3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest
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(biointegra) - MLife

Locale: Puget Sound
3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest on 02/13/2010 21:13:05 MST Print View

I haven't seen any threads on this recently announced (at Outdoor Retailer Winter 2010) development in insulating layering systems yet, excepting year or more old posts regarding the theory and potential for this. Evidently, after 2 years of R & D, the Champion brand folk have been able to overcome sufficient hurdles in order to have prototypes ready for real world testing presently, with plans or intentions of general public release in 2011:

Aerogel Supersuit Press Release

Not surprisingly (or surprisingly) I have seen no weight figures and only perfunctory, passing mention of the potential mountaineering advantages of it's inherent lighter weight. The primary advantages mentioned as motivation and goals of the development of the garment seem to be fashion and bulk reduction, with the sole functional improvement being increased mobility. Well, most people are not at their most nimble at 29,000 ft., but I can really see some advantages for alpine style approaches and general outdoor pursuits, once this trickles down.

Does anyone have any further information on this pursuit?

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(biointegra) - MLife

Locale: Puget Sound
Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/13/2010 21:24:00 MST Print View

Comment from: a forum on another site by...

"Posted by Mike A - 01/27/2010 01:27 PM

Hi,
I am Director of Research for Hanesbrands.

The aerogel is completely hydrophobic so it won’t get wet and will keep it’s thermal properties under water.
We are using c-change membranes from Schoeller.
The clo value of aerogel actually improves under compression. All other insulation depend on captured air, aerogel isn’t dependent on air and under compression any trapped air is pushed out improving the clo value.
We don’t have a price point yet but expect it to be at a price lower than down for equal or better performance.

Great to get the questions, let me know if there is anything else you would like to know.

drowning in spam
(leaftye) - F

Locale: SoCal
Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/13/2010 22:24:51 MST Print View

We don’t have a price point yet but expect it to be at a price lower than down for equal or better performance.

You have my interest.

Eric Blumensaadt
(Danepacker) - MLife

Locale: Mojave Desert
A coinkydink on 02/13/2010 22:25:14 MST Print View

I was just thinking as I logged on to BPL that we're due for some new fabrics. Aerogel isn't a fabric but if it can be made into durable clothing insulation it should revolutionize the market.

I guess its main feature is that it does not TRANSMIT heat. It should make clothing and sleeping bags much thinner - and much more compact for packing.

Can you imagine an Aerogel/down bag? Down for its draping ability next to the body and Aerogel for most of the warmth. OO! OO!

Now to put a thin layer of Aerogel in a Neo-Air mattress.... :)

Edited by Danepacker on 09/17/2012 18:19:18 MDT.

drowning in spam
(leaftye) - F

Locale: SoCal
Re: A coinkydink on 02/13/2010 22:28:57 MST Print View

Aerogel would be great in the places that give off a lot of moisture. The head and foot box are the first two places I'd want aerogel.

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(annapurna) - MLife
Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/13/2010 23:07:42 MST Print View

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Edited by annapurna on 04/12/2010 18:00:44 MDT.

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(biointegra) - MLife

Locale: Puget Sound
Re: Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/13/2010 23:51:42 MST Print View

Yes, 2 years of R & D, has been presumably spent in order to get a friable, somewhat brittle and unruly material into a pliable and durable form. Still, I'm curious about the weight for the framework in order to accomplish this feat. The material itself weights next to nothing, however, thus far most of the products have been anticlimactic in this department. As a case in point, POE's current generation Aerogel-featured pad weighs more than twice what a similar sized Ridgerest would weigh and it only provides an increase in R-value from R-2.6 to "3.4-7.0". When it comes to closed cell-type insulation, I don't believe there to be significant advantage in increased R-values, as compared to the achievement of a thermal break against conductive heat loss. For the same 14 oz., I would much prefer to have a full-length closed cell pad. As mentioned above, incorporating it into an air mattress, such as the NeoAir would be rather interesting, as would somehow cramming the insulation into an 1/8" thick pad that weighs 2 oz., such as in Gossamer Gear's lightest offering.

The backpacking + mountaineering gear weight-reduction achievement of the aerogels-laced products is yet to be significant enough to earn it's place in my pack. The potential, however, does seem to be there and this achievement by Champion/Duofold's research team may be a step in a more favorable direction.

Edited by biointegra on 02/13/2010 23:56:42 MST.

Jim W.
(jimqpublic) - MLife

Locale: So-Cal
Hanes Brands- Champion/Duofold on 02/14/2010 07:40:44 MST Print View

I must say that my experience with Hanes seamless base layer and workout gear from Target has been very positive. For a big underwear conglomerate they seem to have some pretty well engineered products.

