I got a Garmin present for Christmas and hesitate which unit to buy. I would appreciate any help/advice you might have.

Currently, i'm looking at two units : Garmin Oregon 450 (which is a fancier version of Garmin 300) and Garmin Dakota 20. The price, obviously, is not an issue :) ... Here is what i'm thinking on other attributes:

Oregon 450
Pros: slightly larger screen, higher resolution (important??), 200 routes

Cons: some users in previous forums report as not too bright, heavier at 6.8 ounces

Dakota 20
Pros: lighter at 5.25 ounces, longer battery life, some people say it has a brighter screen

Cons: slightly smaller display with less resolution (important??), less routes (50)

I'm leaning towards Dakota due to battery life and less weight. Since price is not an issue, the only major difference is screen type and number of routes... Not sure if this matters a lot. Please let me know what you think, and also what map sources you are using to download maps, since i've never used gps mapping before and frankly don't know much about these websites. Thanks!!!

A related GPS product is the Garmin Colorado, which I own. I suggest that you avoid it like the plague.

One year ago, I had gone to the store to buy a different model, but the Colorado is all they had, so I bought it. It was not mis-advertised, but so far I have not found one single feature that I like about it. My 12-year-old Garmin outperforms it in some respects.

Mind you, I have been using GPS receivers since 1994, so I didn't exactly just fall off the turnip truck.
--B.G.--

No experience but check the Review Index section of BPL, under Navigation. There are 2 reviews for the Oregon 400T, one review for the Oregon 550T, and one review for the Colorado 300.

Backpackgeartest.com has a single review of the Colorado300, dated 4/09

Also Goggle GPS Reviews and do your own homework.

Elena, let me throw out some suggestions before you purchase a receiver. First, have a very good idea what you intend to use it for. To be specific, if you intend to use it purely for trail navigation, that means something. If you intend to carry paper maps along with it, that means something. If you intend for all maps to be in electronic memory of the unit, that means something (but the tiny display can't show you much). If you also intend to use it in your auto for road navigation, that means something. If you use it on a trail, do you intend to keep it running all the time, or would you use it just a few times a day or whenever you need it?
In general, the brighter the screen display is, the more battery power it will be using. Some will "time-out" from bright screen and go to a dim screen. Some always run in dim screen mode when on internal battery power, but they will run with bright screen if you are using external +12 from your auto.
Some map products can be loaded into its memory, but some of the maps are really good, and really expensive. Others are almost worthless for trail navigation, despite their marketing.
Maybe I am old-school here, but I plan my wilderness trip at home on the computer using TOPO!, and I will edit in the waypoints or mile posts that are important. Then I transfer all of that data to the receiver. I print out my customized TOPO! map in color, store it in my map case, and carry that inside my shirt while out on the trail. That's another way of saying that I put it somewhere safe. If weather is bad, like on a snowy X-C ski trip, I can run the receiver to point me from point to point. If things get messy, I can pull out the paper map and use a compass.
--B.G.--

I got a Dakota 20 for chirstmas but after using it on one trip it wouldn't turn on after I turned it off over night.I returned it to REI and bought an Oregon 300 and couldn't be happier. It is a little heavier but I really enjoy the larger screen. Much easier to touch and drag without touching the wrong spot on the screen.The menus are almost identical so I didn't have to learn everything twice.I also bought the 24K Western region mapping software from Garmin. I like that a lot. The other thing I did was to take a class through REI outdoor school on gps navigation.I learned more on that day than I did all of the other days playing around with my unit and reading the instructions.

Josh: thanks for the REI tip, i'll certainly check it out. and for the Dakota review, this is exactly what i wanted to hear.

Bob: my main purpose for the GPS navigation is featureless or or cross country terrain. I wouldn't use for the on trail travel but rather in the situations where no trail is present and there are objective navigation difficulties such as white-outs, above the tree line terrain, or extensive cross country travel without trails. For instance, i'm thinking a backpacking trip in Talkeetna AK, or a mountain climb, or a snowshoe trip in winter. Yes i do intend to carry the maps. Yes i will use the NG TOPO maps ( i guess it's the best choice?), no i don't care for road navigation (we have separate unit for that).

I've posted my review on here regarding the Oregon 400T for a detailed write up, but I'll suffice to say that it rocks my socks off for advanced trailblazing.

