants, but I think not taking them at all would be fine.

I am planning on 10 days just in case, but hope to complete in 9. And plan on doing the whole thing and not skipping Mokelumne canyon

The tights arent super warm, but I wont spend alot of time out of the bag at night so they will work in the sleeping bag down to 30

I read the whole trp report you recomended and It has helped in planning, and oh yeah, I plan on bringing DEET and a cheap headnet.

As far as the URSACK, I have decided to bring the Hybrid (with liner), and tie it to a tree outside of yosemite. This I think is the best option to keep my food out of the hands of Mr. bear.

I have made a food plan, that I will post later. I think I have a good list, But It always helps to post.

I have always had a problem with carrying too much, and too heavy food, but for this trip I planned it, So I think I have a good list of food
Cal. Oz.
Breakfast
240 02.40 Cliff Bar or power bar
260 02.70 1/2 cup dried fruit

Lunch
420 03.50 Bear Valley pemmican bar or pro bar
340 02.00 1/2cup almonds or pecans
210 01.50 M&Ms

Snacks
420 02.70 6 oreo double stuff cookies
440 05.00 3 Kellogs fruity snacks
200 02.10 Gatorade drink mix-1liter

Dinner
380 03.00 Top Ramen
510 03.50 King sized Snickers bar

3420 clories
28.4ounces (1.7bs)

It will not be the same every day, But it will be the same calories and weight every day.
What do you think?
suggestions?

Edited by ryanf on 06/27/2006 11:14:46 MDT.

I was planning on buying a pair of cloudveil peak pants for this trip, but I was looking at some windshells at montbell.com and came across some stretch windpants They say thaey work like an ultralight softshell, much like the clodveil pants.
would there be any real difference in performance, they are both stretch, breathable, and water resistant.
but the MB stretch windpants only cost $75, and weight 6.5oz

I think Montbells Stretch Ballistic could be a great three sesason softshell fabric, it is light, is wind and water resistant, and has a 2-way mechanical stretch.

Edited by ryanf on 06/09/2006 19:23:02 MDT.

Ryan,
.0325" 6061 T6 Ursack liner weighs 14oz. .009" aluminum flashing costs $2 and weighs 4oz. Thus outfitted, an Ersatz Ursack weighs 10oz which is 1/4 the weight of a Bear Vault with 93% of the volume. The flashing may not slow a bear down, but it will appease a less than diligent, educated ranger. Any I have come across have been satisfied. As I wild camp when in Yosemite I have never had my sack tested by a bear. Yet.

SIBBG did not approve Ursack when tied due to damage to trees and soil around trees it is tied to. I wouldn't think there would be any objection to tying it to a boulder or deadfall (which Ursack recommends). The researcher's trial with untethered Ursacks found bears moved them very little. See <ursack.com> for reference and also <sierrawildbear.gov>

Violate Park Regulations at your own risk. If any system you use feeds a bear-for any reason, change your system. A human fed bear is a dead bear.

I quit using Sahalie tights (Mantyhose) due to lack of durability. They tore in the crotch after a couple of days.

Post your trip report. Would love to hear how it went.

Cheers, Al

Thanks Al,

Interesting idea. I would do it, but I am sure my dad would not approve.

I took the tights off the list, I actually completely changed my clothing list. I am wearing running shorts and a shorts leeve under armour metal shirt, with a nike dri fit visor amd my wright socks and salomon XA pro 3Ds. I have come to love this clothing system for running, so I am going to test it out backpacking.
and am only going to pack a wind jacket/pants, a long sleeve shirt, extra socks and a hat

If you have a look at this map, http://nps.gov/yose/wilderness/bfoodstoragem.htm of the areas in Yosemite where bear canisters are required, or this page listing the actual requirements, http://nps.gov/yose/wilderness/bfoodstorage.htm, I think you are in the clear on the TYT. Essentially the entire route inside Yosemite is clear of food storage requirements except the Benson Lake region and the final 13 miles from about Virginia Canyon to Tuoluomne Meadows.

Don't camp in either of those two regions and you should not be required to carry a cannister.

Edited by yesteray on 07/08/2006 00:10:19 MDT.

