Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's
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Eric Carlsen
(cooleric1234) - F
Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 19:21:27 MDT Print View

I have a Big Agnes bag and a POE Insulmat (now called Ether) pad, both sized long. However, I've noticed the pad isn't quite warm enough once it hits the 20's, so I'm looking for lightweight solutions warm to that range.

Is the z-lite warm to the 20's? What about pairing an Ether Elite or Clearview with a Thinlight pad? That would be lighter than the insulated air pads, but would it be as warm? Lastly I'm considering something like the Hyper Lite. I'm teaching myself to sleep on my back, but as a side sleeper I formerly found the air mattresses required.

Lynn Tramper
(retropump) - F

Locale: The Antipodes of La Coruna
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 19:47:19 MDT Print View

Have you looked into the Stephenson's DAMs??

Eric Carlsen
(cooleric1234) - F
Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 19:51:10 MDT Print View

Thanks for the suggestion. That looks like it would be a good option, except it doesn't look like it would fit in my mummy shaped BA sleeping bag as it has a different shape. Even if it fit it wouldn't be a good fit that would seal off the edges.

Joe Clement
(skinewmexico) - MLife

Locale: Southwest
Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 19:59:11 MDT Print View

Use a thinlight pad on your insulmat. And get a WM bag.

Lynn Tramper
(retropump) - F

Locale: The Antipodes of La Coruna
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 20:09:05 MDT Print View

"Thanks for the suggestion. That looks like it would be a good option, except it doesn't look like it would fit in my mummy shaped BA sleeping bag as it has a different shape. Even if it fit it wouldn't be a good fit that would seal off the edges."

With a slight modification of adding a couple of velcro strips to the bag and mat, we keep our bags on the pad like this:

Photo is using a torso sized RidgeRest, but we also do this with our Stephenson's DAMs. It works with any size or shape mat:

POD bottom

Eric Carlsen
(cooleric1234) - F
Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 20:13:40 MDT Print View

Very interesting, I'll have to think about that (and maybe PM you). So I imagine you cut a slit down the middle of the pad holder on bottom of the bag and added the velcro?

Is the Ridge Rest warm into the 20's?

Again, does anyone know if the Big Agnes Insulated Air Core is actually warm to 15 degrees as claimed, or is it even colder than the POE Ether as I've heard?

Jim W.
(jimqpublic) - MLife

Locale: So-Cal
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 20:24:37 MDT Print View

Dry forest duff is good insulation by itself- especially with warm sunny days you probably wouldn't really need under-insulation.

Dense, icy snow is another story. You need good under-insulation whether overnight lows are 20 or 60.

Damp soil is in between. If days are warm maybe it's 50 degrees but it is a real heat sink.

In conclusion, it's not the overnight air temperature rather the ground temperature and thermal characteristics that dictate how much bottom insulation is needed.

Lynn Tramper
(retropump) - F

Locale: The Antipodes of La Coruna
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 20:41:20 MDT Print View

"So I imagine you cut a slit down the middle of the pad holder on bottom of the bag and added the velcro?"

I'm not really familiar with the Big Agnes system, but if a mat is too big to fit in the sleeve, then yes, you would need to cut a slit to expand the sleeve and either add some extra fabric, or add velcro. We prefer the velcro because then we can mate our bags (WM PODs) to any size or shape mat, but either would work. The PODs had the same problem when they came out...they were designed to work with only one type of mat, and wasn't a a very flexible system due to this.

No, the RidgeRest would not be good down to 20F. That's when we use the DAMs, or you could just add another mat to your CCF to boost it's rating.

Edited by retropump on 04/27/2010 20:42:13 MDT.

Raymond Estrella
(rayestrella) - MLife

Locale: Northern Minnesota
re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 21:01:38 MDT Print View

Eric,

I too am a side sleeper. If I could "teach" myself to sleep on my back I would patent the process and sell it! (If you do now can I have a cut? ;-)

I have used the BA IAC down to 17 F but was cold. (I was in a Mountainsmith Cypher which was a 0F bag but under-filled on the bottom to save weight.) In a normal bag I am good on the BA to 20 F, in one of their bags I am only good to 25F max before feeling the cold.

Look at http://kookabay.com/. They make a very warm pad customed to fit your needs.