I've used it extensively for activites as varied as snowshowing through whiteouts to elk hunts far from any marked trail and in terrible conditions. The onboard topo is great as you can map out your own trails far easier and when the snow is howling hard enough to blow you over, it's nice to follow a little arrow rather than trying to follow compass bearings when you can't see beyond 30 feet.

It works well with gloves as long as they aren't super bulky and the ability of panning around the trail with a finger tip is one of those things that I wished I'd have had on every other unit I've ever carried.

The 3rd party free community tools for the additional points of interest, map layers, 40ft contour lines of alternative countries and plethora of cool features that actually are useful never cease to supprise me.

It was my understanding that the Oregon unit you mentioned didn't have detailed topo maps in the box, if I'm incorrect my appologies.

Oregon Details:


Dakota Details:

I'm a geek so I like to check places like this before buying. GPS Passion
Forums

Joe, thanks, i read your review. I believe Oregon 450 comes without the maps, and you mentioned a plethora of 3rd party maps available. Which ones do you recommend? is it worth buying the Garmin CD for the USGS 100k topo maps?

The 450T includes topographic maps, the 450 base model does not. It's really up to your needs, but I highly suggest getting the T models. You can always download 3rd party maps (or in some cases "borrow" the base map from a T model, but the technical prowes in doing so is a barrier to most).

With the T model, you don't need to buy the additional map package as that feature is already installed (that's why the T costs more). With the base model, you can buy it and add it, but you'll permanently need to insert the SD card, which means you can't insert other cards later down the line if you ever have need for it (you can only load one at a time on those units).

If as you suggested early price isn't a major concern, just get the T and forget about it, it's less time spent hassling with syncs, loading and unloading files and the basemaps online can be around 2-3GB of a download.

It seems folks were paying attention when I posted above regarding the Oregon GPS as I received a suprising number of PMs regarding the device.

Most of you wanted to know what type of mapping software if any was needed to actually use the device. The device can use any GPX file. There are MANY was of creating these files and they include options such as:

Download pre-existing GPX files for thousands of trails from Backpacker.com, trails.com or Geocaching websites

Create them manually using free software packages - you usually have to look up the coordinates in a second piece of software.

Delorme Topo - Commercial software, but its actually quite capable. This is what I personally use only because I was able to get the entire US for a moderate price. I'm on an older version, but it still works quite well and was less than 1/2 the price.

National Geographic Topo! - Commercial software again, but offers many different options on what maps you'll have available.

Garmin's Mapsource - Commercial software, but Garmin includes this software for free with most of their GPS units. The very strange part is that they didn't include it on their most expensive consumer GPS units. It isn't bad software, however, don't buy it from Garmin.
There is (oddly) a very unusual way of getting it for free directly from Garmin. This works out as the software really should have come with such and expensive unit for free anyway.
Garmin Mapsource for Free!
Mapsource comes with very basic map layer. However in a very unusual twist of fate, you can copy the T model maps to your computer in such a manner that you can upload your high detail maps from your GPS to your PC so Mapsource can use it instead, giving you identical maps from your planning software to your mapping GPS.

Online GPX creator applications from that create basic GPX files from online topo files. These are often an exercise in patience and are finiky at best.

On the device itself - manually typing each digit of the coordinates one at a time - really sucks, but it does work.

Manually creating a GPX file from known coordinates using Notepad and such. Faster than the above option, but requires a certain level of technical understandings.

*BIG NOTE* No current GPS mapping software (that I am aware of) for the computer currently "syncs" with the Oregon units. In the past, GPS units had to have the software recognize the unit and talk to it on a special port portocol NMEA and such. Now the Oregon just shows up as a USB storage device. That is a good thing and a bad thing. On the plus side, you can easily copy files back and forth. On the minus side, you cannot create a route and auto sync to the device. Instead you must export it to a GPX file and copy that GPX file to the device. It's an extra step that simply is not documented in any software or manual that came with the device. I legitamently thought my device was defective until I poured through online forums to find that little tidbit out.

Regarding the T units vs Non-T units. It is possible to download Topograpic layers onto the non-T units, but not for all models. It must have sufficent onboard memory or, you need to go through a lot of technical hoops to create a micro SD that can be formatted properly to host the map layer. Frankly, I recommend just buying the T model and you can play with custom POIs and map layers still, but it has the onboard memory to allow future custom items and still have the micro SD slot for purchased map layers such as driving navigation.

