Since I'm thinking of starting night hiking in the mountains here in Japan I'm considering getting a GPS unit. I've always eschewed them, feeling that a map and compass are good enough, but since Japanese trail signs can be very hard to figure out even during the day, at night I just wouldn't have the confidence to get around in the dark. So I'm considering getting a GPS unit to help me stay on track.

A friend who often hikes at night because of the Japanese aversion to dogs on the trail, has directed me to the eTrex Vista HCx. Would that be a reasonable and reliable GPS unit to start out with?

Please remember this is Japan so the American mapping services don't work here. My friend suggested that I install software called "UpUpDown", which will have maps of Japan in it and with romanized place names, and which has the mountain paths marked, unlike Garmin's Topo 1:10,000 mapsets. He then suggested I use Kashmir software to upload to the PC... the only problem is that I use a Mac and am not sure the Kashmir software will work with it.

Can anyone give me any advice or suggestions? Thanks!

Hi Miguel,
Have you tried the GPS built into pretty much all the handphones in Japan. I haven't myself as I am not so good with Japanese language but my kids have been playing around with it. Or if your contract is up for renewal you could get a casio GzOne for 'free' (apparently a 'g-shock' version of a phone). It has a built in digital compass and has some kind of trip memory. I think that if you program in the coordinates of you destination then it should be able to point you in the right direction. You can probably make more sense of it than I as the only thing I can understand is the compass function - maybe worth a trip down to your local mobile phone outlet. Ours is on AU, I dont know if other carriers have similar models.

Thanks Stephen for the suggestion. I have an iPhone with Softbank and have several GPS apps in it, but the iPhone is unreliable in the mountains and the maps that you get invariably don't show trails and elevations and contours. Keitai work OK in the city, but they aren't something I would trust in the mountains, especially if I walk at night (you know how steep mountains are in Japan... get lost and it could cost you your life). I'm not sure which GPS units work best in Japan, but I'll continue to shop around. Thanks again.

Yeah, good point. While the GPS would probably work in the mountains you would not be able to access any maps as that seems to work via an internet connection. Also, when I think about, the digital compass is not that useful without a map, unless you are in a big flat field...

You may have gathered that I am more of an easy day hiker than a backpacker at the moment.

Edit: BTW, I have seen GPS units for sale in those little stalls in akihabara, but of course I don't think that you would get an unbiased review if you asked the opinion of the stall holder...

Edited by sa75swain on 03/02/2010 17:10:27 MST.

of course I don't think that you would get an unbiased review if you asked the opinion of the stall holder...

In Japan? Ha ha haaaa! The place where every single review of food on television or in the magazines that I have seen over the last 35 years has concluded: "Delicious!" That's simply not possible! All those people cannot have loved every single one of the hundreds of meals they tried, but every time the conclusion is: "Delicious!"

Besides, from my experience most of those stall holders have never actually tried the items out in the real world. I doubt they would know much about navigating in the mountains.

Anyone able to help me out with selecting a GPS unit?

Miguel -

The Garmin Hcx is a really good unit.

If you are night hiking in dangerous terrain, I would suggest that a GPS is only useful if you have existing tracks to follow. A GPS will always get you where you want to go once you have put down a track (I've followed my tracks out in the dark on several occasions) but it's of little use if you are forging new ground, in the dark, if you have nothing to follow.

Even with good mapping, a GPS has a large plus or minus accuracy factor that could easily take you over a dangerous drop, so I'm not sure I'd rely on it for night navigation unless I was pretty familiar with the area.

The nice thing about the Garmin GPS's is that you can add custom built maps. It's easier with the Colorado, Oregon and Dakota but can also be done with the Hcx (but more work). There are lots of "how to" info for adding your own maps (just do a web search).

Thanks Mike for the information. And warnings duly noted. I do plan to follow tracks and don't know if I'd have the nerves to go off-track at night in the mountains in Japan. Too often too steep. And I still won't give up maps. But at least with a GPS I will know that I am approximately in the right area and not headed down the completely wrong trail.