I just used this year's REI dividend to get a large NeoAir for quilting comfort and have had it down to 37 F on my one trip so far. I don't plan to see lower than 30 F with it as it is going to be a dedicated summer pad.

Eric Carlsen
(cooleric1234) - F
Re: re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 22:12:18 MDT Print View

Raymond,

I don't know if I'll get there 100%, but it just involves making a conscious effort while going to sleep to lie on my back instead of my side. After falling asleep it's a little bit more difficult, but I find myself being on my back more often. I'm not there 100% yet though and doubt I will ever be.

Very helpful report on the pads, that's what I was wondering. I guess if the regular closed cell pads aren't warm to those temps maybe I'm expecting too much out of my insulated air mattresses? Perhaps a NeoAir and a Thinlight would be the ideal combination.

Eric Carlsen
(cooleric1234) - F
Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/27/2010 23:55:26 MDT Print View

Any feedback on pairing a non-insulated pad (Clearview or Ether Elite or maybe NeoAir) with a ThinLight pad on top? It seems that if it were warmer than the actual insulated air mattresses (Ether 9 or Insulated Air Core) the companies would have done it, but I get the feeling that maybe it would work. I guess it also depends on the thickness (1/8", 1/4" or 3/8").

Tad Englund
(bestbuilder) - F - MLife

Locale: Pacific Northwest
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/28/2010 00:10:49 MDT Print View

Eric, the BA Insulated Air Core isn't any good below 32*! froze at 24-28* and returned the pad.

Rog Tallbloke
(tallbloke) - F

Locale: DON'T LOOK DOWN!!
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/28/2010 00:45:26 MDT Print View

I've used my 60" Clearview with a cheap 3/8 CCF mat on top on top of cold damp ground. I was pleased with the combo's performance/price ratio. The weight was very reasonable too.
7oz for the CCF
11oz for the Clearview

Nate Davis
(Knaight) - F

Locale: Western Massachusetts
POE Ether Thermo 6 w/ thin, closed cell foam on 04/28/2010 04:20:07 MDT Print View

I have a POE Ether Thermo 6 that's kept me nice and toasty in the low 20's all by itself. If you were to pair it with a thinlight pad or something similar, I think you'd find yourself in great shape. Sure, it's a bit of a heavy combination, but sometimes cold weather requires more weight.

Steven McAllister
(brooklynkayak) - MLife

Locale: Atlantic North East
BA Insulated Air Core on 04/28/2010 05:00:32 MDT Print View

I lay a 3/8 closed cell foam pad on the ground, under my BA Insulated Air Core pad when I am going to be at near or below freezing ground. It makes a big difference.
I'd suspect a Z-Lite or RidgeRest would work as well, if not better.

Otherwise the pad will feel a bit cold.

Edited by brooklynkayak on 04/28/2010 05:01:39 MDT.

Bradford Rogers
(Mocs123) - MLife

Locale: Southeast Tennessee
Re: Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/28/2010 05:54:37 MDT Print View

What about a Kooka Bay Mummy Down Filled Air Mat? It would be really warm and probably lighter than a Big Agnes?

Eric Carlsen
(cooleric1234) - F
Mummy shaped pad warm in 20's on 04/28/2010 07:54:19 MDT Print View

Bradford,

I don't see any mention of down filled air mattresses on their site, only uninsulated pads. Is that an option? Some specs would be nice.

Raymond Estrella
(rayestrella) - MLife

Locale: Northern Minnesota
Kooka Bay on 04/28/2010 08:16:47 MDT Print View

The down pads are not listed. Just email him. I have a custom down pad from him and it is great.

John Vance
(Servingko) - F

Locale: Intermountain West
+2 on Kookabay on 04/28/2010 08:30:30 MDT Print View

I have a down filled Kookabay as well and really like it. He can make the pad to your dimensions to perfectly fit the pad pocket.

James Klein
(jnklein21) - M

Locale: Southeast
kookabay on 04/28/2010 09:53:43 MDT Print View

+10 on the kookabay custom dam. For about the price and weight of a neo air you he can make a pad that will be twice as warm. The mat he made me is ~ 25"X46"X3.5", downfilled and weighs about 13ozs with pump sack.