I leave tommorow to go white water rafting with my family and leave for california immedietly after I return so this is my last day to post my gear list I plan to post a trip report when I return saying what worked and what dident

I also posted a food list which is in DAYS A and B meaning I trade off one day A then the next B


Tahoe-Yosemite Trail gearlist
CLOTHING WORN OR CARRIED
01.50 Nike Dri fit Visor
03.70 Under Armor Metal short sleeve shirt
04.10 Fitness gear running shorts
01.10 Wrightsock double layer coolmesh socks
31.40 Salomon XA pro 3Ds

OTHER ITEMS WORN OR CARRIED
15.50 Leki ultralight ti air ergo poles w/ duct tape
03.60 Garmin etrex Venture (on hipbelt)
01.50 spectra lanyard with photon light, whistle, swiss mini champ

PACKING SYSTEM
19.00 Golite Jam
01.10 stuff sacks for bag, essentials, & stakes
01.10 2.5 & 1 gallon ziplocks
00.90 4 liter sea to summit ultra sil dry sack

SLEEPING AND SHELTER SYSTEM
09.50 Golite poncho tarp
02.00 BMW hi vis tent stakes (8) & Air core spectra 2 guy lines
05.00 Torso sized ridgerest
15.50 Nunatak Arc Ghost
07.00 Titanium goat bivy w/ bug netting

COOKING AND HYDRATION SYSTEMS
00.20 Tuna can esbit stove
00.20 foil windscreen
02.50 snow peak 450 ti mug with foil lid
00.80 2 mini bic lighters
00.30 lexan soup spoon
01.80 platypus 1 liter bottles (2)
19.70 URSACK TKO hybrid

OTHER ESSENTIALS
02.50 Petzl tikka plus
01.00 homemade first aid kit essentials
02.00 finger tip toothbrush, tp, & Dr. bronners for washing & toothpaste
01.50 banana boat spf 30 sport tube and lip screen
01.00 cutter advanced bug repellent
06.60 (2) Kodak disposable digital camera

CLOTHING PACKED
08.50 Bozeman mountain works cocoon jacket
02.50 Golite wisp wind shirt
05.60 montbell stretch windpants
04.50 Under armor heat gear long sleeve shirt
01.10 wrightsock double layer coolmesh socks
01.50 Reebok fleece hat

worn or carried 3.8 lbs
in pack 7.8 lbs




FOOD LIST

Day A

240 Cliff bar
260 ½ cup raisins
100 2 slim jims
200 ¼+ cup almonds
280 4 oreoes
160 Natures valley sweet and salty almond bar
450 hillshire far pepperoni pack
420 bear valley pemmican bar
290 cookies n cream Go lean bar
400 king size Hershey bar
200 1 liter Gatorade
500-800 Freeze dried dinner

3500-3800 calories

Day B

240 Cliff bar
260 ½ cup raisins
100 2 slim jims
200 ¼+ cup almonds
210 3 oreoes
140 Natures valley Trail mix bar
450 hillshire far pepperoni pack
420 bear valley pemmican bar
280 oatmeal raisin Go lean bar
510 king size snickers bar
200 1 liter Gatorade
500-800 Freeze dried dinner

3510-3810 calories

About 19 lbs of food

Ryan why the eTrex? From Tahoe to Yosemite the trails are easy to follow and have signs. I would ditch the hybrid part of your Ursack. Even when you get into Yosemite, I believe that you are far enough away from roads, and if you're spending the night withing the park, you can probably fake it. If they want to look at your food storage (and were not spending the night) you could show them where you came from on the map. That is assuming that you are finishing in Tuolumne Meadows of course. Enjoy the hike and watch out for thunder storms. We've had plenty up there this year.

Glen Aulin, which is rougly half-way between Tuolumne Meadows and the McCabe Lake junction (where bear canisters are no longer required on the PCT), has bear boxes.

However, "proper food storage" is required in *all* the Yosemite backcountry. It is not clear than a non-Hybrid Ursack qualifies as "proper food storage." This site: http://nps.gov/yose/wilderness/bfoodstorage.htm could be read to suggest that you'd have to hang the Ursack to comply.

Or... just take the liner. It makes a good stove windscreen, if the weight needs to be justified by a second use.