Would there be any reason to go with the Colorado, Oregon, or Dakota, rather than the Hcx?

> any reason to go with the Colorado, Oregon, or Dakota, rather than the Hcx?
If you want to spend more money for the same basic GPS performance...


Cheers

You see, a basic GPS receiver simply has to figure out its position and put that into some user interface. In the old days, that was as primative as displaying the lat/long numbers and elevation number. Little by little through the years, users have demanded more mapping features. It has gotten to the point now where many users get all caught up in seeing their position as displayed on some mapping database, and they are willing to pay more and more for mapping data that they may or may not understand or be able to fully utilize. Some users have gotten so dependent with their assumption that the instrument has some kind of map database, so it must be accurate. That gets a few of them into trouble.

There is this nasty little secret in the way a typical GPS receiver works improperly once in a while. The receiver does what we call a blunder. A blunder on the receiver can make you appear to be thirty miles away and traveling at 400 miles per hour, for example. Now, the logical human would look at that and think, "No way!" He shuts it down, counts to ten, and then starts it up again. By then, the weird but real situation that had set up is now gone, so the position will be fairly real now.

I've seen blunders happen in normal receivers and in big base station receivers. If your whole navigation is based on that receiver, you might be S.O.L.

Personally, I plan my route on an electronic topo map, then color print it, stick it in a plastic bag, and tuck it in my pocket when I am out on the trail. I'll pull out the GPS receiver and turn it on only when or if necessary, maybe once or twice per day.
--B.G.--

I have the vista hcx. It would be a good choice. It got a good review here on BPL if I remember correctly. I picked the vista because of its battery life, and was the smallest and lightest mapping gps at the time. But the joystick interface is awkward. I haven't seen a dakota in person or read a review, but that is about the same weight but uses the touchscreen interface instead, which may be easier to use, and if you can see an oregon or dakota in person, that would be worth doing.

+1 on the Vista HCX

I used a Garmin Legend for a long time, then upgraded to the Vista. It seems to have longer battery life, does not lose lock (I record tracks when I'm hiking), the color screen is good (although smallish compared to some others - but then so is the unit), and I don't mind the joystick (touch screens are not for me on little screens). I use the 24k topos from GPSFileDepot.

Selecting the "best" GPS depends on what features you want. The Colorado, Oregon and Dakota are aimed at the Geocaching market and have poor battery life and a pile of features that don't interest me.

I personally picked the Garmin Vista Hcx because I got a deal that made it cheaper than the Legend Hcx. What that means is that I have an Altimeter and electronic compass onboard that I never use. The Legend has exactly the same features minus the compass and altimeter. I've found that the altimeter actually adds bad track points on startup that the Legend wouldn't have.

The only thing that is important is to buy a Garmin with the "H" designation, that's mandatory if you hike in trees or canyon areas. The "H" indicates that it has a high sensitivity receiver and will hold a signal in tough terrain. I've used a lot of receivers and you definitely want the "H" or equivalent receiver.

That said, the rest is about features... just go to Garmin's sight and select the comparison listing on a few of the GPS's and see what you want. Basically, anything with an "H" designation will do the job very well. The Oregon, Dakota, Colorado and 60Cx and 70Cx units all use the high sensitivity receiver as well so they are equivalent to the "H" designation on the Etrex models.

+1 on the Vista Hcx. I've owned other Garmin GPS units and this one is the best so far. I concur with the previous comments about the high sensitivity radio. I would never buy a GPS without a high sensitivity radio again. I live & hike in the Pacific Northwest and spend a lot of time under canopy and in canyons. The Hcx performs very well. I always have a satellite lock and get very good track logs. I carry the GPS in my pants pocket and still maintain a satellite lock at all times. Battery life is good, usually about 20+ hours. I actually like having the altimeter because it gives me a good information about how much of a climb remains. The most important feature for me is the track log. I use this post-hike to geostamp my photos.

