I was just wondering if the Cocoon Pullover and Pants are on schedule to ship this week. Any info on this?

I received a shipping notice that my Cocoon Pants were shipped to me a few days ago.

Cocoon pants arrived an hour ago!

First impressions:

1) Size medium weighs 7.2oz. (Yeah, baby!)

2) Fit is roomy enough to easily go over base layer plus Arcteryx Beta AR pants. Plus, they can go under the AR pants with only slight loft compression for abrasion and moisture protection. (I'm 6'2", 165 lb).

3) The waist cordlock is easily handled with mittens. But, it's heavier than I expected from BMW, and could use more friction to hold the elastic cord more firmly.

4) The insulation appears to be minimally quilted to the inner fabric, while the outer fabric hangs freely. I'd say this is an excellent setup which stabilizes the insulation while preserving its loft and eliminating stitch-through cold spots. (Nice design, Ryan!)

5) I was suprised to find that the outer fabric was not ripstop. I presume it's Pertex Quantum, but I've never seen non-ripstop Quantum before. Also, the inner fabric, which should be less prone to rips and snags, *is* ripstop. I'm puzzled by this one....

I'm looking forward to using these on my next snow camping trip.

Cheers,

-Mike

Changed: Received email that pants and pullover were shipped with 5 Jan delivery.

Craig Shelley

Edited by craig_shelley on 12/30/2005 16:34:11 MST.

I ordered a size Large pullover not to long ago, and I hope it will arive soon.

I am wondering what the indigo color will look like.

will it be a blue like the cocoon RyanJ brought on his Yellowstone trip?

or more of a purple color Quantum?

Craig,

fwiw, I ordered last July.

ripstop vs. taffeta:

Mike, yes, both materials are Quantum. We went with the rip on the inner and taffeta on the outer because the taffeta in this batch of Quantum exhibited water resistance that was about 20% better under pressure than the rip. Not a big deal in a top design, more important for pants where you're sitting down.

Quantum is fragile either way, more so in a pant, so take care with them! No bushwacking!

Waist cordlock can be replaced. This will be changed on the 06 models.

Ryan J

have you got the pullovers in yet?

you have obviously already shipped the pants, but what about the pulovers?

Have all the cocoon pants orders been filled?

I received an email today confirming shipping of a Medium and Large Pullover and a Large Pant. The Medium pants I ordered are still on backorder. I ordered on 8/22/05 FYI.

Not sure what the deal is with the backordered Medium pants, but I'm excited to see the other long awaited items!!

The pants (cocoon) look outstanding. I am dissapointed that the size medium only weights 7.2 ounces since the large weighs in at 7.5. I feel this is discrimination at its finest.

I wonder how low a temperature the cocoon top and pants, inside a bivy, would take me?

Thanks for a fine job Ryan

Well I am a happy camper. I got my Cocoon Pants in ther mail today and I just got an email saying the Pullover had just been shipped.

The pants look really nice. I will try them on later. They are size large if anyoine wants to know how much that size weighs.

my pullover shipped today.

I cannot wait.

when I read Michaels description of the cocoon pants

>>The insulation appears to be minimally quilted to the inner fabric, while the outer fabric hangs freely

It got me thinking.

At first, when I heard this, it reminded of a syntheyic sleeping bag I have, which is sewn to the inner fabric and not the outer. So I thought this was the most effective design. but tonight I noticed on a ski jacket I have, the design is quite the opposite.

my question is, what is more effective. for some reason I think it may be the quilting to the outer fabric, because more heated air is trapped between the insulation and inner fabric, closer to the body. when, in the other design, hot air could be released through the outer fabric. with only air between the body and insulation.

any thoughts on this subject

Edited by ryanf on 12/30/2005 18:50:42 MST.

Ryan,

You want the insulation next to your body.

The air space between the insulation and fabric will contain convection currents when you are perfectly still, and displace air via the "bellows effect" every time you move or if it's windy. If you have to displace air, you want to pump out the cooler air near the outer layer, not the warmer air near your body.

Cheers,

-Mike

got it.

outside insulation pumps warm air out.

inside insulation pumps cold air out.

...I think

Ryan-

You got it! You also got me thinking....

Having the insulation quilted to the outer layer like you suggested might actually reduce the bellows effect due to wind because the outer fabric would not flap as much.

Also, unlike say a sleeping bag in a bivy sack, the inner and outer layers in a garment are sealed together around the edges. So, the bellows effect may not be such a big deal between the inner and outer fabric layers. (Hmmm.)

Maybe I spoke too soon in my last post. Ryan J, Alan D, Roger C, Don W, got any comments on this one?

Edited by MikeMartin on 12/30/2005 22:10:47 MST.

how many inches of loft in these guys? Just trying to get an idea to compare them to the warmth of other garmets, like the Skaha etc.

my pullover came today, this is even lighter than I expected, it is kind of strange to pick this jacket up, because it has alot of loft and looks like it would be heavy, but no, light as a feather, this is my kind of jacket,it has an interesting design, like nothing I have seen before, it is wide, with long sleeves, the torso is a little short for the sleeves, but no problem, it is perfect for my build, I was suprised to see a minimal draft tube in the deep chest zipper ,this jacket will always be a part of my layering system for fall-spring backpacking, I cant wait for the vest for the summer. thanks RJ.

Edited by ryanf on 01/03/2006 15:13:25 MST.

My cocoons came today and I'm impressed. Light weight and warmth is better than anything I'm seen before. I will be selling my Montebell thermawrap pants when the medium cocoon pants arrive.

For some reason I received the medium and large pullovers but only the large not the medium pants. I have a question into customer service.

The product quality is very high. Excellent workmanship and materials. The only little thing is the barrel slide on the pants doesn't hold well, but will be easy to replace with a smaller tighter unit.

So light. So warm. Very cool!!