Thanks for all the help in planning guys, I was real close to leaving the bear bag liner at home but the suggestion for use as a windscreen made me decide to bring it. I hate small wind screens they dont provide enough ventilaton for the stove to work well. I am sure the liner will work great. all my food and gear barely fits in my jam. For some reason I dont think it was designed for 10 day expeditions without resupply, But then again it carries the 30 pound load extremely well.

I leave in about 5 hours so wish me luck

Have fun on your trip! I wish I was going to enjoy the outdoors but instead I'll be at work. Take some great pictures :)

Ryan,

How did those Salomon's hold up on your trip? Any complaints?

Hi guys Im back, sadly I found that my online subscripton has expired so I cant veiw all the new site content posted whie I was gone but I will fix that real quick.

anyway, The trip was great 9 days, 197 miles, 0 bears. sorry I did not think to get a picture CD made when I developed my pictures so I cant post any, I bought 3 more cameras along the trail so I have about 130 pictures, Ill know next time that 54 wont be enough. I was stunned at the scenery of the sierras, there were countless mountain lakes and streams, meadows and snow toped peaks. It was spectacular. and I did not even get into the high sierra. this trip basically convinced me that I want to thru hike the PCT in addition to the AT. I even met a guy that thru hiked in 02, and he told me alot of good info about thru hiking.

as far as recomending this trip to others, I say go for it. It is alot easier to get a permit than the JMT and you see some great country. But I would recomend just taking the section of the PCT from tahoe to yosemite, other than the route described in the book. there was one 18 mile section when we left the PCT, where the trail was overgrown with brush and plants and it is hard to stay on trail, I mean very hard, and also once you are out of the bush wacking through brush you are hiking along a river where it is hard to navigate through around and atop boulders and in some places there is some dangerous scrambling required. Whith nothing to look forward to other than the steepest climb of the whole trip out of the canyon. we met a college girl after we got out of the canyon who had just had to be helicoptered out because she fell and was injured and there were some people who were looking for a couple who had gone into the canyon before us and I did not see them and we came out before them, So in that one perticular section it is easy to get lost and even somewhat dangerous, my dad and I consider ourselves lucky we came out unhurt and with our lightweight packs in one peice.( my dad had a GG mariposia) But for those of us who like a challenge, Buy thomas winnets book and see what I mean.

But other than that the the trails were great.
all my gear wrked well, we had one t-storm the second day and night but we stayed dry.
I am especially happy with my montbell stretch wind pants and jam pack which survived the intense b-whacking at one point. and my cocoon jacket/ arc ghost sleeping system wich worked with a wide range of night time temperatures I had this trip.

and Russell

the salomons were great, no failure, and with my wrightsocks I had no blisters. They are so far my favorite shoe and also my second pair.
they worked beautifully.

the only thing I would have changed for this trip would be the menu

Edited by ryanf on 06/04/2007 17:32:31 MDT.

glad you got to enjoy the Sierra's Ryan!

Ryan,

I've been following your thread for several months but had nothing significant to add. Glad all went well.

I'm about to take 17 days to hike the TYT solo starting 24 September with food drops at Lake Alpine and Kennedy Meadows. It's a slow pace compared to your's but I'm probably older than your dad (age is no excuse so let's just say I want to enjoy myself along the way).

I'm interested in your comments on the Summit City Creek portion of the trail. You characterize it a poorly maintained and overgrown, going on to indicate that it is somewhat dangerous. On another site I read a recommendation to "wear long pants" on this portion of the route. Can you provide some additional info on the trail condition as well as the climb out.

Thanks,
Steve Jones

today I finally got around to scanning and croping all my pictures from my trek last august (Im bringing my digital camera next time;P)

here are just a few of my favorites

**EDIT**

moved the gallery

Edited by ryanf on 06/05/2007 15:18:58 MDT.

just a note.

that sign in the middle actually says
BOND PASS
ELEV. 9800


I put this in because it was the entrance to yosemite on this trip, not because it was the high point. there was another pass over 10,000 feet, but i dident get a picturre of it

and thosee feet on the bottom are mine at the end of the trip. NO blisters, ingrown nails, or other problems the whole time,(my dad did not have as much luck) just very dirty feet and toe nails :D

Edited by ryanf on 06/04/2007 17:24:24 MDT.