The T model includes streets as well, but doesn't actually navigate per say. So if you need to that option plan on spending an additional $100 but it'll be much smarter to just buy a car based GPS system. As a major perk, the T models have significant levels of backcountry roads marked, something I've found handy when bailing on routes that were blocked from wildfires or blizzards.

Edited by slacklinejoe on 01/20/2010 21:36:07 MST.

I upgraded from a Garmin 60cx to a Oregon 550t back in August. I just used it on my third trip and have finally started to get familiar with the Oregon (It took some unlearning 60cx). I was really interested in the touchscreen, 3D trail view, and the camera (I'm kinda nutty about geolocationing my photos).

The touchscreen is much easier for text input and navigating the map. It can be a little hard to read in the sunlight and can get pretty smudgy on the trail.

The 3D trail view doesn't provide a lot of useful information. It might be better if I purchased some 24K maps for my trips.

The camera is a nice feature. It is on par with good cellphone cameras, but can't compete with a stand alone digital camera. I like having the pictures geotagged photos. I mainly use the photos to create trip reports for reference by myself and others. I just need to make more time to put them together. Here's a couple of examples of pictures I took with it.

http://loc.alize.us/#/user:akajut/tag:garmin550t/geo:51.197633,-115.964127,12,k/

http://loc.alize.us/#/user:akajut/tag:garmin550t/geo:35.759747,-94.285526,13,k/sort:date/

Edited by akajut on 01/21/2010 16:03:52 MST.

Hey Joe,

Have you downloaded the new Garmin Basecamp software? It's free and includes a very minimal basemap. You also have the option of picking a folder of pictures and the program will figure out the location of the picture based on the timestamp of the picture and gps track. It also has a 3D view (similar to NG Topo)

> *BIG NOTE* No current GPS mapping software (that I am aware of) for the computer currently "syncs" with the Oregon units.

This is a problem for first wave (e.g. 200, 300, 400,...)units. I have transfered data to/from my 550t with both mapsource and NatGeo Topo. I believe the units that use the 3 axis compass work okay.

gpsfix.net has some good in-depth reviews for Garmin products

http://www.gpsfix.net/tag/reviews/

Justin,

> I have transfered data to/from my 550t with both mapsource
> and NatGeo Topo. I believe the units that use the 3 axis
> compass work okay.

What data have you transferred? Just tracks and waypoints, or is there a way to transfer NG Topo! maps as well?

-- Bob

Many maps, routes, waypoints and routes can be "loaded" to a Oregon. You can use Mapsource to do this or BaseCamp, which is a free download from Garmin. You can download all USGS topo's to most modern Garmins, including NUVI's with TOPOFuSION. This will cost you $60 or $90 bucks, depending on version. If you stuff a 4gig card in any of the Oregons etc and download a whole bunch of Topos. Topo's are free download. You can also download Google Earth satellite maps as well.
Baz

Barry,

Thank you for the information.

I understand that there is a lot I can download to a modern Garmin.

My question was whether someone who has time invested in marking up his NG Topo! maps and their overlays can get that downloaded to his Garmin. The goal is to see in the Garmin the same thing he sees looking at his monitor showing NG Topo!.

I know that NG says no, because the Garmin map format is proprietary. I have been hoping that, now that Garmin has "custom maps" capability, there might be some sane route. I have asked the NG customer service people, but they have not been helpful

-- Bob

Edited by blean on 01/21/2010 20:30:33 MST.

Sorry for the late response. Email problems.

I was mainly talking about the maps. After you install the topo maps disc on your computer you choose what maps you want to install onto the Oregon in the Mapsource/Basecamp software. There is a map selection tool that you use. Click on the tool and then it highlights the different sub sections of maps that you can transfer to the GPS. Once a sub section is highlighted you can click and the sub section changes color to show that it is selected. Keep clicking all the sub sections that you need and then click the "Transfer to Device" button and it copies the map to the GPS. Hitting the Transfer button also transfers the waypoints, track, and routes to the device too.

Oops! I misread the question.

I have used NG Topo to draw routes and make waypoints in NG Topo and I transfered them to my Oregon. NG also has a bunch of tails that you can download to your computer. You just select which trails you want on your GPS and transfer them over.