One big potential benefit of this Aerogel suit is retention of insulation under compression. Climbing harnesses and contact with snow (sitting, laying,etc) won't squeeze the warmth out like with down.

They'll still have to deal with wind causing such a thin garment to flap and pump cold air through- good closures at neck and sleeves plus use of stretch materials to keep it close will be needed.

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: A coinkydink on 02/14/2010 08:32:20 MST Print View

"and much more compact for packing"

This has not been my experience with the POE aerogel pad. It's heavier than other pads per R value, and precisely because the aerogel doesnt' compress, packs up big. I used it a couple of times, and it was quite warm, I'll give it that. I could feel the warmth below me. But the weight and packing size steered me to other options, and I haven't used the aerogel pad in a couple of years now.

drowning in spam
(leaftye) - F

Locale: SoCal
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/14/2010 10:47:49 MST Print View

The material itself weights next to nothing, however, thus far most of the products have been anticlimactic in this department. As a case in point, POE's current generation Aerogel-featured pad weighs more than twice what a similar sized Ridgerest would weigh and it only provides an increase in R-value from R-2.6 to "3.4-7.0".

You missed this pad. R-values up to 14. If that's for real, that's incredible. Sure, the high value is over an area with aerogel and an inflatable pad, but I don't care. All I care about is that warmth in a pad that's less than 20 ounces.

http://pacoutdoor.com/sleeping-pads/view/hyper-elite

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/14/2010 10:57:54 MST Print View

"R-values up to 14"

I don't understand this. Is it an R5 pad if not inflated at all, and an R14 pad if inflated fully? How does one pad encompass such a wide R-value range? (I tried emailing the company through their website, but got a delivery failure message, unrouteable address).

Edited by idester on 02/14/2010 11:00:34 MST.

drowning in spam
(leaftye) - F

Locale: SoCal
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/14/2010 10:59:40 MST Print View

For different areas of the pad. The inflatable section is only under the torso.

Doug I.
(idester) - MLife

Locale: MidAtlantic
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/14/2010 11:01:52 MST Print View

"For different areas of the pad. The inflatable section is only under the torso."

If their numbers are correct, you're right, that is pretty amazing.

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(biointegra) - MLife

Locale: Puget Sound
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: "3mm Aerogel "Supersuit" going to Everest" on 02/19/2010 03:24:41 MST Print View

Still no word on weight?

Gary Boyd
(debiant) - F

Locale: Mid-west
Has anyone contacted... on 02/19/2010 07:32:45 MST Print View

Zero Loft Aerogel yet? I believe this is company supplying the aerogel. Just contacted to see if it was possible to get samples or yardage.

Juston Taul
(Junction)

Locale: Atlanta, GA
Hyper Elite on 02/19/2010 07:50:45 MST Print View

I've been looking for a good winter pad. If the R values stated are even close to accurate, we might have a winner. Right now i'm using an Exped 9 and it's an amazing pad. I sleep like a baby. The weight is the issue.

I guess there is only one way to find out... buy and try.

EDIT - http://www.backpacker.com/gear-review-pacific-hyper-elite-sleeping-pad/gear/13414

Edited by Junction on 02/19/2010 07:54:49 MST.

Arapiles .
(Arapiles) - M

Locale: Melbourne
Re: Hyper Elite - breathable on 02/20/2010 05:56:35 MST Print View

Just a thought - how could this stuff be breathable / permable? As I understand it, in this form it's like neoprene.

Gary Boyd
(debiant) - F

Locale: Mid-west
Re: Re: Hyper Elite - breathable on 02/20/2010 06:22:01 MST Print View

Everything that I've read says that it is breathable, how breathable I have not been able to find.

Gary Boyd
(debiant) - F

Locale: Mid-west
Aerogel.org on 02/20/2010 07:45:49 MST Print View

You can purchase Aerogel XT blankets from this website, $30 for a 12 x 12 square :P I've contacted them to see what the weight per sq/yd is, and how much a sq yard would cost.

Actually the purchase is from BuyAerogel.com

Edited by debiant on 02/20/2010 07:47:08 MST.

Philip Delvoie
(PhilipD) - MLife

Locale: Ontario, Canada
Pyrogel XT Blanket on 02/20/2010 08:13:24 MST Print View

I would think that the Pyrogel XT Blanket that they are selling would have a somewhat limited use due to possible safety concerns...I see the vendor posts the following: "Note: Product is dusty; gloves, eye protection, and dust mask recommended for handling." on the BuyAerogel.com site.

Need to find it in a different format.