Great pictures!!! Looks like an awesome hike. I really can't wait to hike out west. Any regrets on any of your gear choices?

congrats on the trip ryan. i just found your thread. those pictures look great!

quick question. i read the trip report from the two guys that was linked to this thread. they described a lot of trouble finding the trail in several spots. did you have much trouble finding the trail? did you use your gps much or mostly map and compass stuff?

thanks

Regarding unmaintained TYT: I've hiked all of the TYT from Meeks Bay to Summit City Creek and Lake Alpine to St. Mary's Pass. I have a friend who's hiked the TYT from Lake Alpine to Meeks Bay, in October. He said it wasn't difficult to find his way, even in the snow. You may do some route finding from Summit City Creek, below 4th of July Lake, to Camp Irene. Especially the North Fork of the Mokelumne River below Summit City Creek. I don't have any current information on the trail from Camp Irene to Lake Alpine. From Lake Alpine to St. Mary's Pass it's a good trail all the way to Clark Fork Meadow. Once you begin the climb out of the Clark Fork (west from CFM) you just need to follow the ridge easterly to St. Mary's Pass. There was a lone post at the top of the pass years back. If it's gone, just turn south before you start up the west face of Sonora Peak. You'll be above timberline and rout finding is fairly easy.

Good Luck on the trip. It should be fun.

Thanks Dennis,

this is actually an old thread, I completed the trail last august.

Like you said, the majoraty of the trail is on well maintained trails, and the off trail section above Clark Fork Meadow was one of the highlights of the trip. The trail ends in the meadow, so we had to climb up onto the ridge. It required some route finding, but the veiws from this section of the trail to St. marys pass were spectacular. This ridge was very easily followed.

The problems that we encountered were in the valley below 4th of July Lake and after summit city creek, the trails were completely overgrown and somewhat abandoned, and the walking along th mokelumne river was extremely difficult because it was surrounded by rock and boulders. the trail was marked my small stacks of rocks (ducks) be even still, it was very hard to follow. It requried some moderate-dangerous bouldering and bush whacking in this valley. and the climb out of it was probably the steepest of the trip, and there was a large feild of ice at the top, so we ended up having to go around it (we dident have crampons or ice axe) which required us having to traverse the slope, which was fairly difficult and dangerous considering the grade and us not having anything to arrest a fall.

but in the end, It was a great trip. other than about 18 miles it was on great trails. And I enjoyed the experience of the sierras.

Ive heard something about a Sierra High Route.
Im thinking about that for the future, it sounds simmilar to the TYT, just more southern, into the High sierra.

Please check out the gallery from the TYT

Edited by ryanf on 06/10/2007 16:37:41 MDT.

I enjoyed reading your preparation and your photos of your trip. I've hiked all the sections, some several times. I began hiking the trail segments as a Scout in 1973 and re-hiked nearly the whole trail leading a crew from my son's Troop the last few years.

The Summmit City Canyon to Camp Irene segment was a brush buster back in the 1970's too. Before the anti-cotton craze, we were thankful for our long Levi's covering our legs down to our workboots and Pivettas.

Back then I carried a red Gerry pack internal frame with horizontal zippers. It was small and compact and left little room for extras. We were ultralight before it was noticed by the outdoor equipment industry. We cooked over small fires and slept under the stars. We'd use the poncho as our roof or simply just got wet and built up the fire when the rain stopped before dinner to dry out. We were young and it didn't really bother us too much.

I'm glad to see you made the trip.9 days is a spectacular pace.

I have a few copies of the Thomas Winnet book and with the exception of the section from Lake Alpine to Clark Fork (Gabbot Meadow is now underwater by Spicer Res.) the guidebook does a good job. It's now out of print by Wilderness Press.

Thanks for jogging up some good memories for me. I'm going up the Carson Pass in a week.

I'd get one of them platypus as 2 liter - for the extra weight you get a big increase in the amount of water you can carry. Unless that didnt work with your pack somehow.

I am planning to hike the TYT in August 2009 and I appreciate all the information contained in this great thread from Ryan. Are other resources avaialable which I should consult in preparation? Thanks!