I'm going to go way out on a limb here and suggest that you take a look at the Holux M-241 GPS data logger if you just want something that will tell you where you are. It's a GPS for people who don't like GPS.

I started looking at data loggers for the purpose of documenting my trips rather than finding my way while hiking. What I like about the Holux in particular is that it is small (about the size of a film canister), light (2.3 oz including battery) uses 1 AA battery (for 12 hrs continuous use), and (most importantly for your purposes) has a small backlit display that will give you your coordinates, altitude and some other information. You can then of course download the data points as text, GPX or KMZ files for use geo-tagging photos or plotting your route in Google Earth or other mapping software. Oh, and it was just $64 US.

I don't know if that fits your needs, but if you still bring a map and compass, but want a little bit more information, it might be worth a look.

Thanks everyone. You've given me some good starting points on how to look at GPS. And I've searched through the information and thought about it a little. I'm basically interested in going as simply as possible, without a lot of unnecessary features that will make the walking more about looking at the GPS than about the walk itself. I also prefer to not be distracted by my gear and to use my eyes, ears, feet, and head for most of my navigation. Therefore the simplest GPS would make the most sense. I thought about the Holux, but living in Japan I have no idea how that will work here, whereas I know the Garmin is well-estabnlished here. I know that I can download mapping software for Garmins, too. You have to remember things for the mountains are not as well established here as they are in the States, so I have to be a bit more cautious what I buy.

I've narrowed it down to the Vista Hcx or Legend Hcx. They're both reasonably priced and have only what I need and no more. I'm just curious what need there is for the compass. Doesn't a GPS, in its very nature of showing where you are on the map, automatically show you where north is? What need then is there for an additional compass? Or, if the elevations and contours are shown, for an altimeter, for that matter? Are they worth the extra $40 in price? Besides, I always carry a regular compass in my essentials kit, so it just seems like more unneeded trinkets.

Edited by butuki on 03/03/2010 10:39:20 MST.

FWIW: It looks like the Holux and the Hcx use the same "MTK chipset" for GPS reception (I was curious about where it would work). I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure that it's that receiver that dictates performance. You might be looking for more features, but it stands to reason that their coverage should be the same.

Edited by dsmontgomery on 03/03/2010 15:32:55 MST.

The electronic compass on a GPS does provide an added benefit (that I don't use) and is there to compensate for the fact that the directional input on your GPS screen is only good when you are moving.

A GPS without an electronic compass uses your direction of travel (via track log) to establish the compass bearing that it displays. If you stop moving the GPS can't locate your direction of travel and therefore can't compute the basic compass alignment.

The error when you are standing still is accentuated by the coordinate drift that you get with any handheld GPS so the compass display will change constantly when you stand still. An electronic compass won't do this because it is not using the track log to establish your bearing.

My thought is that for the money you save by not having a built in electronic compass, you can buy a really good standard compass that will always work (whether you are moving or not) and you don't have to calibrate it.

I use my GPS only when needed so it's not a distraction but I typically turn it on and throw it in the top of my pack and forget about it. If I find I need some course info, I know that I've been laying down tracks that I can relate to my paper map. Turning it on only when needed wouldn't show me where I've been, so mine stays turned on.

+1 for Vista HCx. It seems like a good trade-off between price and performance. You can spend more and get bigger screen or touch screen, but you aren't really getting much more in functionality. The battery life is really good on the Vista HCx in my experience.

I just bought the Garmin 60cx from someone here on the gear swap forum. Looks like it has lots of good reviews.

Yikes! I just went to look at a Legend HCx (no Vista available) at a local outdoor shop here in Tokyo and it cost $540.00!!! More than twice the manufacturer's listed price! I'm certainly not buying one here in Japan!

Well, that's about the price (Stateside) of a Garmin Oregon 500C, which I was going to recommend. :(

I have a Garmin Colorado 300 which is "OK" but has issues in some features, like slow to get the map correctly oriented.